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Welsh Steve

Guys please help

 

My mileage is 135,000,

i do 80 Mile a day, 90% motorway.

for months whilst m/way crusing it hesitates on acceleraton ie. from 60-70mph in 6th  (not all the time)

 

Now it is very sluggish up to 2,200 rpm then it pulls like a train,

When driving in 30-40 mph Limits i have to keep above 2000rpm,

When cold, without loads of revs stalling is becoming a problem.

All symptoms are getting gradualy worse.

Serviced regularly, (have to get to work)

last month i added a can of 244,  witch cured similar symptoms on my wifes Focus but did nothtng to mine

 

I bought some EGR cleaner on the way home today but i cant find my Haynes Bible,

Where is the EGR on my   Mondao Edge Tdci 140 Estate?

if pipes in this system split, witch are the usual suspects and where do they run?

Once cleaned in it best to blank off the EGR?

Any other ideas???

 

FOCA

The EGR valve could be leaking, but - 

 

Over time the inlet manifold gets choked up with carbon from the EGR valve and oily residue from the breather -

 

this mixes together and forms an oily gloop  

 

spraying cleaner in is of limited or no use and the manifold really needs to be taken off and cleaned properly (this is not part of the service shedule, but should be)

 

The CAT and DPF(if fitted) can also get choked up, - especially if used for short journeys - a good "italian tune up" helps (a proper one) - my persolal veiw is the only good DPF is a deleted/ gutted one  

 

The symptoms you describe are technically the turbo not reaching its boost threshhold but is normally described as turbo lag -  

 

The mk4 was designed with "lag" built in to reduce the torque at low revs to protect the DMF - it never really had a lot of power/ torque under 2k, even when it was new -  (see the shape of the torque curve - torque drops off dramatically under 2k) -

 

http://www.mybluefin.co.uk/curves/2007Mondeo2.0TDCi.pdf

 

The weight of the car and the high gearing does not help either

 

Blanking the EGR would help but the EML is liable to come on,

 

A fresh air filter every 6k/  6 months will help (or K&N cartrige filter)  (the recommended intervals are ridiculusly long)

 

Ultimately a (premium) tuning box will give you a lot more bottom end power

 

stock there is only really useful "power" between 2 - 3.5k  

stooge75

your injectors (most likely one anyway,i'd say)

Welsh Steve

New Air filter fitted,  Little better

Tried to get EGR off but unable to remove rear/btm Allen bolt. EGR & metal pipe clean, Valve opperates OK,

Loads of gunk removed from inlet manifold without removing it from head.

Now
found manual. If removing manifold is it nesisary (close) to change the
cam senser as it states in the book & how much are they?

I thaught i would try cleaning before replacing parts.

Stooge75 How can a leyman test injectors if you recon they may be suspect ?

stooge75

cam sensors arent expensive,but if youre going to buy 1,buy a Ford one(still not too dear)

injector testing?you cant really. its best left to diesel specialist.anything injector or fuel related is best left to a diesel fuel specialist(if its a diesel),or a good mechanic thats got a bit a savvy & who's not going to fleece you.

really if i were you,I'd be hooking the car up to diagnostics to see what your boost,MAF,MAP readings are 1st,if you have a diagnostics kit/live data reader. Failing this,take it to someone who knows diesels mate. Youre just going to chase red-herrings trying it yourself(been there done it)

jynxy

Hi, i know this is a mondeo and i have a focus, but is there any software that i can use with my elm327 cable to check the readings and what range they should be ?

 

Thanks

stooge75

yeah lots mate. but i tend to go for Forscan,scanmaster etc.

i also have engine-link & dash-command on my iphone to use with bluetooth elm interface.

your readings i dont really know what they'd be on a focus. there's sites online that'd be able to tell you what they should read etc. im registered with Auto-professionals.co.uk,but think they're not accepting any new registrations.

really you need to find someone with a lot of knowledge on diesel focus's,& what readings should be. no-one on focus (foca) know?

i suppose they'd be similar to mondeo's etc. important readings are fuel-pump pressure,maf/map pressure

i still think you'd be better taking it to a diesel specialist who's got the proper diagnostics kit to find out exactly whats wrong.A lot of things are linked on these cars,like EGR,MAF,MAP & just when you think you've found the problem,it can be linked to something else.

