brakes

[antward91]

had new discs and pads fitted on my focus last August for the mot, after around 1000 miles they began squeaking when breaking lightly as I first touched the pedal and stopped when the brakes were firmly pressed, I took them back to the garage 3 times over the next 12 months each time they heard the noise but told me everything looked fine. 

2 weeks ago I'd had enough of the noise and got a friend who works at a local garage to fit me new discs and pads again, he told me everything looked fine with the old ones but still fitted the new ones.

so today driving to work, I hear the same squeak as I first touched the pedal, brake pads still look untouched.

where could the problem lie on this one?

[Russ]

Dust on the pads/disks. Try spraying them with brake cleaner and see if it helps. Also, do you know if your friend wire brushed all the dust off the carrier/caliper and used copper grease when he refitted the new disks/pads?

[Albert27]

14 minutes ago, antward91 said:

had new discs and pads fitted on my focus last August for the mot, after around 1000 miles they began squeaking when breaking lightly as I first touched the pedal and stopped when the brakes were firmly pressed, I took them back to the garage 3 times over the next 12 months each time they heard the noise but told me everything looked fine. 

2 weeks ago I'd had enough of the noise and got a friend who works at a local garage to fit me new discs and pads again, he told me everything looked fine with the old ones but still fitted the new ones.

so today driving to work, I hear the same squeak as I first touched the pedal, brake pads still look untouched.

where could the problem lie on this one?

Hi Anthony.

I've just done three Cars brakes (my in law's, my dad's & my own).  Two were discs and pads.  I noticed on my own and my in law's they squeak since work has been done but not on my Dad's. All were copper greased and carrier grooves were cleaned.  The ONLY difference I've noted is that my Dad's car has the anti rattle metal clip things (they sit in the carrier grooves and hold the pads in tight) installed & the other two I did don't.  Could this be the problem?  In fact, on my in law's car I couldn't get them back in so left them off & prior to me doing the pads they didn't squeak but after they did.  

[antward91]

yes everything was cleaned and copper grease defiantly applied as I can still see it, where do I spray brake cleaner? is it corrosive to alloys? can I do it without taking wheels off ?

[antward91]

that could be it yes, would it be too late now to put them on? would I need to put in new pads?

[antward91]

2 minutes ago, Albert27 said:

Hi Anthony.

I've just done three Cars brakes (my in law's, my dad's & my own).  Two were discs and pads.  I noticed on my own and my in law's they squeak since work has been done but not on my Dad's. All were copper greased and carrier grooves were cleaned.  The ONLY difference I've noted is that my Dad's car has the anti rattle metal clip things (they sit in the carrier grooves and hold the pads in tight) installed & the other two I did don't.  Could this be the problem?  In fact, on my in law's car I couldn't get them back in so left them off & prior to me doing the pads they didn't squeak but after they did.  

that could be it yes, would it be too late now to put them on? would I need to put in new pads?

[Albert27]

5 minutes ago, antward91 said:

that could be it yes, would it be too late now to put them on? would I need to put in new pads?

I don't see why you'd need new pads so I think that would be fine. You would need wheel off to remove pads and to pop the clips in & then re install pads.

[antward91]

thanks alot mate, where do I get the clips from? are they a specific size for my car?

1 minute ago, Albert27 said:

I don't see why you'd new pads so I think that would be fine. You would need wheel off to remove pads and to pop the clips in & then re install pads.

thanks mate, where do I get the clips from? 

[andypsp]

9 minutes ago, antward91 said:

yes everything was cleaned and copper grease defiantly applied as I can still see it, where do I spray brake cleaner? is it corrosive to alloys? can I do it without taking wheels off ?

what make of pads and discs did you fit on car ?

brake cleaner can be sprayed through the gaps in your alloy wheels where you can see the pads. it won`t do any damage to your wheels etc

[Albert27]

Just now, antward91 said:

thanks alot mate, where do I get the clips from? are they a specific size for my car?

thanks mate, where do I get the clips from? 

No problem.  Good question as I've not sourced them myself but your local parts store like a motor factor or eurocarparts if you give them a ring.  Ebay even........  I think they're called brake pad retainer clips....

[antward91]

1 minute ago, andypsp said:

what make of pads and discs did you fit on car ?

brake cleaner can be sprayed through the gaps in your alloy wheels where you can see the pads. it won`t do any damage to your wheels etc

ferrodo pads and brake engineering discs

[antward91]

2 minutes ago, Albert27 said:

No problem.  Good question as I've not sourced them myself but your local parts store like a motor factor or eurocarparts if you give them a ring.  Ebay even........  I think they're called brake pad retainer clips....

I've found some that come in a pack of 4? is that enough for both front brakes or would I need 2 packs?

