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Problem: P120X And P020X Codes

injectors

Best Answer Jim_Cambridge, 06 October 2014 - 08:54 PM

(edited 07/10/14)

 

I didn't mention the jerks especially because I was having just the same problems as you wrote in your first post. My car is still awaiting diagnosis from a diesel specialist, the first injector which was changed/removed was assessed today by United Diesel (I posted it to them) and they said basically the piezo mechanism had worn out and it was common with high mileages - mine is 145k, what is yours?

 

The injector specialist has reported today that the second injector has also failed electrically, basically worn out, and needs replacing. Apparently it's common, but I am still very curious why it happened straight away after the other one was replaced. And wondering if 3 and 4 will go very soon.

 

One thing he clarified - the Siemens injectors do not need coding, I believe they are fitted to later vehicles around 2005/06 onwards, so not all the 1.8 TDCi Lynx engines are the same.

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#1 cauchy

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 08:48 PM

Hi guys,

 

I have two symptoms with my S-Max 2008 1.8 (1.8L Duratorq-TDCi):

1. From time to time the engine jerks

2. From time to time I get the "check engine" light (I think that it is connected with jerking). Sometimes it takes 500km to get one, sometimes I have two on the distance of 2 km. To date, I have spotted the following error codes: P0202, P1202, P0203, P1203, P1204.

 

I could replace injectors, but it will cost me and I have no guarantee that they are cause. Any ideas? :)

 

Best regards,

cauchy



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#2 jeebowhite

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 11:41 AM

Hi Cauchy,

 

The errors are:

 

P0202 - P0202 means that the PCM detected a fault in the injector or the wiring to the injector. It monitors the injector and when the injector is activated, the PCM expects to see the voltage pulled "low" or close to zero. When the injector is switched off, the PCM expects to see a voltage that is close to battery voltage or "high". If it doesn't see the expected voltage the PCM will set this code. The PCM also monitors resitance in the circuit. If the resistance is excessively low or high it will set this code.

 

P1202 - Injector Circuit Open / Shorted Cylinder #2

 

P0203 - P0203 means that the PCM detected a fault in the injector or the wiring to the injector. It monitors the injector and when the injector is activated, the PCM expects to see the voltage pulled "low" or close to zero. When the injector is switched off, the PCM expects to see a voltage that is close to battery voltage or "high". If it doesn't see the expected voltage the PCM will set this code. The PCM also monitors resitance in the circuit. If the resistance is excessively low or high it will set this code.

 

P1203 -  Injector Circuit Open / Shorted Cylinder #3

 

P1204 - Injector Circuit Open / Shorted Cylinder #4

 

This to me seems like the only cylinder working is cylinder 1. So I would go to the engine and check the wiring past cylinder 1 and make sure its not wet, damaged, or loose beyond this. It might be a simple fix, but as you have an error on injector 2 directly and 3 cylinders, then I doubt that replacing it would resolve the issue. Also check the fuseboard and relays to make sure none of them are wet or damaged.

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#3 cauchy

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Posted 17 May 2014 - 09:27 AM

Thanks for the response.

 

 

 

This to me seems like the only cylinder working is cylinder 1. So I would go to the engine and check the wiring past cylinder 1 and make sure its not wet, damaged, or loose beyond this. It might be a simple fix, but as you have an error on injector 2 directly and 3 cylinders, then I doubt that replacing it would resolve the issue. Also check the fuseboard and relays to make sure none of them are wet or damaged.

 

Actually, I have an error on injectors 2 and 3. Is it possible that one faulty injector generates electrical errors on the other ones? 

 

I have been looking for an link between those errors or the "jerks" and other factors such as the rain, temperature, revolutions, acceleration, length of the ride and found absolutely no correlation. The only thing is that I feel that the problems come in series, e.g., three days when I experience problems, followed by a week without any.

 

Three electricians after inspecting the wires failed to resolve the problem. They suggested replacing all injectors, but this is just a wild (and quite costly) guess.

 

Any other thoughts?



#4 jeebowhite

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Posted 17 May 2014 - 12:57 PM

I suspect if its a wiring fault after cylinder 1, then your likely to see the issue affect the other three so I would check the wiring isnt fraid or is secured throughout.



#5 cauchy

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Posted 18 May 2014 - 07:01 AM

You say that the problem could be after cylinder 1. Do you suggest that cylinders/injectors are wired "sequentially"? What I see when inspecting my engine is that the wires split roughly at one point and go in four directions from there, so I do not see where the point "wiring after cylinder 1" could be. My engine looks like this one: http://www.lyonssyst...0-631-PTIMG.jpg



#6 jeebowhite

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Posted 18 May 2014 - 07:07 AM

It could just be something on the other cable separations. If you have a multimeter it could be an idea to test them all.