FOCA

Hi, i know this is a mondeo and i have a focus, but is there any software that i can use with my elm327 cable to check the readings and what range they should be ?

 

Thanks

Yes - you can use the F-super, it has most of the Ford protocols, it is available online

stooge75
He's needing software for his elm cable
FOCA

An Android smart phone, bluetooth- enabled, running Torque  the Bluetooth/ OBD adapptor must have the Ford protocols

 

Ford uses SAE J1850 PWM (most adaptors will be multi - protocol but some do not - i have come across compatibility problems or the adaptors not having the Ford protocols eg- don't assume the adaptor is compatible)

 

Some information on protocols :-

 

http://www.obdtester.com/obd2_protocols

 

 

 

You can get Dash Command for the i-phone, but that is expensive (there is a free downloadable version of Torque if you have an Android smartphone)    

 

F-Super is available online, from about £20 with OBD11 cable included

stooge75

Fsuper IS the obd cable though. 

jeebowhite

I had both, a cacked out EGR and a split intercooler pipe.

 

I have the CMAX auto ('7 speed' gearbox in essence) and had the same sort of issue, where the car was hesitant around the 60 mark at low revs, the EGR blanking plate certainly helped a lot. I have now (yesterday) replaced my cracked intercooler pipe, and today the car seems much better, no smoke when flooring it, but more specifically, no hesitation when moving.

FOCA

I had both, a cacked out EGR and a split intercooler pipe.

 

I have the CMAX auto ('7 speed' gearbox in essence) and had the same sort of issue, where the car was hesitant around the 60 mark at low revs, the EGR blanking plate certainly helped a lot. I have now (yesterday) replaced my cracked intercooler pipe, and today the car seems much better, no smoke when flooring it, but more specifically, no hesitation when moving.

Glad to haer you got it sorted and the EGR blank is working well after recommnding it to everyone on the forum  

 

If you reset your ECU your engine may run even better, as it will have become "accustomed" to the way it was, and now the boost hose is repaired you will be getting your "full" boost, without leaks, an ECU reset will help optomise the engine for the way it is now - the ECU is reset by disconnecting the battery for 1/2 an hour, watch you don't loose your radio code, though

 

With the new(ish) air filter, boost hose sorted, EGR blanked and with the ECU reset, i can imagine it would feel like a "different car"   now all you need is a tuning box or remap :lol:

 

And an inlet manifold cleanout....

 

And a terraclean...

 

And does your have a DPF? (just kidding)

stooge75

which intercooler pipe was cracked mate?just curious

Welsh Steve

WHAT A RESULT, off to a family gathering yesterday, car full of wife, kids & dog.

Lost all power, car in "limp home mode" managed to get to next services on MWay.

Wife & Daughter headed for loo and met RAC man whilst i was on the phone to Control centre. Fitter pulled up alongside whilst i was still on the phone & got the job pinned to him. "I used to work for some French car maker Ren^&*t that use the same engines" he said.

2 min later he said " It's your EGR valve Sir, I have a blanking plate here." 3 min later, fitted then test drive & job booked off.

Breakedown to back on road 20-30 min I LOVE THE GUY!!!

NOW

NO hesitation at speed on motorway. Pull away in 1st without any thottle up hill & get up to 3rd without throttle on the flat, power from 1200 rpm.

It's like having a new car, even though there is 137,000 on the clock.

Must unplug the Battery for 30 Min tomorrow to remap.

Thanks for all uour help and advice Guys, i wish i had just blanked the bloodything off last month.

