Fiesta EcoBoost 1.0 (CN65 plate)

[shadowwebs]

Good Evening all,

My first post here so please feel free to point me in the direction of any extra information I should be providing and whilst I stick around the forum I will of course try and help others if I can 🙂

I have owned a Ford Fiesta CN65 plate for nearly 2 years now, I bought it second hand from Evans Halshaw in Leicester and all has been fine and good.  

At the end of August 2018 it went for it's first MOT and I paid for a Gold service at my local garage, the MOT all passed and I haven't received any details regarding the service checks.  Back in October my car started to break down and The AA came out to say they suspect the starter motor was playing up, but they got me going again, later the same day, it stopped working.  I was advised to take it to my local Ford Dealership, they held on to it for a few days and couldn't find any faults... I was advised to drive with the Stop / Start disabled which I have been doing ever since.

When I say the car breaks down, it's only if the car is in a stopped state, either if stop / start kicked in and then it won't spring back to life, or if I am starting up the car from cold.  The engine temperature meter shows as zero with no temperature reading... I have checked and I do have coolant in the car at the required level.

The car stopped working again tonight twice, when I came out of work at 5pm my car wouldn't start up, however many times I turned the key, I got the click sound but wouldn't start up.  I then turned the key half way to get the electrics going in the car, pushed the stop / start disable button, waited a few seconds and turned the key again and it started up after a couple of attempts.  The car got me home, I have left it cold outside for 2 hours and then tried to startup the car with the same issue that if I press stop / start disable, wait a few seconds the car will start up.

As the colder weather is soon coming, I obviously want to see what I can do, but with the local Ford Dealership happy to charge me for Diagnostics but without any answers, I wonder whether I should be doing that again in a hurry.

I still have the Evans Halhaw guarantee that I paid extra for, so that'll be my next step to attempt.

Thanks for any advice anyone can provide 🙂

James
 - Leicester

[DG97]

Hi, 

In my rare experiences with the AA, when it comes to issues such as this, they can be quite accurate with their assumption to what the issue is. 

From what you say, the issue sounds like either the starter motor giving way or the battery needing replacement. Though if after multiple attempts, the car can eventually start up, I'd be looking at the starter motor. 

In all fairness, the advice you received from Ford of just switching the start stop system off and not using it is quite poor. It's part of the car and something isn't working so they should make an attempt at fixing it.

If they couldn't find any faults the first time round, i'd personally be hesitant to pay them more for diagnostics. As the issue doesn't sound super complex, I'd probably just take the car to a local but well-respected independent mechanic, tell them the AA thought it could be the starter motor and let them take a look. 

You mention you have paid for a warranty which I would use in the first place as assuming it's a full warranty, that should take care of a starter motor replacement. 

[shadowwebs]

Thanks for taking the time to reply, I have had The AA out again today and they have repeated with the advice of it being a Starter Motor, it's now been driven to Evans Halshaw where I have the extended warranty with.  They won't provide me a courtesy car or any advice on cost or timeframe, so will see what happens next really.

Even though the car is only just outside the Ford own 3 year warranty, is it worth me trying to argue that the faulty started only a few weeks outside the warranty or do you think they won't really care?

[Eric Bloodaxe]

On my previous car (SEAT) I had a similar issue and that turned out to be a fault in the starter motor so that does seem to be a likely candidate. The car was 3 days old at the time so dealt with under warranty in that case.

It would be reasonable to expect some goodwill from the manufacturer on a car just outside warranty, provided it has been correctly serviced etc. However, from the experience of folks on here Ford may well not care but still worth a try particularly if you have a supportive dealer, though from your comments it sounds like they're not being the most helpful either!

[DG97]

If you have an extended warranty with Evans Halshaw and it’s effectively a “bumper to bumper” cover, the starter I would have thought would be included in that regardless of if the original car warranty has expired. 

If your extended warranty covers the starter motor, I wouldn’t expect to pay a penny for it in all honesty, it’s worth you check 🙂 

As you have the extended warranty, you should have to worry about the original warranty having expired, I guess it’s partially the point of an extended warranty! 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

6 minutes ago, DG97 said:

 

🙂

As you have the extended warranty, you should have to worry about the original warranty having expired, I guess it’s partially the point of an extended warranty! 

Sorry, missed the bit about the extended warranty in the OP - would have thought that should cover something like a starter motor.

[shadowwebs]

It's with Evans Halshaw but will see what they come back with, they said the car won't be looked at until Monday and cannot sort me out a courtesy car as this has to be done through the warranty company... not exactly helpful but will hold out to try and reach them as at the moment the phone number is down.

[isetta]

has it ever failed to start when the start/stop has been turned off?  if not, then it does not sound like starter motor fault unless it is a total coincidence that it decides to behave at that time.

But if you get the click then it does sound more like starter motor. can you tell where the click is - is it actually the starter motor clicking - I appreciate might not be 100% easy to tell unless you get someone to help and a head is stuck under bonnet. 

