£100 Parking Ticket!

[jeebowhite]

Sadly my financial situation doesn't allow for me to gamble the chance of winning lol 60 quid ticket ad a one off is more affordable than a several hundred bill inclusiveness court costs etc.

[jeebowhite]

and just as I lost all hope.

I received an email today from the outlet centre I visited. Having reviewed the CCTV footage, and my arguments with this, they are going to speak to the parking company and overturn my ticket :D

hopefully in 24 hours he will have sorted it out for me, and the money will be back in my pocket!!! I really did not see this getting better, but if this works, I will be over thrilled!

[GrahamJC]

In a civil action, it is the claimant (in cases like this, the parking company)who must prove his case on the balance of

probabilities. Yes, of course you have the opportunity to argue you case and you may well succeed but now, the parking

companies (thanks to the CA decision) may be more inclined to pursue cases through the courts and do you really want to run

the risks of having to pay costs on top of the excess charge if you lose? Speeding is more or less a strict liability

offence. In other words, the prosecution does NOT have to show that you knew you were speeding or that you intended to speed.

Please do not misunderstand me, I dislike these companies as much as you do but they exist to make money and the way they do it is through excess charges.

[jeebowhite]

Couldnt agree more Graham, it appears on this ocassion I have got the better of them (and I say that with bated breathe, until the money returns to my account!)

Never the less though, I think the evidence I presented shone a fairly strong argument on many points of failure, and I suspect if it wasnt for that case happening at that time, they would have backed down, but when I spoke to one person on the phone, I was waiting for them to look something up, in the background, I heard someone from the appeals team saying "just reject that one, they wont dare take it to court given the high court yesterday"

so I know darned well at least mine if not many others would have been rejected on the charade!

[jeebowhite]

just got off the phone with them, the reason I never recieved the appeal rejection, is because they didnt put a housenumber on it!!! fools.

Anyway, just got off the phone with them and asked them how I would receive my refund, and I said that the landowner was going to overturn the ticket, and she said "what do you mean refund, as in if we decide to refund you the money for it?"

if the ticket is indeed overturned, then you have to give me the money back, there is no "if" about it!!!!

[Invisible Man]

I got one of these tickets for parking in the Peel Centre in Stockport. I know that it is free after 8.30pm and there is a Frankies & Bennys on there. Arrived at 8.28pm. Had a cig and went in after 8.30. No ticket.

3 weeks go by and they send me a £100 ticket for not paying during operating hours, again reduced to £60 if paid within 14 days.

I knew that you had to enter a reg number into the machines when getting a ticket, but I always assumed that was so tickets weren't transferable to other folk in the car park. Turns out the car park has ANPR technology and it matches up your car to the ticket.

So in short, I had to pay £60 to park my car in an empty car park for 2 minutes.

Thieves

[Stoney871]

The problem is that as soon as you park on private land that operates parking control you are entering into a contract with the company.

Parking equates to acceptance of the terms.

A lot of the time you can only get out of this if you can prove that the signage is wrong, incorrectly positioned or that bay markings are misleading.

[MattDRX]

I'd of tried to argue the fact the machine display was time at 20:31 ) happens, and wasn't accepting payment. worth a punt.

but joke, looks like you'll be one more signature on my petition next week.

[Invisible Man]

Yeah I paid the £60 as I legally had to, but it still hurt

[Phil 87]

The problem is that as soon as you park on private land that operates parking control you are entering into a contract with the company.

Parking equates to acceptance of the terms.

A lot of the time you can only get out of this if you can prove that the signage is wrong, incorrectly positioned or that bay markings are misleading.

Very interesting, I didn't know that. I thought a contract required some sort of communication, or is it just the fact that you are supposed to read whatever signs are visible, and parking after reading them means you agree to what is on the sign?

[jeebowhite]

by all accounts, it seems that the outlet centre are confident that if they tell these people to jump, they have to question how high. As such, I hope their weight behind it will give me the money back. what annoys me though - how can you enter into a contract if you dont specifically agree to it? lets say for arguments sake, ANPR. I drive into a car park, I spend time looking at the signs and I leave, they see I entered, they see I left - unless that sign states clearly you are allowed up to X minutes free, they could argue you stopped your car, took the key out, and legally parked your car on their watch, whilst you got out to read the signs? THAT is a mick take, and annoys me like nothing I can think of.

unless I expressly enter into an agreement, it should not be assumed. if I receive a contract for a loan, or anything else, my agreement is a signature on the dotted line, an express agreement and is therefore to be treat as such. How can leaving my car somewhere under an ASSUMED agreement, be considered legal!?!?!? if I went to a machine and put my reg in, with a note saying "by entering your registration you are agreeing to the terms" - FINE! I agreed expressly, but why should it be assumed that because the key is out of the ignition I agree whole heartedly to await their arrival to drop my trousers!!!

there needs to be an element of sense here, and I really do not think this is something that cowboys will get into. IMHO - the council should take responsibility for all car parks! private and public. They operate a much more fair and sensible approach, reasonable fee's and its more income for the local council, why should a company take all the benefit and bend you over? If the council did it, the company pay the council to maintain private car parks, the council gets more money. Someone breaches conditions, the council gets the income, the council employs the people, and as much as I may dislike what parking wardens do, I would rather know that a fine issued to the council is at least going to be used to serve me in another way, it will be swallowed into their coughers and reinvested in the local community somehow.

