Cornering Lights

[quaffa]

Hi All.

Just bought a brand new Fiesta Titanium, (collected on 20th December), and I opted to have the factory-fitted LED headlamps, which I am very pleased with.

However, having spent the extra on that option for beautifully pure white lights at the front, when I actually got the car I discovered that it has 'cornering lamps', which come on when the steering wheel is turned, and these are not LED units. So that pure white look that I wanted is compromised by these (relatively) yellowy-cream halogen lamps coming on at one side or the other. They look really naff.

If they were of any use I wouldn't mind so much, but they are completely useless. I cannot detect any extra illumination on either side when I am driving the car at all, presumably because they're so much dimmer than my LED headlamps.

Does anyone know:-

1. Is there some new EU regulation that requires new cars to be fitted with these silly lamps?
2. Are they the same lamps as the fog-lamps, but coming on independently? (The user-manual is not 100% clear on this, referring to them separately, but I only see one lamp on each side.)
3. Is there any way to disable them without removing the bulbs?
4. If the answers to (1) & (3) are 'No', would removing the bulbs cause any knock-on problems, such as system error messages being thrown up or the like?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Nismex]

Didn't know this either, just had a look, not sure if its H8 or H11 bulbs for the front fogs, I guess you could change the bulbs for LED ones?

[Jonro2009]

Congratulations on the new car! I would be disappointed with that too.

as far as I know the bulbs are the same for fogs and turning lamps, you can use either H8 or H11 as they are very similar - one will be a tighter fit than the other though. 

Putting LED Bulbs in would certainly fix the colour match issue but will lead to other compromises. The main ones being your actual fog lamp effectiveness, the yellow(ish) halogen bulbs cut through fog much more efficiently whereas LED Bulbs tend to reflect off fog and make visibility worse. 

I would look at something like this https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07FXKDTZ7/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_BFJoCb7TCCK85

if you remove the bulbs and leave them disconnected then you will get error messages on the dash, you may be able to deactivate them via Forscan though. There is no legislation as far as I am aware, happy to be corrected though. If you look the lights both come on when you select reverse too, as long as the headlights are on.

[quaffa]

Thanks for that Jon; really appreciated.

I am currently not minded to replace the bulbs with LEDs, both for the reason you give and also because I believe that there may now be a requirement that LEDs are only allowed to be fitted in units with reflectors specifically designed for them. But then again I wouldn't be happy with continual error messages if I remove the bulbs either, so it's looking like deciding the lesser of two evils... 😖

What is Forscan? I've never heard of that.

At the risk of playing my own devil's advocate, I cannot think of a single occasion when I used the front fog lights on my last Fiesta during the four years that I had it, and so maybe the 'LEDs reflecting fog' argument loses some validity. Also, when I've used them in the past on cars I've never had the headlights switched on at the same time, because they reflex-reflect the fog, being higher, and therefore closer to one's eye-level. But the large, brighter LED DRLs will be on at that level anyway, so...

The ideal, of course, would be to disable the silly and pointless 'cornering' function, leaving the halogen fog lights purely for use in fog, but it seems that is unlikely to be an option.

[Jonro2009]

No problem. 

The bulbs I have linked to are not LED they are halogen and ‘should’ be close enough to the colour of the headlights to make you happier. A lot of people choose this bulb (H7/H1/H15) for their headlights because they don’t want to use an HID/LED kit. 

You are right, an aftermarket HID or LED conversion kit is now an MOT fail because the lamp housing is not type approved for the new bulb so not road legal. As far as I am aware there are no LED/HID bulbs that are actually individually type approved unless they are in the correct housing - something to do with EU law, who knows what will happen after Brexit there. They were only allowed over here due to the fact that foreign cars had them and any overseas tourists and their vehicles would not be road legal in this country, or so I read.

Forscan, which thinking about it may not be suitable for the Fez, is a software programme that allows you to read the cars ECU and modules. You can then make changes to the cars coding and activate/deactivate lots of different things, you can also read and clear DTC’s.

in the dense fog you don’t always use your headlights but you would always have your side lights on so that you can use your front and rear fog lights, this means that your DRLs wouldn’t be on their brightest setting anyway. 

 

[TimST2]

Am I the only one who finds cornering lamps annoying? Every time I see a car coming around a corner with one fog light on I just think "Why?".

[quaffa]

1 hour ago, TimST2 said:

Am I the only one who finds cornering lamps annoying? Every time I see a car coming around a corner with one fog light on I just think "Why?".

No you are most definitely not!

[quaffa]

9 hours ago, Jonro2009 said:

in the dense fog you don’t always use your headlights but you would always have your side lights on so that you can use your front and rear fog lights, this means that your DRLs wouldn’t be on their brightest setting anyway.   

Ahh.. You see, I didn't realise that the DRLs dimmed like that! All these fancy automatic light settings take some getting used to, particularly as it is not easy to see what the lights are doing from behind the wheel... I come from an era when lights had two settings: On or Off.

Thanks for that link. I admit I hadn't followed it initially because I thought it was to LEDs. There is still the down-side, presumably, of them making the stupid, unloved cornering lamps even more noticeable. Oh! I really do wish Ford had written a line of extra software to give the option of disabling the things!

[quaffa]

I have now ordered myself some of the Osram 'Night Breaker Laser' H8s, so I will see how I go on with those in the fog lamps.