[Albert27]

Just now, antward91 said:

I've found some that come in a pack of 4? is that enough for both front brakes or would I need 2 packs?

It depends on the type.  If they look short you'd need 8 in total but most of the ones I've seen span both sets so you just need one on top & one on bottom on each wheel so 4 in total.  if you want to post the link to them I'll have a look.

[antward91]

6 minutes ago, Albert27 said:

It depends on the type.  If they look short you'd need 8 in total but most of the ones I've seen span both sets so you just need one on top & one on bottom on each wheel so 4 in total.  if you want to post the link to them I'll have a look.

I actually can't find any for my car specifically other than the caliper metal spring? if anyone else can it would be really apreciated

[Albert27]

4 minutes ago, antward91 said:

I actually can't find any for my car specifically other than the caliper metal spring? if anyone else can it would be really apreciated

This is the type of clip i mean but it's for a discovery.  Give your motor factors a ring or ECP to be sure....they may be universal, I don't know.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DISCOVERY-3-FRONT-BRAKE-PAD-RETAINER-ANTI-RATTLE-CLIPS-LR019625-/262124032748?epid=1388902095&hash=item3d07cf52ec:g:jrAAAOSw~bFWN0Hd

[antward91]

22 minutes ago, Albert27 said:

This is the type of clip i mean but it's for a discovery.  Give your motor factors a ring or ECP to be sure....they may be universal, I don't know.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DISCOVERY-3-FRONT-BRAKE-PAD-RETAINER-ANTI-RATTLE-CLIPS-LR019625-/262124032748?epid=1388902095&hash=item3d07cf52ec:g:jrAAAOSw~bFWN0Hd

thanks, from what I've just read on another forum this acts in the same way for my car? which is already fitted but I didn't change them when I had the brakes changed previously and I'm not 100 percent sure if the garage did the first time I had them changed. they're still inplace but maybe faulty? 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Genuine-Ford-Focus-Cabriolet-Brake-Caliper-Spring-1223635/1709769048?_trksid=p2047675.m4096.l9055

[Albert27]

8 minutes ago, antward91 said:

thanks, from what I've just read on another forum this acts in the same way for my car? which is already fitted but I didn't change them when I had the brakes changed previously and I'm not 100 percent sure if the garage did the first time I had them changed. they're still inplace but maybe faulty? 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Genuine-Ford-Focus-Cabriolet-Brake-Caliper-Spring-1223635/1709769048?_trksid=p2047675.m4096.l9055

That's the caliper spring not the retaining clips i was referring to.  If your car already has the brake pad retaining clips (not the caliper spring) i doubt it's that causing the issue.  

[antward91]

I just read that the caliper spring acts as the retaining clip on the 

3 minutes ago, Albert27 said:

That's the caliper spring not the retaining clips i was referring to.  If your car already has the brake pad retaining clips (not the caliper spring) i doubt it's that causing the issue.  

I just read that the caliper spring acts as the retaining clip on the mk 2 focus? 

http://www.talkford.com/community/topic/132935-brake-caliper-retaining-spring-clips/

[antward91]

just wanted to bring this up again , the noise was manageable up until last week when I went to Devon from Nottingham, did 500 motorway miles and 300 around town (very hilly) started getting a really loud squeal when braking lightly, it's quietness down alot since being back home but the noise seems to get worse when the brakes get hot ( no squealing until I've drove around 3 miles stopping and starting)

any ideas what could be the problem?

pads still look new from looking through the wheels, discs are fine, I've been cleaning the discs by spraying brake cleaner on the every 2/3 days (approx 60miles)

I've been told to get the brakes stripped, cleaned and greased again but I know they were done when I had the brakes changed around 3k miles ago, and the squeaking started about 800 miles after having them changed.

exact same problem now with 2 new sets on discs and pads.

really pulling my hair out, any help would be greatly appreciated. 

[Siye-ZS]

I doubt its the clips, i have always changed my own brake pads for years now and delt with this issue many times on my Fords. So if they have been installed correctly, cleaned, sanded on part of the caliper where the brakes sits/moved and fitted properly + copper ease, my guess is ***** break pads.  You cannot use old pads on new discs. Hopefully you have not done this as it can cause this issue for many many miles even with new pads as it creates grooves and a lip based on old discs and will take forever to bed to new pads. However you said new discs and pads together so im assuming its not this.

Cheap pads use different materials than other more expensive pads, the metal content in cheap pads can do this, maybe this could be your issue? If you have went for the cheaper pads, eBay pads or anything of that nature this may well be what it is. But i dont want to send you into a money pit, however pads are cheap so you should be ok. Is it both sides that make the noise? The brake setup on these cars are really simple it shouldnt be hard to spot what the issue will be, if you lived closer i would have taken a look for you. Please explain more if you can and maybe we can figure it out. There are not many things it can be to be honest.