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#7 Jim_Cambridge

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Posted 01 October 2014 - 09:51 PM

Hi there, I know this thread is a few months old but I'm having exactly the same problems. Had injector 2 changed (and fuel filter) now the fault has moved to cylinder 1 i.e. fault P1201. Also got fault code P0087 - Fuel Rail/System Pressure - Too Low.

 

Used to be intermittent fault but now it will only start in limp mode (before and after injector 2 change). I am wondering if some air is trapped in the system and/or it's some kind of electrical fault, otherwise why would multiple injectors die in quick sucession? Unless it was a dodgy fuel batch, I had filled up at a supermarket (normally only used Shell, BP etc) but the problem only got bad towards end of the tank and even worse after filling up (JET brand).



#8 cauchy

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 08:17 PM

I think you have a different problem. I did not experience P0087. You also do not mention any jerks. Anyway, my problem still persists. It did not get worse, but it neither healed itself magically. In our engines the wires are separated, thus a problem with wires is quite improbable if we have problems on multiple injectors. Therefore, PCM seems to be a candidate #1 for me, unfortunately. 



#9 Jim_Cambridge

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 08:54 PM   Best Answer

(edited 07/10/14)

 

I didn't mention the jerks especially because I was having just the same problems as you wrote in your first post. My car is still awaiting diagnosis from a diesel specialist, the first injector which was changed/removed was assessed today by United Diesel (I posted it to them) and they said basically the piezo mechanism had worn out and it was common with high mileages - mine is 145k, what is yours?

 

The injector specialist has reported today that the second injector has also failed electrically, basically worn out, and needs replacing. Apparently it's common, but I am still very curious why it happened straight away after the other one was replaced. And wondering if 3 and 4 will go very soon.

 

One thing he clarified - the Siemens injectors do not need coding, I believe they are fitted to later vehicles around 2005/06 onwards, so not all the 1.8 TDCi Lynx engines are the same.



#10 cauchy

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 09:32 AM

Jim,

 

What you say is interesting. Do you have also P020X errors or only the P120X ones?

 

If we have the same problem, it means simply that I also need to check my injectors. Having this problems on multiple injectors I assumed that it has a common cause, but you might be right that that the injectors starts to wear out at the same time. 

 

My injectors are Siemens (4M5Q-9F593-AD), and, AFAIK, they also do not need coding. I am not sure about my mileage, since its a second hand car. It is at least 110,000 km, but I believe it is 40k more  (yours is 145,000 km or 145,000 miles?).



#11 Jim_Cambridge

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 10:31 AM

The only codes I'm aware of now are P1201 and P0087 (was P1202 before replacing injector, not sure if any others).

 

My car is 145,000 miles = 230,000 km. I think it's normal for injectors to wear out around this mileage - wish I'd done my research before buying the car at 136k miles! But of course I paid less for it, and I know they can fail at much lower mileages.

 

I'm not sure we've got the same problem as you. Have you tried cleaning your EGR valve? It seemed to help my problem so I thought it was this not the injectors a while ago. It's a spray can, you take off the air inlet pipe just before the EGR valve and spray in small bursts (best with two people).



#12 cauchy

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 11:36 AM

Thanks for the hint. I did not try EGR. But still, this seems a bit too advanced for me. Do you have any photos showing where is this pipe exactly?



#13 Jim_Cambridge

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 11:57 AM

EGR cleaning is here, don't worry about the site name - the pictures are of a Focus 1.8 TDCi engine

http://www.peugeotfo...gr-clean-21238/



#14 cauchy

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 12:30 PM

Great instructions. Thanks!



#15 Jim_Cambridge

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 10:55 AM

Just to follow up, done about 200 miles so far on the two new injectors and no problems yet. I can recommend Cambs Injector Services in Comberton, charged around £400 instead of ~£600 at main dealer (although I negotiated an oil filter change to be included FOC). Although they're not easy to get to by public transport.

 

(edit 17th Nov 2014)

Still 100% fine after maybe 600 more miles (I don't drive much) and a experimenting with different types of driving :-) what generally triggered a fail before was putting my foot right down around 1700rpm, it would start to accelerate, then glitch, then sometimes go to limp mode. But have stuck to 'branded' fuel (standard not the premium grade), not risking the supermarket fuel again...



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