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TomsFocus

Engine Vibrations - Gearbox Mount?

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So, I'm still getting through all the issues that I should've fixed 6 months ago... :laugh:  Focus Mk2.5 1.6TDCi.

I get a lot of engine vibration at idle and low rpm (under 1500).  This is really irritating for town and village driving as 30 in 4th and 40 in 5th are 1250rpm.  If I drop a gear and cruise over 1500rpm it's smooth but obviously noisier and less economical.  When stopping at junctions the idle is rough enough to rattle windows and dash plastics which is again annoying.  I had also lost some acceleration and top end so suspected MAF at fault.  New MAF has brought back the top end but made no difference to the bottom end vibrations.  Also suspected crank pulley but this was checked when I did the cambelt and is still fine.

It had a new top engine mount last year.  I'm wondering if the transmission mount has collapsed?  Does anyone know what type is fitted to the Mk2.5 1.6TDCi as there are a few options that all look similar from mk1 through to mk3.  Also has anyone found changing the mount reduces engine vibrations, especially in the cabin?

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15 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

So, I'm still getting through all the issues that I should've fixed 6 months ago... :laugh:  Focus Mk2.5 1.6TDCi.

I get a lot of engine vibration at idle and low rpm (under 1500).  This is really irritating for town and village driving as 30 in 4th and 40 in 5th are 1250rpm.  If I drop a gear and cruise over 1500rpm it's smooth but obviously noisier and less economical.  When stopping at junctions the idle is rough enough to rattle windows and dash plastics which is again annoying.  I had also lost some acceleration and top end so suspected MAF at fault.  New MAF has brought back the top end but made no difference to the bottom end vibrations.  Also suspected crank pulley but this was checked when I did the cambelt and is still fine.

It had a new top engine mount last year.  I'm wondering if the transmission mount has collapsed?  Does anyone know what type is fitted to the Mk2.5 1.6TDCi as there are a few options that all look similar from mk1 through to mk3.  Also has anyone found changing the mount reduces engine vibrations, especially in the cabin?

You really shouldnt drive at 30 in 4th, thats not good for the engine overall and isnt more eco. The petrol engines are 30 in 4th. Have you tried opening the bonnet with someone inside your car with the handbrake on and slightly accelerating and looking how much play there is with the engine. I have used this for mounts a few times. I have the same engine but the mk3 focus. Could you post a video of the vibration?

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I don't have any local friends lol, and with a FBW throttle can't rev the engine from the bay either.  I did take some videos but the frame rate isn't really quick enough to see, there is obviously a noticeable back and forward movement there though, even if the camera doesn't pick up how many times it's actually happening - if that makes any sense lol.

One thing I miss from the 'decent' petrols I've briefly owned is being able to drive everywhere in top gear (either 5th or 6th depending on car), the diesel Focus requires constant gearchanges to keep the noise down and the economy up.  I must admit, I tend to do a little over the indicated 30 or 40 on the gauge as it's not totally accurate, sat nav says it's about 33mph for 30 on the gauge in mine, it's about 1250rpm as I said in the OP, much higher than the anti-stall which it will happily roll along on as well.  I would drop a gear for a hill or if I needed a sudden burst of acceleration, this is just for steady, flat cruising which I do quite a lot of...Suffolk is fairly flat!

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27 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

sat nav says it's about 33mph for 30 on the gauge

I assume you mean 33 on the gauge for 30 on the satnav? That's fairly typical as speedos normally over-read by a few mph to allow for variations in roadwheed radius with tyre wear and pressure and ensure you don't inadvertently exceed the speed limits.

Our 1.8HE petrol will run comfortably at 30 in top gear (5th) and pull away cleanly. With the Ecoboost I have to drop from 6th to 5th at anything much below 40. 20mph limits are a real fuel waster!

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32 minutes ago, mjt said:

I assume you mean 33 on the gauge for 30 on the satnav? That's fairly typical as speedos normally over-read by a few mph to allow for variations in roadwheed radius with tyre wear and pressure and ensure you don't inadvertently exceed the speed limits.

Our 1.8HE petrol will run comfortably at 30 in top gear (5th) and pull away cleanly. With the Ecoboost I have to drop from 6th to 5th at anything much below 40. 20mph limits are a real fuel waster!

Yeah, that's just my poor wording lol.  33mph on the gauge for 30 as a real speed, also confirmed by those flashing speed signs as well. It's about 10% out all round on this but does vary between cars/wheels etc as you say.

I think the issue with the turbo engines, particularly small capacity ones, is that all the torque comes when you're on boost, fine for joining slip roads or cruising at speed, but not ideal for low speed cruising.

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Make sure your exhaust bracket nearest the engine (part of manifold) is intact as seems like the same issues I had.

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20 minutes ago, F0CUE said:

Make sure your exhaust bracket nearest the engine (part of manifold) is intact as seems like the same issues I had.

Not sure which bracket you mean?  Have you got a picture?

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35 minutes ago, F0CUE said:

Make sure your exhaust bracket nearest the engine (part of manifold) is intact as seems like the same issues I had.

It snapped on my wife's 1.8 petrol (MK2) and caused a vibration as well as a horrible metallic twisting sound when power was initially applied.  The garage welding it back on did the trick.

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On ‎10‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 10:15 AM, TomsFocus said:

I don't have any local friends lol, and with a FBW throttle can't rev the engine from the bay either.  I did take some videos but the frame rate isn't really quick enough to see, there is obviously a noticeable back and forward movement there though, even if the camera doesn't pick up how many times it's actually happening - if that makes any sense lol.