I dislike (if its not apparent already) private parking companies, who think its acceptable to charge unreasonable fee's, in a car park that is not maintained to the standards, because they use technology that can be easily foiled.

I may start carrying false plates. When I arrive at a car park, I stick on a false plate, or add tape to my number plate. if they want to issue a charge they can do so to a car that does not exist :p

I just hope that the parking people refund my payment. if they dont I will be annoyed, as they need to act on the landowners behalf, they do not own the land they patrol, therefore its the landowners choice. and if they breach that, I will be reporting them to the BPA as a minimum

[Invisible Man]

Number plates that flip......

You going to do a guide?

[MattDRX]

^ I'll add that part about the contract to my petition dude. we'll need to chat properly over email or something to discuss it properly soon. we need change on this.

Main argument will be, they are allowed to charge these fees to make up for lost revenue? what single parking bay makes £100 day? not a single one, it's £65 a day to park in Chelsea NCP For Christ sake. even Heathrow T5 Short stay is cheaper. not on.

[GrahamJC]

Just to clear up one thing you mention in your post James, a contract can be implied by conduct and this has long been

recognised by the law. The vast bulk of contracts do not have to be in writing contrary to popular belief. In the case of

parking in a supermarket car park, you are deemed to know that restrictions apply even though you haven't read the notices

which contain the restrictions and parking your car is an acceptance by conduct. Whilst I agree with what Matthew says about the excess charge being high in these places, the Court of Appeal has expressly stated that in the case of the Chelmsford

man the excess was not OTT! This decision is now the law unless the Supreme Court decides differently or the government

brings in legislation on this matter.

[jeebowhite]

Yeah it's sad but I think improvements must be made. We would all love free parking and and where we want to, but in accordance with legislation and guidance all bays should be correct specifications to be enforced. Anyone can paint a picture on the ground at the end of the day. Hell I could run around and paint a wheelchair on every space in the entire car park, does that mean they would collect fines for everyone?

[SeanW]

I'm curious as to whether or not I'm going to receive an invitation to send money from a recent trip to Asda lol

As I loaded the shopping into the boot, the parking womble glared at me, made a funny face and walked off lol

I wonder if Asda complained that they were being jobsworths and ticketing genuine customers lol

[jeebowhite]

Haha I shouldn't think so, but a receipt will prove things.

[Ianb]

I may start carrying false plates. When I arrive at a car park, I stick on a false plate, or add tape to my number plate. if they want to issue a charge they can do so to a car that does not exist :P

...oh it'll exist alright... probably turn out to be my plate you've used...¬_¬

[jeebowhite]

Haha nah I will use one of the bosses plates lol or, I will just remove my number plates before entering the car park and cover the VIN.

Let's see them ticket me then :-D

Clive is it illegal to do this on private property lol

[GingerFlame]

[Stoney871]

Haha nah I will use one of the bosses plates lol or, I will just remove my number plates before entering the car park and cover the VIN.

Let's see them ticket me then :-D

Clive is it illegal to do this on private property lol

I'm not going to touch that one with a barge pole :p

[MattDRX]

May not be a criminal offence but there will be some kind of issue with it, surely it's not different to every car in Hounslow having their numbers split in odd formats and spacing so ANPR can't read it correctly,

Best bet may be to get another pair, snap them in half and keep them in the boot, just say you had a little shunt earlier and you need to get some more made up that day, quite reasonable.

Good thing tax discs aren't required anymore, they used to photograph them.

[jeebowhite]

Shame Clive, though I can see why "well, I spoke to officer Stoney and he said it was fine 8-)" lol

yeah there are many ways we could look to dodge them, naughty as it may be, morally, I dont think its any worse trying to dodge these clowns ticketing you, as much as it is for them to ticket you and bend you over the way they do!

[jeebowhite]

Well, I just called the team leader of the appeals team, and very politely chased my money. I was advised it was refunded yesterday and should be in my account within a few days.

She seemed a tad disappointed when I mentioned the land owner had overthrown their decision :p

[Ianb]

Well done James. Proportional and justified fines are one thing.... £100 for a parking fine is BS!