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insane clown
hi all!... my first post..
just bought an 02 tddi estate, had one last year but got written off (long story)
tested the car last week, couldn't find any probs.... picked it up today in romford, didn't get far coz the A12 was shut, noticed while waiting that the battery light was on, (the battery was very slow to turn the engine and had a red glow through the 'window' on battery,) didn't worry coz i kept my old battery,... spent 2 hours in slow traffic..as you do... got diverted and eventualy on to the A12 again, had no probs apart from the battery light, .. traffic was tight so slow and fast all the way, 30mins from home (harwich) she out of the blue cut out,... still had electrics, so i put hazards on and drifted in to slow lane ... just about to pull on to layby when it came to life and went on!... so kept going..then noticed the battery light was off!... but temp gauge shot up...... if i slowed down the temp went down too?!.. i was doing about 80 when it happened, ... got home and turned her off, she was hot but no burning smell... i slightly undone the expansion tank, and it was pressurised, and gurgled as the air escaped, eventualy it stpped and i took the cap off, ...... inside has a slight sooty feel, not oil as such and there is no gunk in oil cap, i topped it up with water.. a few litres... and kept her running as i did so... (battery still no better and now the light has come back on) all seemed ok untill i revved it up to about 2k... it pushed a bit of water out the tank, ...i turned off and sulked...... thinking headgasket?!... there was no loss in powwer throughout the journey, no excess smoke, just a tad when overtaking as usaul,... a bit confused and peeed off as i just sold my bloody impreza which was spot on!!!!...
any ideas folks..sorry about the essay... but want some things to think about before i phone the dealer tomorrow.
mark
H3lly
Where did you put the water?
insane clown
[quote name='H3lly' date='07 October 2010 - 09:08 PM' timestamp='1286485088' post='100199']
Where did you put the water?
[/quote]
in plastic expansion tank to the left .
MrrNoName
cant help you really mate :( do you know anyone with a generic OBD2 reader that can scan it for codes incase the cars registered whats wrong, the engine warning light doesnt always come on, there might be a code stored.
Leemaxd
If I were you I would contact the dealer asap , you must have some sort of warrenty mate.
artscot79
[quote name='Leemaxd' date='08 October 2010 - 08:17 AM' timestamp='1286521633' post='100229']
If I were you I would contact the dealer asap , you must have some sort of warrenty mate.
[/quote]

all cooling systems are pressurized some to around 15psi this is to increase the boiling point of the coolant so pressure after you switch off is normal if the coolant was spewing out the cap then its over pressurised and can be a symptom but not always and as many people wrongly say nowt to do with a head gasket no mayo on the cap and no excess smnoke from the back i would say its a failed water pump or the thermostat is stuck best have it booked back to the dealers the cutting out sounds very much like a vss vehicle speed sensor on its way out
insane clown
cheers for replys,
took it to work today, 15 mile... nothing amiss, all seemed normal, no overheat, no smoke ect ect...... battery light still off, pulled up and checked water, it had used about half litre, and steam was coming out of exhaust when restarted. quite sooty vapour, soon realised there was a leak, see it dripping, back of engine, revved car up and a bit of black water come out of exhaust, i know the dealer jet washed every part of the car so maybe water in exhaust? the ammount coming out of exhaust was not from the header tank,.. but the ammount that had leaked..
anyway got home and got it on ramps, i found a loosly fixed pipe before so i checked it out, all i found was water dripping off the turbo houseing, ARE THESE WATER COOLED TURBOS? .. also has oil leak .. thinking.. craked turbo?... water getting into exhaust system and giving the sooty deposit,?
also on way home after 10 mins driving started to get quite a bit of steam out the back, another ten mins later it had all gone, sweet as a nut,

someone else said thermostat too, waiting for his kit to check for exhaust gases in coolant

mark
catch
[quote name='Leemaxd' date='08 October 2010 - 08:17 AM' timestamp='1286521633' post='100229']
If I were you I would contact the dealer asap , you must have some sort of warrenty mate.
[/quote]

He may not have a warranty, [b]but he definetly has rights under the Sale of Goods Act 1979[/b] But unfortuneately like alot of people these days, he may not be aware of that fact. Well come on the car dealer is hardly likely to make him aware of the fact. Now whilst I have put a link in my signiture entitled "Know Your Rights When Buying From a Dealer" I cannot force people to read it :rolleyes:

But the short answer is this
[b]
Q1. I have just bought a new/second-hand car and am unhappy with it, what are my rights?[/b]

Under sale of goods legislation (Sale of Goods Act 1979) consumers are entitled to expect that any goods they buy are of satisfactory quality. That is, that the goods meet the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory taking into account the way they are described, their price, and any other relevant circumstances, such as the fact that they are second-hand or used.

