Mk2 1.6 Focus Overheating

[gwengo]

Hi peeps!!

Got a distressing phone call from my wife this evening. She was driving along and her temperature gauge started rising over half way. She has a 2005 mk2 1.6 ford focus titanium, and it's been pretty much trouble free unit now. When I arrived the fans were going ballistic even with the engine off so I popped the bonnet, and noticed straight away that there was no coolant at all in the coolant bottle. I've filled the coolant bottle to get her home and the temp gauge was fine, but I did notice a smell of coolant whilst driving. When I got home and had the car in idle on the driveway, there was a distinct water trickling sound within the car. I looked in the footwell and water/coolant seemed to be dripping from somewhere behind the dash into the footwell, not loads, but enough to wet the carpets. I also looked under the car and noticed that there was a little pool of water, not directly under the engine, but set back a bit to where the exhaust pipe straightens out from the engine. Thats all I could see as it was getting dark.

To summarise:

• Overheating engine

• Loss of Coolant

• leak coming from behind the centre console on dash inside the car

• Pool of water under car

If anyone else has experience this problem, can you please advise. I'm gonna have a look at it tomorrow in the daylight, but if anyone can give me a heads up on what it could be, at least i have some ammunition to fire at the mechanics if I do need to take it to a garage.

Cheers all!!!

[mick85]

Yes ur heater matrix is leakin look at pedals an tell me is pipes one piece or is there a join on them

[artscot79]

Ouch hopefully its an easy to get to pipe or else its a dash out job either the pipe or matrix itself is leaking the puddle will be from the aircon drain under the car ive done one heater matrix on a mk1 and i can see why it costs a lot of money to fix its a night mare to say the least dont be tempted to put leak fix into the coolant system they cause more issues than they fix

[mick85]

U can replace a matrix without removing the dash but u just have to break piece of plastic which u can glue back on an seal up be as good as new or u can remove complete dash which would take upto twelve 12 front doors have to be removed beleive me u do not want to remove the dash it's worst possible job u can do an prob end up breaking more stuff if u remove dash and I say if u a novice realistically u be look at over 20 hours to remove dash

[gwengo]

wow, cheers for the quick response and heads up guys. I'm gonna have a look tomorrow, and see what I can do, at least it gets me out of Christmas shopping :D. So correct me if I'm wrong, does the coolant circulate from around the engine, radiator and into the cabin?

[JonS]

I changed the heater matrix in our 2008 Mk2 about 2 years ago - freezing cold in a cramped garage, it was certainly quite an involved procedure. I'd suggest getting a Haynes manual and following it carefully. Bag up and label the screws, bolts etc. as you go. Main points I recall:

- The dash did have to come out

- Managed to leave the steering column in place, although Haynes says you must remove it

- Clutch hydraulics have to be disconnected and the master cylinder unbolted

- Original pipes to matrix have to be sawn through to remove. The new one comes with O rings and joints in the pipes.

- Didn't need to take the doors off - as long as you can open them enough to get the dash out.

I'd be interested to know more about the previous tip from Mick85 about breaking some plastic part which avoids removing the dash. Just in case I have to do it again..........

[gwengo]

Cheers for the tips Jon, I am looking through the Haynes manual now :) currently reading up on how to drain the system. I might do this at the same time. It looks pretty cramped where the leak seems to be, around by the pedals, so I think I'll investigate further tomorrow before taking anything apart, and probably get a quote from a garage first.

[mick85]

Here how coolant system work consists of water pump thermostat radiator coolant sensor and heater matrix thermostat is closed when u start car to get get engine hot quicker to be fuel efficient an to heat inside faster when engine gets between 80 an 90 the thermostat open let's water circulate from rad stop engine overheat that's basic a basic run down an ur fan inside car blows at little heater matrix that's were ur hot air come from now I know there more to it then that it's just simple way explaining it

[gwengo]

Ah ok, cheers mick.

[mick85]

Seriously u can do them without removing dash so go ds footwell remove kick panel at centre console so u can see the the pipes then remove the metal plate in ur way then if car fitted wit a pre heater remove that also then remove as many screw u have access to on heater box so u u can partially move the matrix so there will be plastic blocking u pulling out matrix now be gentle pull up towards steering wheel wit both hands an break piece off then cut ur pipes and remove matrix now when u put back together an put screws In it will fit like jigsaw u can put sealer on if not clean break now remember this only a plastic box which u will never see once it back together now I know people might say I I don't wanna break piece plastic but believe me until u strip out full dash u would no it never truly goes back way it came out an chances are u break more things removing hole dash this a 2 hour job an beleive me u be easily 2 days in a workshop wit all tools beside u so In ur garden or own garage this is the way to go save urself so much heart ache

[gwengo]

superb, thanks for the reassurance mick. I'm definitely gonna have a go myself, even if it's just to inspect the area at fault. I take it when you have to cut the pipes, a new heater matrix will have new pipes included?

[mick85]

Yeah when u get new one it has joiner pipes now one piece of advice hardest part is gettin pipes to join there 2 I rings needed I would order 6 cause they can catch but I found drop brake fluid on them works a threat an they usually slide on easily if u do try it urself an any problems let me know I try help u out

[gwengo]

Cheers mate, much appreciated, I don't doubt at all that I will be hassling you tomorrow for some more info ;)

[mick85]

Ha no problem anything ya need we hear to help an try save u a few quid comin up to Christmas this stuff always at worst time I feel ur pain haha

[jeebowhite]

I am looking forward to your success on this one Paul!

