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Full Version: Crank Can Only Be Turned ~120 Degrees
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Carl0s
So, i started my engine change today. Pulled the old engine out, (came out realy nicely from the bottom) and started to strip all the accessories from the old engine, and install them to the new engine.

When i got to the point where i needed to install the timing belt, things got wierd. I turned the the camshaft to the timing point, and secured it whit the locking pin, but when i started tu turn the crankshaft, it moved a bit, and then hitted wood. Tried to rotate it another direction, and same. you can turn the crankshaft timing mark between ~11 a clock and ~7 a clock whitout any problem, but when it hits 11 or 7, it just hits wood.


What could it be?! I took the oilpan out, cylinder number 2 & 3 move ~2cm from the bottom position upwards, and 1 & 4 are moving downwards so they cant hit the valves... There is not anything else then oilpump connected to the crankshaft atm, but i highly doubt that it would cause it.
dezwez
you cant turn the engine over with the locking pin still in
th engine
Carl0s
I cant insert the locking pin to the crankshaft since i cant turn the timing mark all they way up... Or what do you mean?
dezwez
have you lock the engine with the steel bar that goes on the end of the
camshaft if so you need to remove it so it turns all the way around the pin that goes in the side of the engine
will only go in when it line up (ie) Top dead center
yours might be diffrent from mine as mine is petrol 52 reg
Carl0s
Nope, i have no "official" locking tools, but haynes manual stated that you can lock the camshaft in place using 5mm drill, and the crankshaft using 8mm drill.

Just to make sure we are on same page, the engine im working on was bought as a "replacement unit" so there was no timing belt or anything installed on it, So the cam and the crank are not connected, and they should both be able to spin independently, the cam does but the crank wount...
dezwez
i had that on a engine once and it turned out to be one
of the end shell bearing on the contection rod had slip and was jaming it
just a though
Carl0s
Hope, i lefted some diesel in the cylinders for over night. The engine is 30k km driven (~20k miles) but i dont know how long it has been on storage. So, the best bet i got was that if there is some oxidation on the cylinder walls that gets stuck... :/


Just to be sure, there is no place anywhere where you could screw in some lockingbolt that would lock the cranks counterbalance or something like that ?
dezwez
if it had no belt on are you sure no one has turn it as the valve may have gone though the piston
or they may be getting stuck on open valves did it turn fully when you got it. you might have bought a bad one
stef123
[quote name='Carl0s' timestamp='1360958891' post='236135']
Nope, i have no "official" locking tools, but haynes manual stated that you can lock the camshaft in place using 5mm drill, and the crankshaft using 8mm drill.

Just to make sure we are on same page, the engine im working on was bought as a "replacement unit" so there was no timing belt or anything installed on it, So the cam and the crank are not connected, and they should both be able to spin independently, the cam does but the crank wount...
[/quote]

are you sure the pistons are not making contact with the valves? with there being no belt, this sounds like what happening
Carl0s
the point where the crank freeze is, when the 1&4:th cylinder are moving downwards from the tdc, and 2&3 are moving up from the btc...
stef123
have you tried turning the cam shafts until both the inlet and exhaust are fully closed?
dezwez
have you tryed to turn the cams at the same time to see if it moves more
dezwez
snap //stef123 :)
Carl0s
yeap, when the crank gets stuck, you can spin the camshafts whitout any effect to the crankshaft...
dezwez
i would take a look at the end shells cant think of anything else it could be as i said
i had this on a engine few years back and it would only turn so far
before sticking
Carl0s
Sorry, im not familiar whit the term "end shell", what it is?

thanks :)
dezwez
the rods that conect the pistons to the crank shaft have a cap on them when you unbolt them
thats what i
call end shell some call them bearing shell
stef123
[quote name='dezwez' timestamp='1360963999' post='236183']
the rods that conect the pistons to the crank shaft have a cap on them when you unbolt them
thats what i
call end shell some call them bearing shell
[/quote]

big end bearings
dezwez
[quote name='stef123' timestamp='1360964182' post='236185']
big end bearings
[/quote] thats the name i was trying to think of thanks
Carl0s
Yeah, i know them as big end bearings :)

Need to take a look at them tomorrow, is there anything specific i should be looking at? Or is it more of a case misallighment?
dezwez
case of misallighment. On the engine i had it had come out of place and was worn we
renewed all of them but it wernt cheep
let us no how you get on.If its a replacement engine see if they will change it for you all the best dez
Carl0s
hmm... So it wount be as simple as open them and refit them properly?

This is starting to be bit bad, the car is currently whitout a engine, and having a car is essential in my line of work... And its weekend, so getting any spare parts is realy difficult :(

Well, need to take a look, fortunately, i still got the the old engine right next to the new, so if it goes badly south, i guess i could take the big end bearing from the old engine, and put the new engine together. Then go poke the spare engine dealer for new bearings, drop the oilpan and change the bearings later? By this way, i would get the car running during this weekend, but... They gave 3months waranty for the engine, so i dont know how much "fidling" from my side they do accept... :/
Carl0s
Just to be sure: There is no locking bolt that you screw to the engine block, that locks the cranks counterbalances? Only the locking pins that you push trough the crank pulley?
STEADS
you say you have left diesel in the cylinders why and how much not wanting to sound funny but are you sure your just not feeling compression when you say it locks with it being a diesl as well should imagine theres a lot more compression than when you turn a petrol engine just a thought .
Carl0s
[quote name='STEADS' timestamp='1361037698' post='236339']
you say you have left diesel in the cylinders why and how much not wanting to sound funny but are you sure your just not feeling compression when you say it locks with it being a diesl as well should imagine theres a lot more compression than when you turn a petrol engine just a thought .
[/quote]

I had the injectors out, so there is no compression :) And i left the diesel in the cylinders just before i was done for the day. And it did the trick. Went back on the today, and the crank spun freely, got all the accessories installed today, so tomorrow i just need to lift the new engine in place, and hope for the best :)


Btw, just out of curiosity, why is there timing mark on the high preasure pump? That would make sense if it was old dieselt, where the ignition timing was done by the pump, but on commonrail when the pump just pumps high preasure fuel, witch is divided by commonrail, and timing done by the injectors, i cant see reason why it needs to be synced whit the crank / cam :/ (ofc i did time it but made me wonder)


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