One thing I miss from the 'decent' petrols I've briefly owned is being able to drive everywhere in top gear (either 5th or 6th depending on car), the diesel Focus requires constant gearchanges to keep the noise down and the economy up.  I must admit, I tend to do a little over the indicated 30 or 40 on the gauge as it's not totally accurate, sat nav says it's about 33mph for 30 on the gauge in mine, it's about 1250rpm as I said in the OP, much higher than the anti-stall which it will happily roll along on as well.  I would drop a gear for a hill or if I needed a sudden burst of acceleration, this is just for steady, flat cruising which I do quite a lot of...Suffolk is fairly flat!

i can see the rocking, not sure the lower mount will make a difference, even if it was buggered, wouldn't it only be noticeable under torque? at a steady 800RPM it should be fairly balanced. the rocking looks almost rhythmic in nature, could the flywheel be off balance perhaps?

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I was thinking the left hand mount under the battery could be allowing the movement.  But as the usual places like ECP and misterauto dont seem to stock it was makes me think it's not a common issue.

The lower one usually causes jerky throttle and gear changes which I don't really have, stiff and notchy yeah but not jerky lol.  I agree that's not likely to be causing this issue.

The odd thing is it's more noticeable once the engine has shifted forward, if I brake firmly as the lights change for example.  If I gently ease on the brake while parking it's still there but not as much.  This makes me think it must be a mount causing the issue.

It could well be the DMF, but let's hope not.  There's no knocking or clattering, just the light scuffing of clutch plates coming into contact when tested off load.  

There is also a heavy rolling movement which seems worse since the belt change, sort of like a bad driveshaft but without any noise.  Struggling to work out if it's the car or the road surfaces though...they seem to be adding a washboard finish to the tarmac lately and have done large pieces of the A12/A14 recently.  I did rotate tyres at the same time so wondered if it was a wonky tyre that I've moved forward.  It does seem to worse under load though rather than just speed, which rules out tyre, but could be DMF/diff/driveshaft related.  

Whilst I've got a reasonable understanding of how things go together and what can cause which faults, I really suck at actually pinpointing faults like this. :unsure:

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6 hours ago, 1979Damian said:

It snapped on my wife's 1.8 petrol (MK2) and caused a vibration as well as a horrible metallic twisting sound when power was initially applied.  The garage welding it back on did the trick.

Yeh and exhaust hit the petrol tank on corners and since mines got welded the backbox one broke and is tied with a jubilee atm 😁 

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6 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Not sure which bracket you mean?  Have you got a picture?

Sorry was at work. If it's the same you will only see it on a ramp. The manifold/ flexi combo has a bracket that mounts onto the frame just before the silencer.

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I have MK2 1,6ti-vct (2006). I changed motor mounts last year at 190 000 km. All were perished and the gearbox mount was on worst condition of them all. I got mine from Fordparts UK and their sales help told me which one I needed according my cars VIN number.

Since your car is only 2 years younger I would suspect that you should change them all.

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13 hours ago, F0CUE said:

Sorry was at work. If it's the same you will only see it on a ramp. The manifold/ flexi combo has a bracket that mounts onto the frame just before the silencer.

Ah ok, you mean the bracket on the other bolt here?  Best picture I've got from changing the DPF before lol.  I'd forgotten about that one, it does seem a bit odd to separate the whole engine and gearbox with rubber mounts than attach part of the exhaust straight the chassis... :unsure: 

IMAG4208.thumb.jpg.5d5104243686f1dcef1d5ee9e5a56120.jpg

2 hours ago, Tonis_T said:

I have MK2 1,6ti-vct (2006). I changed motor mounts last year at 190 000 km. All were perished and the gearbox mount was on worst condition of them all. I got mine from Fordparts UK and their sales help told me which one I needed according my cars VIN number.

Since your car is only 2 years younger I would suspect that you should change them all.

It is younger but only done 74,000 miles so far.  Don't suppose you have a picture of the gearbox mount under the battery?

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I have vibration inside my focus 1.8 HE started a couple of years ago nothing major but noticeable also noticed a different clunk on pulling away so maybe I have broken exhaust bracket.  Which one was broken on your focus????

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2 hours ago, JONATHAN_11_80 said:

I have vibration inside my focus 1.8 HE started a couple of years ago nothing major but noticeable also noticed a different clunk on pulling away so maybe I have broken exhaust bracket.  Which one was broken on your focus????

For once, I never looked.  I'll take a look when I get chance, I'm sure I should be able to spot the hanger that has been recently welded! :biggrin:

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20 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

It is younger but only done 74,000 miles so far.  Don't suppose you have a picture of the gearbox mount under the battery?

No, I did not take pictures. But if one of your mounts had to be changed already, then the chances are that others are bust also.

However I noticed the problem when I had loud vibrations after clutch change. It turned out that garage had stripped the mount threads of the gearbox mount. I had to helicoil the treads to be able to change the mount. It was an aluminium piece with aluminium threads and it can be easily stripped when unscrewing the bolt.

Even tho I noticed vibrations after stripped thread mounts were still totally worn out and the improvement after new mounts was much greater than I expected.

Just fair warning of the thread thingy.

 

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So quick update of this.

The engine vibrations appear to be all top end now I've watched from underneath/sides, gearbox and exhaust mounts seem to be good with very little movement at idle at least, just the top of the engine that's wobbling around a lot.  Had a genuine brand new top engine mount last year and it hasn't leaked so should still be ok but that's where the vibes seem to be...though if that mount is doing its job, those vibrations shouldn't be coming into the cabin so not sure what to think about that really.  

 

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