Engine Rebuild Required [Advice Request]

[itsphilz]

Hi,

Background (skip if you like)

I bought my Focus Cmax 1.8 2004 Petrol just over 3 months ago. Yesterday whilst driving home at lunch I starting hearing a very loud noise coming from my engine bay. Not knowing what was wrong I drove it straight to a garage after having been at home for a bit. All in all, probably about 6 miles in total done with the noise coming from the engine bay.

I get to my normal garage and the mechanic check the dipstick. No oil, bone dry. He says that the "bottom end" is shot and it will probably require a rebuild or a new engine. I had checked my oil whilst servicing our KA 6 weeks ago and it was absolutely fine and had no engine check lights or oil lights come on.

I contacted the garage where I bought it from and he basically told me it was my fault and that I should be checking my oil every 2 weeks. I won't go any further into the arguments that have been had, as this probably isn't the right category for it.

Any advice?

I got a quote for a recondition of my current engine for £695 from 1st Choice Engines, however upon Googling them I saw this (link).

What I am looking for is for some reputable companies who rebuild/recondition engines and/or any other advice people can give with regards to my situation.

Apologies if this is the wrong thread for it.

[BOF]

I bought my Focus Cmax 1.8 2004 Petrol just over 3 months ago. Yesterday whilst driving home at lunch I starting hearing a very loud noise coming from my engine bay. Not knowing what was wrong I drove it straight to a garage after having been at home for a bit. All in all, probably about 6 miles in total done with the noise...I get to my normal garage and the mechanic check the dipstick. No oil, bone dry. He says that the "bottom end" is shot and it will probably require a rebuild or a new engine.

If it is really true that there is no oil and it bone dry, then it will do untold damage to the engine.

The only way(s) that I can see that happening is if, say, a stone goes through the sump or some oil pipe comes off. there are other ways that oil can disappear, but relatively gradually.

So, was there any evidence of oil being pumped out of the engine (pool of oil? big hole out of which the oil might have come?).

Now, say it will do untold damage, but it doesn't happen immediately. Six miles, partic if things had been going from a while before that and you only noticed when things got really bad might be a bit much though. I am puzzled by the lack of oil light, though.

Assuming that something had gone wrong a while before the 'big noise', and the big noise only started when things had got really bad, the oil light should have been on, if only intermittently, for some time. Was there evidence that oil light was working(for example, did it come on with the ignition and go off when the engine started)?

Did anyone try pouring oil into the engine and seeing what happened? Well, apart from oil coming gushing out from somewhere. Did it, even for a short period, cure the noise?

I won't go any further into the arguments that have been had, as this probably isn't the right category for it.

It is your thread, but I wouldn't see anything wrong in discussing those arguments. personally, I'd prefer that you did that to having you start another thread discussing purely the legal factors (because it is bound to end up with some of the background in one thread but not the other), but it is up to you.

I got a quote for a recondition of my current engine for £695 from 1st Choice Engines, however upon Googling them I saw this (link).

What I am looking for is for some reputable companies who rebuild/recondition engines and/or any other advice people can give with regards to my situation.

Options are:

1. Recon engine
2. Fix whatever is wrong with the existing engine
3. Scrappie engine

(I'm assuming that a new engine is really a non-starter (sorry), from a cost point of view.)

You've already discovered the problem with option 1, finding a good reconditioner. Years ago, engines used to wear out after 60 - 80 k miles, and re-con engines were popular, but even then, re-con engines were a bit of a gamble. You asked all your mates and hoped someone had good experience. these days, you probably don't have mates who have had a re-con engine.

Fixing the existing engine probably isn't much good, either. Unless pouring oil into the engine reveals an engine that only has a few problems that need fixing, I'd guess (based on an engine run dry for a while) that you would need

• re-ground crank
• new main bearing shells
• oil pump

and probably

• re-bored block
• new pistons and rings
• tappet followers (hydraulic?)
• cams

Even if you cost the labour at zero (ie, do it yourself, presumably, with all the disadvantages that has), this will probably be expensive and has a number of risks (like, there could be a bad surprise when you open the engine up). And there is, presumably, a big hole somewhere to fix, too.