Are the calipers painted?

Is there copper ease on each END of the pads and was the area sanded and cleaned off all dirt, also you need to put copper ease on the BACKS of the pads, copper ease is not just for greasing but it can stop vibrations which cause sound and believe me pads vibrate no matter what?

Are the new pads with the new discs and where the they cheapest ones (maybe case if both sides sqeek)?

Have you made 100% sure its from the front, people car swear the sqeeel is from the front but infact its from the rear?

 

 

 

 

[antward91]

1 hour ago, Siye-ZS said:

I doubt its the clips, i have always changed my own brake pads for years now and delt with this issue many times on my Fords. So if they have been installed correctly, cleaned, sanded on part of the caliper where the brakes sits/moved and fitted properly + copper ease, my guess is ***** break pads.  You cannot use old pads on new discs. Hopefully you have not done this as it can cause this issue for many many miles even with new pads as it creates grooves and a lip based on old discs and will take forever to bed to new pads. However you said new discs and pads together so im assuming its not this.

Cheap pads use different materials than other more expensive pads, the metal content in cheap pads can do this, maybe this could be your issue? If you have went for the cheaper pads, ebay pads or anything of that nature this may well be what it is. But i dont want to send you into a money pit, however pads are cheap so you should be ok. Is it both sides that make the noise? The brake setup on these cars are really simple it shouldnt be hard to spot what the issue will be, if you lived closer i would have taken a look for you. Please explain more if you can and maybe we can figure it out. There are not many things it can be to be honest.

Are the calipers painted?

Is there copper ease on each END of the pads and was the area sanded and cleaned off all dirt, also you need to put copper ease on the BACKS of the pads, copper ease is not just for greasing but it can stop vibrations which cause sound and believe me pads vibrate no matter what?

Are the new pads with the new discs and where the they cheapest ones (maybe case if both sides sqeek)?

Have you made 100% sure its from the front, people car swear the sqeeel is from the front but infact its from the rear?

 

 

 

 

thanks for replying , I replaced discs and pads, ferodo pads and brake engineering discs, middle of the road stuff. the calipers aren't painted.

the squeaking is defiantly the drivers side this time (it was passenger the first set of brakes I had done) sounds like the front , can't imagine it to be the back as it's drum brake on the rear.

my father in laws friend fitted the brakes for me, I could see he's defiantly used copper grease on the back of the pads, not sure about the sliders etc, but I didn't have a problem for the first 800 miles that's what is confusing me. surely if he's have not greased something they'd have squeaked straight away?

[Siye-ZS]

1 hour ago, antward91 said:

thanks for replying , I replaced discs and pads, ferodo pads and brake engineering discs, middle of the road stuff. the calipers aren't painted.

the squeaking is defiantly the drivers side this time (it was passenger the first set of brakes I had done) sounds like the front , can't imagine it to be the back as it's drum brake on the rear.

my father in laws friend fitted the brakes for me, I could see he's defiantly used copper grease on the back of the pads, not sure about the sliders etc, but I didn't have a problem for the first 800 miles that's what is confusing me. surely if he's have not greased something they'd have squeaked straight away?

Drums are notorious for noise due to brake dust, just make sure. If your saying "sounds like" i sence your not 100 percent. So its a all windows down job when your driving and making sure it is indeed the front drivers side.

If indeed its just the drivers side, take out the pads, sand everywhere where the pad make contact including the inside bit of the caliper where it makes contact with back of the pad and then use the copper ease covering all areas and dont be shy with it. Then sand the face of each pad evenly (not hard, just corse it up). Then go easy to bed the pad back in, dont slam on.  Also sand the outer edge of the disc if there is a lip forming on both sides dont be afaird to go hard on the disc. If you do this and it squeeks its the pads, get oem or a better brand, however if its just one side its probably down to vibration noise.

Once the pad makes a little contact (light braking) with the disc as you can imagine with the pads in there fixed position with no where to go and the force of the piston, its metal on metal so they vibrate, certain vibrations make sound, copper ease will solve this. There are other things you can use but copper ease will be enough if done properly. I suggest after sanding well making sure all the crap is removed from all areas, get a rag and break cleaner and leather it on and make sure its as clean as you can get it. With part of the caliper off you can also check how freely the pads will slide, some makes can be tight some can be loose. Just be observant, the brake setup like i said is quite simple. im sure if its just the one side then you have missed something, im guessing not sanding properly and maybe the back of the pads/ not sanding where it makes contact on the caliper or not enough copper ease, a little flick of it will NOT do, it needs to be applied properly. Crap can build up at the inside of the caliper where the back of the pads sit making the pad sit ever so slightly uneven which again can cause a noise. Sand everywhere, so its like new.  If you are not doing this yourself, make sure the person doing it doesnt take any shortcuts.

