2013 1.0l Ecoboost engine rust. Problem?

[dansallis]

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Has anyone worked out if there are a bad batch of pipes between certain dates or if it's due to a damp and salty location or something?  Can't understand why some are still perfect at the same age as others that look awful...   

We have seen no correlation between age, location or conditions between the cases posed on this thread so far. Some of us believe that it was a batch of material from the supplier that has been used across many years of the EcoBoost's life early Fiesta life.

[dom550]

I've checked my de-gas hose and I think it's the dodgy one which was recalled in the Focus. I'll post a photo later, but it looks the same style and is rusty and cracked.

Do we know whether this is considered the root cause of the rusty pipes on the turbo i.e. coolant gets out of the de-gas hose onto the turbo pipes, and causes/accelerates their rusting?

[isetta]

"Don't believe mine has ever been in a typically high-rust area!

Should I also be pushing for a replacement of my degas hose if it's the old style like this?
http://www.newtonnet.co.uk/permanent/ecoboostcorrodedcoolanthose.jpg
(thanks to MJNewton on here for the picture)
Don't want to send this off-topic, but am I right in thinking the two things might be potentially related..?"

 

I don't think there is any connectio between the two, but both have the same effect. Any leakage of coolant results in very quick disastrous consequences for this type of engine. 

The rust on yours does look bad, it is not superficial, it is eating into the pipe good and proper. In my opinion it is past the rust proof paint painting stage.

[dom550]

9 minutes ago, isetta said:

I don't think there is any connectio between the two, but both have the same effect. Any leakage of coolant results in very quick disastrous consequences for this type of engine. 

The rust on yours does look bad, it is not superficial, it is eating into the pipe good and proper. In my opinion it is past the rust proof paint painting stage.

Cheers, that would make sense. I thought somebody earlier mentioned that the rusting turbo pipes could be caused by exposure to something like coolant, so I was wondering if that could've come from the de-gas hose. But I might've picked that up wrong.

Either way, here are a couple pics of my de-gas hose. I think I'm right in saying it's the kind that was recalled for the Focus, and that I'll probably be needing it done along with my turbo! It's hard to show properly on a photo due to the angle, but that crack really doesn't look healthy..

Cameron Ecoboost2013 (who started this thread) also had both the turbo and de-gas hose replaced, so the problem parts possibly tend to come as a pair.

 

[dom550]

4 hours ago, dansallis said:

We have seen no correlation between age, location or conditions between the cases posed on this thread so far.

They do all seem to be pre-2014 in this thread? All 2013 in this thread I believe, but nothing to suggest that it *couldn't* affect ones earlier than that.

 

 

@TomsFocus

Quote

" I thought Scotland was always damp? "

Haha, there is that  But nah,  not near the coast, and it's not an area that's high rust due to salt or anything abnormal.

[dansallis]

On 11/7/2017 at 1:08 PM, Randall Flagg said:

And on that note here is a picture of the pipes in my 66 plate (13 months old) 125 Ecoboost. The rust is deep enough to flake off with a thumb nail.

 

13 hours ago, dom550 said:

They do all seem to be pre-2014 in this thread? All 2013 in this thread I believe, but nothing to suggest that it *couldn't* affect ones earlier than that.

This one above is a 66 plate from page 4. There are also a number of >2015 plates that have had this issue on the Facebook group.

[GaryPL]

And this is just what you can see of the inadequate cooling system on the 1.0 ecoboost. Some of the failures have apparently been down to failures of small internal components of the engine. Could this be down to corrosion too?

You'll get those who say that this is just a small sample of an engine that has sold millions. But this assumes that everybody who ever had this problem came to this forum. It also assumes everybody has checked their engine too.

It's pretty shocking that, in this day and age, rust is setting in on cars less than a year old in some cases. Especially on the cooling system which by its nature has water in it and goes through a heating, expansion, cooling, contraction cycle every time you fire up the car. By its nature the cooling system calls for high grade parts. Ford have clearly just been cutting corners or just not bothering with quality control. There should simply not be rust on these cars. Any of them - even the 4 year old ones.

My personal experience of Ford and from seeing stuff like this means I'm never going near the blue oval again.

[dansallis]

6 minutes ago, GaryPL said:

And this is just what you can see of the inadequate cooling system on the 1.0 ecoboost. Some of the failures have apparently been down to failures of small internal components of the engine. Could this be down to corrosion too?