Matters which should be considered in assessing whether goods are of a satisfactory quality are:

• whether they are fit for the purpose for which goods of that kind are commonly supplied, or fit for any other specified purpose;
• whether they are of satisfactory appearance and finish and free from any defects;
• whether they are safe and durable and as described.

If a product that was not of satisfactory quality at the time of the sale is returned to the retailer, the buyer is entitled to a full refund (if it is within a reasonable time of the sale), or, if a “reasonable time “ has elapsed, to a reasonable amount of compensation. The consumer needs to demonstrate the goods were not of satisfactory quality at the time of sale. This is so if the consumer chooses to request an immediate refund or compensation. It is also the case for any product returned more than six months after the date of sale.

[b]There is one exception – this is where the consumer returns the goods in the first six months from the date of sale and requests a repair or replacement or a partial refund. In that case, the consumer does not have to prove the goods were faulty at the time of sale. It is assumed that they were. If the retailer does not agree, it is for the retailer to prove that the goods were satisfactory at the time of sale.[/b]
braindead
hi pal

i belive turbo is partly to fault seals sounds liek there on there way out .as for the water driping off turbo this could be anything water likes to travel,unless its gushing out water leaks are somtimes hard to find.i remember i was looseing coolant on an serria it was getting in the engine and out exhaust took me ages but narrowed it down to an very unlikly place the inlet manifold !! basiclly old gasket wasn't fully removed when last off by prevous owner/garage and it partly cracked the fixing plate resulting in coolant from engine block into combuston chamber at slow rate.

i would deffo talk to yr dealer asap an turbo replacment for ford engines are pricey(if the smoke is turbo related) i remember an recon unit for my tddi mondy (03 plate) was in the £300 ball park and £1000 new !!!

as Tony said you got rights i know ive gone thought hell with my new focus the first 3 weeks of ownership they had it for 2 weeks of that for repairs.depending on the dealer some will give you cocktail of cow muck about this and that not covered etc or no warrinty was stated even if there isn't you by law you can demand an full refund if you wish for the car or repairs.my bigist problem was my dealer was used to peaple like me that didn't know where i stond and walked all over me untill i got armed with info and soon as the magic words came out of my mouth "trading standards"he was only too pleased to help me.also if you got car on finance they are also liable for the car IE: if all fails with dealer turn to them and they by law got do same as dealer. in my case towards the 10th repair my dealer desided to start turn nasty as in keep the car 2 days longer than needed i noticed it was always end of week to bring it in thursday/friday keep it weekend then 1 or two. just to say haha im goa keep you waiting cuz of repair costs.so after the gearbox repair failed i rang finance to return car as sold as unfit and unroadwothly. in the end they picked car up next day and returned it 9 days later from my local ford main dealer fully checked/serviced and repaired and even took an sum off my agreement as good will guester.

don't spend yr money trying to fix the problem you got rights to repairs just stick to yr guns. also the longer u wait the harder it be.

the water lost and over heating will kill that engine,also the smoke what color is it when it happens ? white,grey,black,blue ??? also does the car try to die if you floor it as to overtake on motorway etc ?

EDIT

"someone else said thermostat too, waiting for his kit to check for exhaust gases in coolant"

i would take it you are talking about an sniffer ? colored dye that changes color when carbom monoxside is detected in the coolant (looks bit like an anti-frezze % tester) ?
insane clown
[quote name='braindead' date='10 October 2010 - 02:09 PM' timestamp='1286719193' post='100483']
hi pal

i belive turbo is partly to fault seals sounds liek there on there way out .as for the water driping off turbo this could be anything water likes to travel,unless its gushing out water leaks are somtimes hard to find.i remember i was looseing coolant on an serria it was getting in the engine and out exhaust took me ages but narrowed it down to an very unlikly place the inlet manifold !! basiclly old gasket wasn't fully removed when last off by prevous owner/garage and it partly cracked the fixing plate resulting in coolant from engine block into combuston chamber at slow rate.

i would deffo talk to yr dealer asap an turbo replacment for ford engines are pricey(if the smoke is turbo related) i remember an recon unit for my tddi mondy (03 plate) was in the £300 ball park and £1000 new !!!

the water lost and over heating will kill that engine,also the smoke what color is it when it happens ? white,grey,black,blue ??? also does the car try to die if you floor it as to overtake on motorway etc ?