(I have start/stop, I hate it, I always turn it off when I get in car if I remember, sometimes I forget and then panic when the engine stops. Sometimes the engine stops even if I am rolling down hill in neutral (slowly) at a queue to a roundabout which is on my usual journey to work. And then the power steering stops working - I wouldn't have thought it should stop the engine if I have not 100% totally stopped.  I would like it if I could disable it permanently - is there a way using Forscan or something like that?)

 

 

[jbell]

1 hour ago, isetta said:

Sometimes the engine stops even if I am rolling down hill in neutral (slowly) at a queue to a roundabout which is on my usual journey to work. And then the power steering stops working - I wouldn't have thought it should stop the engine if I have not 100% totally stopped.  I would like it if I could disable it permanently

 

 

Keep it in gear with clutch down rather than coasting and that problem will go away. 

[isetta]

 I could do that but that's not good for the clutch release bearing. And bearing in mind how much work is involved in getting to the clutch release bearing it is best to try to make it last as long as possible. 

[shadowwebs]

The car has never cut out and stopped working, unless stop / start was enabled.  I don't know exactly where the clutch is, but when The AA came out today, they opened the bonnet and were only able to get the car going again by giving it a rolling start by pushing it along the road whilst trying the ignition constantly and eventually it kicked back in.

[Eric Bloodaxe]

9 hours ago, shadowwebs said:

The car has never cut out and stopped working, unless stop / start was enabled.  

That's exactly what was happening with my SEAT - apparently it was an internal short within the starter motor which affected the stop/start system, though the starter would still function independently if the system was disabled. I would imagine all these systems are similar.

(I'm a bit vague on modern starter motors - until the issue with the SEAT, not actually had a problem with one since my Mk 1 Cortina on which I had to replace the Bendix gear at regular intervals!)

 

[shadowwebs]

I have just been on hold with the Warranty team for over 15 minutes to try and get through and no answer... probably not open today but Evans Halshaw said they would transfer me through anyway... all fun and games.

[Luke4efc]

You're no good talking to someone on the phone. You need to get your ***** down to Evans Halshaw and kick off in person.

[martyntdci]

Kicking off won't sort owt. Just be calm collected but stern. Whilst it's there read the t&c's on the extended warrenty as they will probably say this is not covered with the warranty you purchased.... Then read up where you stand with trading standards etc... 

[DG97]

Without knowing all the details of how you got your warranty, it's hard to say exactly what to do but as others say, if Evans Halshaw sold you the warranty, go there and be firm in telling them to get their act together. Without them actually having a proper diagnosis in the first place, I doubt ringing up will do much if you don't have a confirmed diagnosis of the issue. 

[shadowwebs]

My own thought is to hold off until end of day Monday when they should have completed the diagnosis and will hopefully be able to tell me whether it's covered in the warranty.  I know that the battery won't be covered as they never are, but I cannot see any mention of the Starter Motor in the warranty as an exclusion, so would hope that is covered.

I bought the extended 2 year warranty on the same day I bought the car, it was sold to me as being a Ford warranty, but obviously that's probably ignorance on my part and a bit of clever selling tactic on their part, as they told me I could take the car to any Ford dealership in the country if I needed work doing and it would be covered, only to find that back in October when I did this, the warranty wouldn't cover it as the garage I went to wouldn't work to the maximum £40 per hour including VAT work rate, and so I had to cover the cost myself for the diagnostics which came back all fine.

I have a feeling that Evans will tell me its a battery fault, as that would be chargeable, even though The AA and the other dealers ran checks and confirmed the battery is fine and is more likely to be a starter motor fault.

[Eric Bloodaxe]

According to the Ford website, the "official" Ford extended warranty would cover started motor etc, so it sounds as if you have been sold a 3rd party extended warranty. If they have passed this off as a Ford warranty when selling it to you, it may well be worth a chat with your local Trading Standards.

 

 

[shadowwebs]

I would do that, but I expect it'll all come down to T&C's

[shadowwebs]

To add, my car is being looked at by an Evans Halshaw engineer since around 12 today, but there is no update yet.

[shadowwebs]

It gets better... as The AA got my car working on Friday, the car is now working absolutely fine with Evans Halshaw and they cannot find any issues other than wanting to recharge my battery and replace the coolant cap, both of which are chargeable.

They cannot find any issues with the Starter Motor as the car is starting without any issues.

Looks like i'm not going to get any help, anytime soon

[Luke4efc]

Wouldn't bother getting them to charge the battery, you do that as you're driving along for basically free. Have you had the battery tested? I know pretty much any warranty wont cover battery failure.

[DG97]

Agreed with the above, not worth paying to charge a battery. The coolant cap won't have much relevance to your issue but did they say why they want to replace it? 

I suppose when it next occurs you could get a recording of the car not starting and show it to them or get a second opinion at a different garage. 

[shadowwebs]

It would appear that my last response didn't post.. my car did go to another Ford approved dealer local to me in October when the issues first started and they couldn't find any issue either due to the fact it was intermittent... I think it could be a losing battle due to the "intermittent" nature

[shadowwebs]

I emailed the MD of Evans Halshaw and although I haven't had a reply, I also contacted Ford customer relations and suddenly, after a few hours, Evans Halshaw rang to say they have a courtesy car for me and a starter motor on order.