You'll get those who say that this is just a small sample of an engine that has sold millions. But this assumes that everybody who ever had this problem came to this forum. It also assumes everybody has checked their engine too.

It's pretty shocking that, in this day and age, rust is setting in on cars less than a year old in some cases. Especially on the cooling system which by its nature has water in it and goes through a heating, expansion, cooling, contraction cycle every time you fire up the car. By its nature the cooling system calls for high grade parts. Ford have clearly just been cutting corners or just not bothering with quality control. There should simply not be rust on these cars. Any of them - even the 4 year old ones.

My personal experience of Ford and from seeing stuff like this means I'm never going near the blue oval again.

I don't mean to sound blunt, but you do seem to come to the forum to moan about Fords a lot.

Therefore, I will pose an argument on behalf of Ford...
We have no idea where the quality control issue may have originated from. It is quite likely to have been a supplier issue, in which the samples they sent Ford for prototype analysis and verification were of high quality and up to the job. When it came to supplying Ford with these components in high demand, they couldn't meet the standards and so, quality slipped. This happens more often than you think with our suppliers in the automotive sector.

Nevertheless, there are two sides to this argument (yours and mine) and it very well could have been either at fault. I just don't think you should jump to conclusions because you have had bad experience with Ford.

[GaryPL]

7 minutes ago, dansallis said:

I don't mean to sound blunt, but you do seem to come to the forum to moan about Fords a lot.

Therefore, I will pose an argument on behalf of Ford...
We have no idea where the quality control issue may have originated from. It is quite likely to have been a supplier issue, in which the samples they sent Ford for prototype analysis and verification were of high quality and up to the job. When it came to supplying Ford with these components in high demand, they couldn't meet the standards and so, quality slipped. This happens more often than you think with our suppliers in the automotive sector.

Nevertheless, there are two sides to this argument (yours and mine) and it very well could have been either at fault. I just don't think you should jump to conclusions because you have had bad experience with Ford.

I've never hidden the fact that I have an axe to grind. And this doesn't make my point any less relevant either.

And I'll counter your observation with one of my own. There are examples of this corrosion across several years worth of car. Even if Ford were to smother themselves in grease and say it's not their fault, they've obviously chosen to stick with whoever's supplied the defective parts.

However the cloth is cut, they have some culpability in this.

[GaryPL]

And slightly off topic but I feel I need to defend my actions. I don't hate any of Ford's cars (except the Ecosport because it's ugly).

I agree that the Fiesta is a fantastic car - great ride, great handling, good performance with the right engine, good equipment levels above base model. I understand why people buy them - I was one!

But Ford cost me a lot of time, money and caused a great deal of stress to me. They even set lawyers on me for reasons of their own ineptitude. It's not the cars I hate. It's the company and its practices.

[dom550]

2 hours ago, dansallis said:

This one above is a 66 plate from page 4. There are also a number of >2015 plates that have had this issue on the Facebook group.

Ah, I stand corrected! Thanks for pointing that out.

[Randall Flagg]

Yeah, that's a picture of the engine in my car. I haven't been into Ford yet but I'm not sure whether they'd be that interested in taking what is essentially preemptive action at this stage, anyway. On the plus side, I plenty of warranty left and excellent breakdown cover....

[dansallis]

11 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

... On the plus side, I plenty of warranty left and excellent breakdown cover....

Well, every cloud, as they say... 

Personally, I would just continue to harass them until they sorted it out. That level of damage should never happen on any 13 month old car. 

[MJNewton]

I opted for Halfords Very High Temperature Engine Enamel paint in the end:

It costs £7.49/750ml (obviously you only need a ml, if that!) and is rated to 300°C. It adheres well, dries quite quickly and is fully cured by heat.

I went for the matt black (other colours are available) to blend it into the hoses.

One thing I would say for those considering spray paint is that I would imagine it would be very difficult to spray the rear faces of the pipes as there's very little room around this area. It was hard enough with a brush (but certainly doable though so I'd recommend it).

[MJNewton]

1 hour ago, MJNewton said:

It costs £7.49/750ml

Apologies, that should've been £7.49/250ml.