EDIT

"someone else said thermostat too, waiting for his kit to check for exhaust gases in coolant"

i would take it you are talking about an sniffer ? colored dye that changes color when carbom monoxside is detected in the coolant (looks bit like an anti-frezze % tester) ?
[/quote]

thanks for advise guys, it's using about 3-5 litres of water per 30min drive, it don't really smoke, slight bluey when i get the 'steam' when driving at normal temp, it hasn't gone above half way on gauge, i don't get the steam for long, once its gone the car is pretty normal, turbo feels like it pulls ok, not driving it 'mad' ...it's getting me to work fine, just top it up, no hesitation or flat spots. starts fine now i put new battery on!..there is a nut missing on turbo, i can see liquid in the hole bubbling when hot, seems the gasket is knackered? .. the engine i think has been out before, all new gasket seals, sump, head, water pump ect... i'm getting more creamy deposit in the oil cap now.
could this be a faulty leaking oil cooler? ... car had not been serviced for a very long time, air filter was shot, air temp senser in air box was very dirty, ...i just want to get everything off and looked at, i have'nt got time yet..and yes the sniffer thing, just waiting,
insane clown
***UPDATE***

had the sniffer test thingy today, the blue fluid on to the expansion tank..... never changed colour!... ever so slight minute bubbles though, but then stopped,.... so turned thoughts more to egr valve cooler, makes sense really now, oil in sump is fine, oil cap has a bit of gunk, but all it's gonna do is recirculate water through the intake and back through the turbo ect..?

any ideas on replacing these, cheapest,easiest to deal with ect...

cheers, mark
braindead
hi mate.

i would get to the dealer and get talking asap, TBH if any water in oil no matter how little is bad news for the engine at best new oil flush and fliter,on other end u could be spending lots of money on replacing bits that not the cause,i know from my tddi that parts are costy in total i spent good 300-400 on sensors and likes with no joy EGR vavles if go wrong are costly too.when turbo finally went i just refused to spend more money on "might be this/that" even from ford dealers.

the fact you said its might already been out with new seals on water pump and likes is very conserning for me ,this engine by sounds of it had an bad life and could be costly.also 3-5 litres per 30mins is ALOT and got be going somwhere, also incase you didn't know but once an diesel turbo start leaking oil into intake u in danger of an engine run--off basicly this is where the turbo leaks oil into intake inturns gets burned in engine and unless u stall it before it get good hold you looking at an engine self destory (i don't mean like an nuke going off just over revs till all oil gone and locks up if u unluckly you might have few small fires too from heat!.and before people say it don't happen just look around other ford forums there been quite an few.

but back to your problem even if u got the money to try repairs go to dealers get it sorted by them its their duty under sale of good act,and if the engine is an write off well you get your money back and not watsed any on trying to sort engine,also the "new seals" how have you found this out ? have you took the parts off or is it purly just from the edges ?.
catch
[quote name='braindead' timestamp='1286897490' post='100721']

but back to your problem even if u got the money to try repairs go to dealers get it sorted by them its their duty under sale of good act,and if the engine is an write off well you get your money back
[/quote]

Good lad Gavin, you tell him mate........he bought it from a dealer, he has been given the advice....is he listening ...is he buggery.
stef123
[quote name='catch' timestamp='1286898652' post='100723']
Good lad Gavin, you tell him mate........he bought it from a dealer, he has been given the advice....is he listening ...is he buggery.
[/quote]

catch,

ive missed out most of this thread, but am i right in saying that if your not happy with purchase from a dealer you have 14 days to return it for a refund?
insane clown
appreciate the concerns, the position i'm in at mo, can't proove the car was faulty when purchased, the car was fine when i tested it for 90 mins, fluid check, visual, road test and rechecked.... another road test on london bound A12 no probs, car is very clean, full service hitory well maintained by the looks, no history admmitadly for last 30k or so, this was second owner. now on 158k gaskets just look very new, looks like new water pump,
The problem only surfaced while driving home after been stuck in traffic jam for 2 hours, no overheat...nothing, i stopped for fuel in that time too, but 45 mins on A12 outside lane 70/80 mph it just went wrong, I also have a leaky pipe, so alot of water loss here, and 10 mins of steam from zoorst,... then fine.

i'm not getting much time to get on top of it, coz of work, but trust me if foul play is evident i'm the worse one to try it on, won't get away with it.
z41n
I have had similar probs with my Focus TDDI - Found that the oil cooler at bottom and back of the back of engine had two pin holes where water was leaking from. Do you know exactly where the water is leaking from?
catch
A guy bought a car from a dealer ......on the way home from buying the car......the car broke down.

