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dipscivic
Hi guys,

About to start ford ownership

I am looking at purchasing a focus tdci 1.6, think its a zetec, the climate version with 72k.

There is a orange led size light that was showing next to the the rev counter clock- but just outside of the ring- to the left of the digital odometer. Next to the '6' of the 6000rpm marker.


What does this mean?? Is this a good focus to go for, generally, as in faults wise?



thanks
catch
[quote name='dipscivic' date='21 July 2010 - 03:24 PM' timestamp='1279721678' post='89296']
Hi guys,

About to start ford ownership

I am looking at purchasing a focus tdci 1.6, think its a zetec, the climate version with 72k.

There is a orange led size light that was showing next to the the rev counter clock- but just outside of the ring- to the left of the digital odometer. Next to the '6' of the 6000rpm marker.


What does this mean?? Is this a good focus to go for, generally, as in faults wise?



thanks
[/quote]

welcome to the forum

I've a petrol Mk2 1.6 Zetec Climate, and do not have that led you talk about. Only lights outside the two big dials, are two red door open warning lights. one flashing light between the two smaller dials [alarm] So no help there.

But what you should be fully aware of with these later diesel engines made to comply with European pollution legislation. Is that they had what is called a Diesel Particulate Filter. This sits between the engine manifold and the exhaust system. Anyway the short story is according to the Ford maintenance schedule, it requires replacing every 75K or sixth year annual service which ever comes first, along with an additive top up. The later top up also needs doing every three year service [repeating] or 37K miles. It's not cheap, circa £900/1000 for the service and DPF replacement and management system reset at a Ford garage. And circa £100/125 for the 3 yearly additive top ups.

So ensure that it gets its 75K full service with a new DPF fitted and the Eloys additive topped up. You often get diesels with DPF's fitted moved on before it needs that 75K service because it's so expensive to do.

how do I know all this about the DPF, well I bought one with 58K on the clock, found out about the DPF, and decided to shift it on before it's 6th year service 4 months hence, with 64K on the clock. And went back to a petrol model, as we only do circa 6K a year, so any fuel savings would be wiped out in dearer servicing cost.

There are loads of DPF threads on here and the Web read up on them if you want.
bottletree
HA HA. You've probably scared the life out of him with that post Catch. I remember when you first told me about the dreaded DPF. I was in denial for some time till i did my own research.

Message to dipscivic..............DO NOT BUY THE CAR. RUN LIKE HELL.DONT LOOK BACK.RUN RUN RUN FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. :(
catch
[quote name='bottletree' date='21 July 2010 - 08:51 PM' timestamp='1279741263' post='89359']
HA HA. You've probably scared the life out of him with that post Catch. I remember when you first told me about the dreaded DPF. I was in denial for some time till i did my own research.

Message to dipscivic..............DO NOT BUY THE CAR. RUN LIKE HELL.DONT LOOK BACK.RUN RUN RUN FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. :(
[/quote]

:D

[b]I've edited this post since I first posted it. It reflects my driving that on average returns what Ford say is the Urban Cycle. Because I don't think the official stats are "real life" achievable unless the vast majority of your mileage is motorway at conservative speeds.[/b]

Well it all depends on how much mileage he does a year? I've made a spread sheet that highlights the difference between running a Mk2 1.6 petrol against a Mk2 1.6 TDCi. Basically with a TDCi you have fuel cost savings and Road tax savings. Set against this you have the additional cost of servicing the DPF on a six yearly recurring cycle.

Every 1k mileage [ determined by individuals driving style and mix of driving] mine would save £45 per annum in fuel costs, plus £65 per annum saving in road tax. Set against this is maintenance of the DPF and Eloys additive top ups. This works out at say £110 per annum, so the bigger the mileage the bigger the saving.

Examples 5k per annum = £179 Net saving per annum
..............10k per annum = £403 Net saving per annum

So on the face of it running a diesel can indeed be profitable. But set against that is the price premium paid buying a diesel as against a petrol variant. So to give another example:-

If you buy a 4 year old motor with 50K average mileage the price premium will be £1050. So in my case I would have to run the car for a total of 5.83 years [70 months] before the collective annual savings cancelled out the price premium paid. So all things considered I went the petrol route.

Price Premium difference was collated using the What Car website @ dealer prices.

Now because the Mk2.5 1.6 TDCi is cheaper Road Tax wise and MPG wise, the savings per annum would be:-

£274 @ 5k
£533 @ 10k


On top of all that, if you have just bought a 70k ish second hand diesel and then learn after the event that it needs the DPF replacing, something you did not have a clue about when buying it. It is not uncommon to then feel you have been personally shafted when faced with a circa £1000 service bill.
hawker
I know exactly which LED you are referring to mate.

the car has one (or possibly more) of the following faults:

low washer fluid level
ESP system fault
remote key battery low
steering assist failure
transmission malfunction
passive key in luggage compartment
interior scan is deactivated
adaptive front light failure
dipscivic
ok been on parkers guide

I'm been looking into the exact model

Its obviously a 1.6 tdci Zetec
V% Log confirms has CO2 reading of 127g/km.....

All 1.6's with this CO2 reading- models as follows:-

1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d (Euro 4)
1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d
1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d climate pack
1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d (Euro 4 & climate pack)


The ones showing on facts/figures list with lower readings 'some' of them have a DPF, doesnt look like the one i'm buying has though.

Can anyone confirm.