FOCA

You reset the ECU by disconnecting the battery - a remap is a different thing - be careful you don't lose your radio code

 

I am very "pro" blanking the EGR, in my opinion, the EGR system should not have been fitted in the 1st place, unfortunately, your car is one of the ones that the EML (Engine Management Light) comes on (sooner or later) when you fit a solid EGR blanking plate

 

Some motorists prefer to run with the solid plate and reset their fault codes regularily with a code reader     

Welsh Steve

if i drill a few holes in it will the EML stay off

stooge75
No.eventually itll come on. Wont put it into limp mode though
When i did mines with a 10mm hole eml came on eventually.
Or you can cover over the eml bulb & just drive it & read your fault codes every now & then to make sure you only have p0401/0405 egr circ low
FOCA

if i drill a few holes in it will the EML stay off

Possibly - but drilling the plate is a waste of time as it defeats the purpose of the plate

 

A solid plate will "fix" a faulty or leaking EGR valve by disabling it  - one with a hole needs to be used with a working EGR valve  

 

A solid plate completely shuts off the carbon/ exhaust outlet from entiering the inlet - so the inlet stays clean, engine picks up better, a drilled plate only cuts it down slightly - so does not work as well  

 

My advice - best option - fit a solid plate and reset your EML now and again, or,  dont fit a plate at all - a drilled plate is a waste of time and the EML may still even come on with the reduced flow on some cars anyway  (so its allowing some carbon/ burnt gasses through AND the EML comes on - worse in every way)

stooge75

even a 10mm hole,the eml will appear afer a few days/week

jeebowhite

 

 

With the new(ish) air filter, boost hose sorted, EGR blanked and with the ECU reset, i can imagine it would feel like a "different car"   now all you need is a tuning box or remap :lol:

 

And an inlet manifold cleanout....

 

And a terraclean...

 

And does your have a DPF? (just kidding)

 

Due to the battery replacement, it has had an ECU refresh, so its still learning but it certainly feels a bit better, unfortunately though, I am a bit hesitant at the moment to put my foot down, wondering when the gearbox is going to blow (long story, another rainy day!) but when I do, it does seem to move more comfortably.... I just need to run it in, let the ECU do its thing after a few tanks, not reset it (its been reset on average after every 2 tanks recently!) then I am sure it will play a lot more happily!

 

Inlet Manifold, probably could do with a clean, but as I am moving house at the moment, and the time of year, and all the rest, I doubt I will get chance to do it!

 

Terraclean - I really do consider it. IF the gearbox does go adios, and I do replace it rather than chop the car, then I probably will get terraclean done anyway!

 

As for the DPF - I am damned grateful I dont have it, I would have removed it with my fingernails by now, just because its there! aaaah, long gone are the Y2K regulations that didnt conform to the European Dictatorship

 

which intercooler pipe was cracked mate?just curious

 

It was the Turbo Intercooler Pipe.  Known faulty design by Ford, just not paid for them by them! take a look at my signature and have a look at the PDF I threw together and you should be able to see the damage yourself!

 

WHAT A RESULT, off to a family gathering yesterday, car full of wife, kids & dog.

Lost all power, car in "limp home mode" managed to get to next services on MWay.

Wife & Daughter headed for loo and met RAC man whilst i was on the phone to Control centre. Fitter pulled up alongside whilst i was still on the phone & got the job pinned to him. "I used to work for some French car maker Ren^&*t that use the same engines" he said.

2 min later he said " It's your EGR valve Sir, I have a blanking plate here." 3 min later, fitted then test drive & job booked off.

Breakedown to back on road 20-30 min I LOVE THE GUY!!!

NOW

NO hesitation at speed on motorway. Pull away in 1st without any thottle up hill & get up to 3rd without throttle on the flat, power from 1200 rpm.

It's like having a new car, even though there is 137,000 on the clock.

Must unplug the Battery for 30 Min tomorrow to remap.

Thanks for all uour help and advice Guys, i wish i had just blanked the bloodything off last month.

 

Now that is a brilliant way for it to go! and last month is last month, at least its fixed now, playing nicely and a reset of a code now and then should save you a few months to years of misery!

Anthony Obrien
Where do you get the EGR blanking plate from
jeebowhite

ebay :)

 

Just search for Stainless Steel EGR blanking plate Mondeo, or EGR Blanking Plate Mondeo (only look at the Stainless steel ones, the aluminium ones are not worth it)

Anthony Obrien

ebay :)
 
Just search for Stainless Steel EGR blanking plate Mondeo, or EGR Blanking Plate Mondeo (only look at the Stainless steel ones, the aluminium ones are not worth it)



Will do mate thanks


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