OTOH, if you had fancied improving your engine by, eg, increasing the capacity or something, this might be a good opportunity, as it won't cost that much more (than the already big cost)...

Even so, it could be better to buy a secondhand engine that is mostly ok, and fix the things that need fixing. That implies buying an engine and pulling it to pieces.

Alternatively, a 'scrappie engine' (buy engine from a scrapyard and just put it in without pulling it to pieces). A gamble. But, if you get a decent engine - and I'm guessing the odds are reasonable, partic if you get an engine from a car that you know was crashed - that will be a win.

Apologies if this is the wrong thread for it.

Err, it is your thread, so that has to be ok. Possibly you meant which sub-forum?

[jeebowhite]

BOF nailed most of it to be fair.

I would be looking for a replacement rather than a rebuild, as its probably a darned site easier to find a breaker.

Mate of mine just bought a full car for £104 - everything was in perfect working order, so if I was you, I would consider looking on eBay for breakers, at that price, its worth buying a whole seperate car, if the engine doesnt work, you can nab a load of spares of it and sell it on or put it in for scrap.

Either way though, you have been unlucky. I would be tracing back over my steps, see if there is any sign of oil where I previously was. If you see patches of oil, you can contest that you let it run dry because of a failure which resulted in the sudden loss of all oil. Which would certainly be covered by your warranty.

[BOF]

I would be looking for a replacement rather than a rebuild, as its probably a darned site easier to find a breaker.

There are some sites that will let you send a query to several sites at once; 'breakerlink' is one name that I remember, but I can't really make a recommendation, not really having used them for anything oily, or difficult to deliver. Anyway, the competition aspect seems to work in your favour, in this case.

Mate of mine just bought a full car for £104...

Not sure that could eat a whole one...but that's cheaper than a couple of drop links, for example...

Either way though, you have been unlucky. I would be tracing back over my steps, see if there is any sign of oil where I previously was. If you see patches of oil, you can contest that you let it run dry because of a failure which resulted in the sudden loss of all oil. Which would certainly be covered by your warranty.

Essentially, if the oil came out pretty suddenly, it doesn't matter if you were checking the oil weekly or monthly, it would have still gone in between oil checks (unless someone thinks that the oil is suddenly vomited out while it is sitting still on your drive, just while you are checking it, and while it is switched off - that seems incredibly implausible, but it is what they have to be suggesting, if periodic oil checks are going to catch it, just as it happens; otherwise you'd be driving it when it happened, and then you've got the same situation as you have now). Its better if you can say 'look, there is the hole it came out of', but if it is clear that it was sudden you should be off the hook.

I'll also go back to the oil warning light; I'm still surprised that you didn't see that come on. If, for example, what has happened is that the oil pressure light has been disabled (eg, because it had a habit of coming on, and the person who sold it to the garage didn't want that to show, and it had been that way when the car was sold), you should also be off the hook, because they sold the car with the 'safety feature' that made this unlikely disabled.

(The 'oil light' is a low oil pressure warning, and you would expect the oil pressure to go low before everything failed. In fact, in the short term, you could argue that, if the oil pressure doesn't go low, the engine should keep on running, although that might be a bit difficult if the car is being thrashed. But the likeliest is that the oil pressure light flickers before it gets irretrievably bad, as the oil level goes low, and the pump has difficulty picking up oil.)

[jeebowhite]

Couldn't agree more. Definitely worth checking the instrument cluster, remove it and check that there is no back tape over it and if it is document it, photograph it and rebuild it, better still get someone to video it so there's less 'prove you didn't put it on there' better still if you suspect this, take it to an indie garage and ask them to do the job they are an Impartial witness and would likely testify to it if you chucked them a few quid for there troubles