Well it does not take an Einstein to come to the obvious conclusion that [b]The Car Is Not Fit For Purpose [/b] as defined in the Sale of Goods Act

Oh and by the way, within that act the term fit for purpose would also mean it is expected like 99.99999999999999999% of cars to be able to queue in heavy traffic without breaking down.

Anybody here consider a car that does not even get you home without breaking down, is considered fit for purpose. If there is well it should not come as a surprise to you that I think your an idiot.

[quote]full service hitory well maintained by the looks, no history admmitadly for last 30k or so[/quote] Do you understand what the term "Full Service History" means? Well it means just that A FULL SERVICE HISTORY, obviously for the last 30,000 miles it is bereft of a service history. What length of time is covered without it being serviced is unknown because you do not say.

So all that said, I would have to question the intelligence of a person who would buy a car with 158K on the clock, that had obviously be abused maintenance wise for the last 30k, by it's last owner. If you ask me the dealer give it a good valet, blacked the bits that needed blacking, whilst polishing the shiny bits. I gleamed, it was cheap and you fell in love with it.

I'm trying to be cruel to be kind here if you can but see it. Read the linked to web page in my signature KOWN YOUR RIGHTS WHEN BUYING FROM A DEALER. If you have already read it, then keep on re reading it until you understand what it is trying to tell you.

Do yourself a favour and read the thread [url="http://www.fordownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=15025&st=0&p=95523&fromsearch=1&#entry95523"]Need Some Help Please[/url] Unlike you Gavin took the advice, read the link went back to the dealer who up until then had treated him like a mug.........short story Gavin got £1,600 worth of repairs to his purchase, and as a goodwill gesture had £600 knocked of his debt to the finance company.
insane clown
firstly thanks again for peeps concerns, 2nd, i have 30 days warrenty, 3rd i'm getting a engineers report on it soon as, i've now put the car up, and getting it inspected, 4th you don't know me so don't even suspect i'm being 'thick!', 5th.......you don't honestly think i'd let someone get away with this?.... even if there was no act protecting the buyer i'd still see that the proper actions are taken..... more than one way to skin a cat, .... my last focus got wrote off, uninsured, drunk, ran from scene, speeding, total of 7 charges... i'd lost the car, but still got payout and him 2 years...

come on!...have a bit of faith, i'm working lots of hours, do a bit at a time, ain't no mug chaps....

i've read the link to rights ect... intresting cheers, i know i have a battle on my hands, amongst others at mo,
the 'dealer' was in romford, not main dealer, just a place where he'll take n px and clean them up, he has lied to me, which i've noted in my 'follow up' it was a cheap car £1575, and found no probs as i said in the first visit, it did queue up in a jam for 2 hours no probs...it did do 80mph no probs.... untill...ect ect...
i always have 2 cars... my missus is partialy disabled and i don't risk nothing... it's a very expensive life at mo.. and don't get much help... hence i'm working up to 70 hours a week..

i really don't want to go into detail about prblems if you know what i mean... i'm just an unlucky guy at mo. trying to get by and help the missus... and our 3 jack russells who at the mo don't enjoy sitting in a ford KA :( ... my reason for getting another estate ..and hopfully we get all clear to have kids... no good in a ford KA or the impreza i just got rid of.... finished :D
insane clown
[quote name='z41n' timestamp='1286975934' post='100823']
I have had similar probs with my Focus TDDI - Found that the oil cooler at bottom and back of the back of engine had two pin holes where water was leaking from. Do you know exactly where the water is leaking from?
[/quote]
it seems the water is coming from egr cooler, and drips down turbo and exhaust.... when hot you can't see it obviously, but my main problem is that the cooler has shot inside, leaking straight in to intake.. it's due to be stripped down too sort it. and get a report on what else could be wrong,... time is my problem too!! .....

what sort of probs were you getting mate?... use Private Message if you like so the thread don't get too long ;)


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