[shel0707]

hi im lost I need to ask aquestion about my mk 6 catching fire on sunday 

it was a zetec s tdci and seem to be electrical under dash maybe 

very plastic smell 

[MJNewton]

Please start a new thread and I'm sure someone may be able to help out.

[dansallis]

12 hours ago, MJNewton said:

I opted for Halfords Very High Temperature Engine Enamel paint in the end:

It costs £7.49/250ml (obviously you only need a ml, if that!) and is rated to 300°C. It adheres well, dries quite quickly and is fully cured by heat.

I went for the matt black (other colours are available) to blend it into the hoses.

One thing I would say for those considering spray paint is that I would imagine it would be very difficult to spray the rear faces of the pipes as there's very little room around this area. It was hard enough with a brush (but certainly doable though so I'd recommend it).

Wow! That looks like a lovely and neat job! I think I will be getting some of the same stuff then 

[ThaiFiesta]

17 hours ago, MJNewton said:

I opted for Halfords Very High Temperature Engine Enamel paint in the end:

It costs £7.49/750ml (obviously you only need a ml, if that!) and is rated to 300°C. It adheres well, dries quite quickly and is fully cured by heat.

I went for the matt black (other colours are available) to blend it into the hoses.

One thing I would say for those considering spray paint is that I would imagine it would be very difficult to spray the rear faces of the pipes as there's very little room around this area. It was hard enough with a brush (but certainly doable though so I'd recommend it).

Did you end up taking the hoses off and painting the covered ends or just up to the level of the rubber hose?

[Overland]

My car has just gone past 3 years and 30,000 miles, so far those turbo cooling pipes look like new. The car is garaged so it starts dry under the bonnet, my daughter has had a couple of hand me downs in the past and I have been amazed how quickly the heads of screws holding heat shields and the like have corroded and almost disappeared in short order just because she can't garage it. Things that get hot and are made of steel often getting wet most days starting from cold and seem to get accelerated terminal rust problems. I have also noticed that cars  doing mostly main road winter driving suffer the most quicker, I believe its to do with the salted airborne mist being sucked in and drying on hot parts building up strong corrosive conditions and biting through that thin plated corrosion protective layer.

[Vendee]

On 12/5/2017 at 6:40 PM, MJNewton said:

I opted for Halfords Very High Temperature Engine Enamel paint in the end:

It costs £7.49/750ml (obviously you only need a ml, if that!) and is rated to 300°C. It adheres well, dries quite quickly and is fully cured by heat.

I went for the matt black (other colours are available) to blend it into the hoses.

 

 

Luckily I've got a tin of that in my shed (bought from Halfords about 15 years ago). I had already decided to use this to do my pipes. Its handy that it doesn't require any primer.

[MJNewton]

7 hours ago, ThaiFiesta said:

Did you end up taking the hoses off and painting the covered ends or just up to the level of the rubber hose?

I considered removing the hoses but was a little put off by the need for a partial drain down. Also, I figured that corrosion requires the presence of air and moisture and at least one of these wouldn't really be present underneath the hoses.

[MJNewton]

7 hours ago, Overland said:

[...] I have also noticed that cars  doing mostly main road winter driving suffer the most quicker, I believe its to do with the salted airborne mist being sucked in and drying on hot parts building up strong corrosive conditions and biting through that thin plated corrosion protective layer.

That could well be a factor. This Fiesta was born in Aberdeen and spent a few years there - I am assuming there are issues all year round what with salt spray and road salt.

[TomsFocus]

On 05/12/2017 at 6:40 PM, MJNewton said:

I opted for Halfords Very High Temperature Engine Enamel paint in the end:

It costs £7.49/750ml (obviously you only need a ml, if that!) and is rated to 300°C. It adheres well, dries quite quickly and is fully cured by heat.

I went for the matt black (other colours are available) to blend it into the hoses.

One thing I would say for those considering spray paint is that I would imagine it would be very difficult to spray the rear faces of the pipes as there's very little room around this area. It was hard enough with a brush (but certainly doable though so I'd recommend it).

Have you noticed the two nuts on the intake pipe in that picture...  Top one is still perfect, lower one is rusty and in line with the turbo coolant pipes..

So the damp salty air coming from the front through the grill looks like a good shout tbh!

[MJNewton]

Yes, they are significantly different. I suppose anything running down that section will impact the bottom nut+bolt the most but, yeah, perhaps it is more down to its extra exposure to what's coming through the grille.