If you do this, which shouldnt take long atall and it still does it, then new pads. But im guessing with one side only making noise its due to something thats been missed, garages take many shortcuts and although they may do the correct job they take shortcuts. This is why i always do my own brakes, do the job properly first time and you should never have an issue. I suggest doing this yourself, if you want something done properly do it yourself. Then you wont have to mess with your brakes for a very long time. Hope you get it sorted.

 

[antward91]

5 hours ago, Siye-ZS said:

Drums are notorious for noise due to brake dust, just make sure. If your saying "sounds like" i sence your not 100 percent. So its a all windows down job when your driving and making sure it is indeed the front drivers side.

If indeed its just the drivers side, take out the pads, sand everywhere where the pad make contact including the inside bit of the caliper where it makes contact with back of the pad and then use the copper ease covering all areas and dont be shy with it. Then sand the face of each pad evenly (not hard, just corse it up). Then go easy to bed the pad back in, dont slam on.  Also sand the outer edge of the disc if there is a lip forming on both sides dont be afaird to go hard on the disc. If you do this and it squeeks its the pads, get oem or a better brand, however if its just one side its probably down to vibration noise.

Once the pad makes a little contact (light braking) with the disc as you can imagine with the pads in there fixed position with no where to go and the force of the piston, its metal on metal so they vibrate, certain vibrations make sound, copper ease will solve this. There are other things you can use but copper ease will be enough if done properly. I suggest after sanding well making sure all the crap is removed from all areas, get a rag and break cleaner and leather it on and make sure its as clean as you can get it. With part of the caliper off you can also check how freely the pads will slide, some makes can be tight some can be loose. Just be observant, the brake setup like i said is quite simple. im sure if its just the one side then you have missed something, im guessing not sanding properly and maybe the back of the pads/ not sanding where it makes contact on the caliper or not enough copper ease, a little flick of it will NOT do, it needs to be applied properly. Crap can build up at the inside of the caliper where the back of the pads sit making the pad sit ever so slightly uneven which again can cause a noise. Sand everywhere, so its like new.  If you are not doing this yourself, make sure the person doing it doesnt take any shortcuts.

If you do this, which shouldnt take long atall and it still does it, then new pads. But im guessing with one side only making noise its due to something thats been missed, garages take many shortcuts and although they may do the correct job they take shortcuts. This is why i always do my own brakes, do the job properly first time and you should never have an issue. I suggest doing this yourself, if you want something done properly do it yourself. Then you wont have to mess with your brakes for a very long time. Hope you get it sorted.

 

not 100 percent sure but from driving w8th the windows down it does sound like the drivers front, not 100 percent as it seems weird to have the same problem with 2 sets of brakes and 2 different people fitting them , that they both could miss something. makes me slightly think in the back of my mind it could possibly be the drum.

are copper grease and copper ease the same product?

are there any other products and recommended brands? I'm going to supply the person doing it for me the products so I know they've been used .

 

[antward91]

noticed driving home from work that after a hard stop, the squeak goes or quietens down alot, but only for the next 5 or 6 stops, very weird.

also I'm 75 percent sure it's front drivers, 25 rear drivers

[Siye-ZS]

5 hours ago, antward91 said:

not 100 percent sure but from driving w8th the windows down it does sound like the drivers front, not 100 percent as it seems weird to have the same problem with 2 sets of brakes and 2 different people fitting them , that they both could miss something. makes me slightly think in the back of my mind it could possibly be the drum.

are copper grease and copper ease the same product?

are there any other products and recommended brands? I'm going to supply the person doing it for me the products so I know they've been used .

 

Another way to check this is get a friend to stand at the end of a road and listen to you braking to idenify the noise. I have had the same issue, it can sound like the front and its the rear. So you can spend lots of time on the front and it wont even be the front. Although it doesnt matter how many people do the job, some people dont do the job properly. The slightest deposits of dirt etc can cause a noise. Copper ease can attract dirt over time, so if everything is not cleaned properly when fitting new pads, it may cause an issue. The smallest thing can cause this.... I have instances where everything looks all good and clean and its not. So give everything a proper clean and going over and the noise goes. Its annoying but if your thurra you should be fine. Before you do this make sure you know exactly where the noise is from.... Dont want to be doing the front drivers side wasting all your time and its not even that.
 

Hard braking may just stop the noise because of heat etc, i wouldnt be slamming on anyway when pads are first bedding in, this can cause noise in itself. Try this, put your handbrake slightly on maybe half way and then come to a stop . Make sure its just slightly on and engaged dont want to be doing as 360 on public roads. This should help you figure out if its the fronts.