Perhaps a guide with photos and blood is in order ;)

*nod nod, wink wink*

[gwengo]

Well, I can give you guys a how not to guide if you like :). I've been working on the car all weekend, and have to confess this is THE most difficult job I have ever done on a car. I will upload some picture when I get a chance to go on my mac.

I took the carpet up on the drivers side footwell and it was saturated in coolant. I've removed the plastic casing from the right hand side of the heater matrix (I can see what mick is saying about it not being needed, the manufacturer could have easily made it a removable cover). Anyway, the good news is that I don't need to saw away at the pipes as the pipe coming from the matrix is of the two part variety rather than the one piece. The bad news is, that joint is where the leak is. I managed to detach the pipes, and the heater matrix was free to come out....

...if it wasn't for a piece of 4mm thick steel from the chassis jutting out and stopping the pipes from being manouvered out of its placement :(. I was contemplating on cutting this piece of metal out but it would have taken me all day with my little junior hacksaw. I wanted to remove the matrix to inspect it and clean it up after the soaking it has had, but I guess this just wasn't to be. So I decided to simply replace the o rings, I use that word 'simply' very loosely. Space in the footwell is VERY tight even with the clutch pedal cable tied back inside the footwell. Also you can only use one hand to do this task as you simple can't fit both of your arms under and up to the pipes. I bought some specific air con o rings as replacement and they did seem to be slightly smaller than the ones I removed, but I thought this may be due to the stretching and heat distortion.

After a lot of fiddling about with one hand I managed to get the two o rings on the pipes. SUCCESS!!!! Now time to add more coolant and fire the old girl up and put her back together again! :) happy days!!!!!....

... Errrr no

Fire her up and al seemed well, no leaks, but then to my utter horror, drips coming from the joints and not just the one, both joins now. If I had a baseball bat to hand now, I would be posting about how to get dents from my bodywork. Luckily though I don't play baseball :).

So to conclude, the car is still off the road and I have admitted defeat :( so close yet so far. I spoke to my local garage and they gave me a good tip. Simply get a piece of copper piping and working from the engine side, disconnect the two hoses that lead to the heater matrix and join them together to bridge the gap in the system. You won't have a heater in the car, but at least the car can be used to take to a garage. No the best option in this weather though.

[gwengo]

Right, as promised here are some photos. I would have posted a step by step process, but the more I delved into the job, the more frustrated I got and the less photos I took...

work begins...

Mopping up the damage...

the leak...

close up of aforementioned leak...

The prime suspect.

[jeebowhite]

Was looking forward to seeing you claim success from this one!

So are you looking to bridge it and get it to a garage or are you just going to get a tow?

[mick85]

If u don't use ford genuine o rings it will keep leaking

[gwengo]

Was looking forward to seeing you claim success from this one!

So are you looking to bridge it and get it to a garage or are you just going to get a tow?

Yeah mate I'm gonna get it to a garage and get them to have a look, now I know that its the joint that is leaking and not the Matrix. Hopefully it will be a bit less than £500 I've been quoted for the whole job. Might ask them to weld the pipes together lol :D

If u don't use ford genuine o rings it will keep leaking

Oh, I wonder if this is why it's still leaking hmmm. Might actually purchase some then and have another go. Not sure if my body can take another day of contortion in that footwell though :D

[mick85]

Yeah do dip them in brake fluid an stick them in the pipe on bulk head side not matrix side I find if u disconnect rubber hoses from outside car u can move metal pipes more freely always do inside one first it's hardest an u might be best gettin new black clamps to I would defo buy more then 2 I rings

[gwengo]

Yeah do dip them in brake fluid an stick them in the pipe on bulk head side not matrix side I find if u disconnect rubber hoses from outside car u can move metal pipes more freely always do inside one first it's hardest an u might be best gettin new black clamps to I would defo buy more then 2 I rings

Thanks for the advice, I can't get anywhere near the clamp so I'm just gonna leave that where it is. I know what you mean about disconnecting the rubber pipes from the engine bay. Does make moving them a lot easier

[mick85]

U should defo give another go I know u can do it ha them garages will charge u stupid money it would worked for u I made exact same mistake first time usin any o rings but once use ford genuine job worked good luck with it fingers crossed for ya haha hope ur hands ain't to badly cut haha

[gwengo]

U should defo give another go I know u can do it ha them garages will charge u stupid money it would worked for u I made exact same mistake first time usin any o rings but once use ford genuine job worked good luck with it fingers crossed for ya haha hope ur hands ain't to badly cut haha

Cheers mate and thanks for the vote of confidence :) I've ordered the genuine o rings now £2.59 + vat EACH!! For a little bit of rubber which probably costs them 5p to produce. I nearly fell off me chair when the guy told me the price. Anyway, I've managed to blank off the heater matrix, so the car is useable, just won't have any heat in the cabin, and in this cold snap it's gonna be missed. So I'll pick up the o rings tomorrow and have another try at the weekend, I just hope this dry period holds out until then.

With regards to my hands mick, well it looks like I've been self harming. Little scratches and nicks all over the back of my hands, I just see them as battle scars :)

[jeebowhite]

looking forward to success!