But do all euro 4 compliant cars have DPF's, I would assume so as a quick fix to get the rating down.
hawker
Well I comprehensively answer the specific question of this thread and its gone off on a complete tangent without a single mention or word of thanks!
<_<
catch
[quote name='dipscivic' date='23 July 2010 - 03:57 PM' timestamp='1279896429' post='89636']
ok been on parkers guide

I'm been looking into the exact model

Its obviously a 1.6 tdci Zetec
V% Log confirms has CO2 reading of 127g/km.....

All 1.6's with this CO2 reading- models as follows:-

1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d (Euro 4)
1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d
1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d climate pack
1.6tdci zetec (110ps) 5d (Euro 4 & climate pack)


The ones showing on facts/figures list with lower readings 'some' of them have a DPF, doesnt look like the one i'm buying has though.

Can anyone confirm.


But do all euro 4 compliant cars have DPF's, I would assume so as a quick fix to get the rating down.
[/quote]

It can be Euro 4 compliant and not have a DPF

Any Ford parts supplier should be able to confirm that is the case if you give them the reg or Vin number

With my Volvo S40 the 8th character in the Vin number indicated if it had a DPF or not. Fords will have a similar marker but it may not be the 8th character in Fords case.
catch
[quote name='hawker' date='23 July 2010 - 04:11 PM' timestamp='1279897261' post='89639']
Well I comprehensively answer the specific question of this thread and its gone off on a complete tangent without a single mention or word of thanks!
<_<
[/quote]

tell me about it, I also don't know why I bother sometimes. In fact if I don't get hugs and kisses, I'm telling him bugger all from now on. :ph34r:
hillmangimp
As has already been said euro 4 cars don't always have DPF's (oh what a wonderful device!) but I beleive the documents have to specify this. The log book of the car might give you a better idea i.e. if it says Focus 1.6 TDCI NDPF it won't have one. I hear what catch is saying re Ford ETIS and putting in the reg but I thought it was a generic service schedule i.e. it says at 75k 'replace DPF if applicable' so is not neccesarily specific. At the end of the day the car has a light on that indicates a fault, walk away and look at another, there is not a shortage of Focus's out there.
ford focus edge
Sorry to wade in to an established scrap between members ahem ladies :P if a car has a warning light on dosent that usually mean u run about 10,000 miles a second in the opposite direction from it singing the popular 1980's song "and i ran, i ran so far away ..." or is that just me lol.

Surley ford wouldant fit a dpf on a tiny piddling little engine like the 1.6 tdci though fair enough on the bigger 2.0 tractor motor's but the 1.6 is hardly a big co2 producer.

Mike
catch
[quote name='ford focus edge' date='23 July 2010 - 07:38 PM' timestamp='1279909712' post='89709']
Sorry to wade in to an established scrap between members ahem ladies :P if a car has a warning light on dosent that usually mean u run about 10,000 miles a second in the opposite direction from it singing the popular 1980's song "and i ran, i ran so far away ..." or is that just me lol.[/quote]

have you never heard of love at first sight!

[quote]Surley ford wouldant fit a dpf on a tiny piddling little engine like the 1.6 tdci though fair enough on the bigger 2.0 tractor motor's but the 1.6 is hardly a big co2 producer.

Mike
[/quote]

Well the fact that it has, certainly made hawkers purse a lot lighter, so there :P
hillmangimp
'Surley ford wouldant fit a dpf on a tiny piddling little engine like the 1.6 tdci though fair enough on the bigger 2.0 tractor motor's but the 1.6 is hardly a big co2 producer'.

DPF'S arn't really meant to reduce co2, they are designed to reduce diesel particulate's hence the acronym DPF. If DPF's were designed to reduce co2 then we'd probabaly see them on petrol cars as well (as petrols produce more co2 than diesel counterparts e.g my 1.6 petrol produces more co2 than my 2.0 diesel hence why the diesel has cheaper road tax)

And Ford are obliged to fit DPF'S because its an EU requirement for diesels, engine size is irrelevant.
ford focus edge
Yep ive just read up on them now cheers for that i now actually know what they are! lol.

Because there on the exhaust system though say for example you fitted a performance exhaust onto your diesel would it remove the dpf or are the dpf's located between the manifold and the cat or after the cat. Only asking because my mates astra 150 diesel has a miltek exhaust on it and it plooms out black smoke under full load where as with the vauxhall system on it wasnt to bad or is it just his car.

Mike
hillmangimp
[quote name='ford focus edge' date='25 July 2010 - 04:15 PM' timestamp='1280070337' post='89939']
Yep ive just read up on them now cheers for that i now actually know what they are! lol.

Because there on the exhaust system though say for example you fitted a performance exhaust onto your diesel would it remove the dpf or are the dpf's located between the manifold and the cat or after the cat. Only asking because my mates astra 150 diesel has a miltek exhaust on it and it plooms out black smoke under full load where as with the vauxhall system on it wasnt to bad or is it just his car.

Mike
[/quote

I would imagine most manufacturers place them between the manifold and cat due to dpf's working better at high temperatures (to burn of the partilces). I have read of exhaust mods causing problems due to bad sensor readings with the exhaust systems although this has been when people have tried to intefere with the dpf. As regards your mate's car, you say it wasn't too bad before the miltek system. The fact that it was smoking under full load with the standard system indicates it may have had a problem as a dpf car should not produce black smoke even under full throttle. Or it could be that a driving style involving city driving may lead to an accumulation of soot which is burnt off at higher revs.
ford focus edge
So its just because he commutes more and the car's getting a build up and by booting it hes effectivally clearing it though? It shouldant really have any dpf issues its only done about 30k on an 06 plate. His driving style is fast but hes forced into the town centre alot and has to do alot of motorway driving but if u imagine following someone and all of a sudden they just dissapear into a black fog for about 3 seconds then your not far off.

Mike


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