While I think about it though, does anyone have any idea if these 'cornering' lamps are speed-governed? What I mean is, do they only come on below a certain speed when one is manoeuvring, or do they come on when driving at normal speed down a twisty-ish lane? If they are so governed, does anyone know the cut-off speed, please?

And I assume they only come on when headlamps or side lamps are switched on. Is that correct?

[Jonro2009]

You won’t be disappointed with the bulbs, they will be a huge improvement over what you have there now. 

The cornering lights are indeed speed governed, I believe it is somewhere around 18mph although I’m not 100% sure. They will come on whilst going round roundabouts and things like that, they will both come on when reverse gear is selected too.

The cornering lights will illuminate only when the headlights are on, the sidelights and DRLs alone do not trigger them. To be fair though you will never really have just sidelights illuminated anyway if you use the ‘auto’ light setting.

in case you haven’t noticed when indicating the DRL on the corresponding Side will dim right down, just another new fangled thing lol

[quaffa]

2 hours ago, Jonro2009 said:

You won’t be disappointed with the bulbs, they will be a huge improvement over what you have there now. 

I certainly hope so; thanks very much for the tip. (If they don't impress I suppose I will have to go 'illegal' with LEDs. (Actually, doesn't that new rule only apply to LED headlamps?)

2 hours ago, Jonro2009 said:

The cornering lights are indeed speed governed, I believe it is somewhere around 18mph although I’m not 100% sure. They will come on whilst going round roundabouts and things like that, they will both come on when reverse gear is selected too.

Now that sounds like an incentive to always try to go round roundabouts faster than 18mph!

Reverse gear? I'd like to see Ford, or anyone, come up with any logical reason for that... But I always switch my headlights off when I reverse in any case, so I won't be troubled by that particular piece of buffoonery.

Thanks again.

[Jonro2009]

Ah, now I can answer that question too! The reason behind having the cornering lights coming on when reversing is so that the driver can see any low level walls, plants or high kerbs etc. when the front end of the car is swinging round.

[quaffa]

Goodness! However did we all manage without them...?

[Jonro2009]

How indeed lol


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[BJT]

On 1/14/2019 at 9:02 PM, quaffa said:

Goodness! However did we all manage without them...?

Also you should be fine with the MOT I have had LED lights fitted to my fog lights and it passed 

[quaffa]

4 hours ago, BJT said:

Also you should be fine with the MOT I have had LED lights fitted to my fog lights and it passed 

Ah, that is reassuring, thanks.

Do the LEDs fade up and down when they come on and go off as cornering lights, in the same way that the factory-fitted halogens seem to do, or do they just come straight on and go straight off?

[Mavroz]

On 1/14/2019 at 9:02 PM, quaffa said:

Goodness! However did we all manage without them...?

Like anything else, once you get used to them, you end up liking them and wonder why they wasn't on cars years ago.

I like cornering lights and think they are useful.

How did we manage without mobile phones, computers, central heating and even cars eh?

[BJT]

15 hours ago, quaffa said:

Ah, that is reassuring, thanks.

Do the LEDs fade up and down when they come on and go off as cornering lights, in the same way that the factory-fitted halogens seem to do, or do they just come straight on and go straight off?

They still fade in and out but not quite as smoothly if that makes sense.

[quaffa]

Ta.

[Jonro2009]

LEDs aren’t really designed to ‘fade’ really, they look a little jumpy and seem to go down in increments. The newer CREE and COB ones will fade smoothly. 

You have gone for the Osrams though so they will fade like OEM ones do. 

When do they arrive?

[quaffa]

Well, I tried fitting my new bulbs this morning...

The user manual makes it sound so simple:- "Use a suitable tool, for example a screwdriver, to carefully remove the wheel-arch liner fasteners. Pull the liner back toward the tire [sic] to gain access to the bulb." This suggests [to me anyway] that the liners merely clip on.

The first problem here is that they do not clip on, but are secured by three 10mm nuts and one of those star-shaped screws. Two of the nuts came out easily enough, but the second problem is that, even with the steering at full-lock, there isn't enough space between the tyre and the third nut to fit a socket spanner into the gap. And the same applies to the star-shaped screw; not enough room to correctly align the screwdriver up to it, because the tyre is in the way.

And so, contrary to the user manual, I reckon that removal of the front wheel is necessary in order to change a front fog lamp bulb. I don't regard that as the pinnacle of good design, to be honest, and I gave up at this stage.

My options, I think, are to try and get the dealer to replace the bulbs, or to go to a local garage and get the job done there. And, as I'm sure neither will fit non-road-legal LEDs, I won't have that option if the Osram Night Breakers are not up to expectation.

Not a happy bunny...

[Jonro2009]

I think if you turn the wheel to full lock it actually makes it tighter than if you just give the wheel one full turn.

i saw these bulbs, it doesn’t say they are road legal but it also doesn’t say they aren’t.

 

https://www.carenhancementsuk.co.uk/products/enhanced-edition-led-h8-11-fog-unit

[BJT]

54 minutes ago, quaffa said:

Well, I tried fitting my new bulbs this morning...

The user manual makes it sound so simple:- "Use a suitable tool, for example a screwdriver, to carefully remove the wheel-arch liner fasteners. Pull the liner back toward the tire [sic] to gain access to the bulb." This suggests [to me anyway] that the liners merely clip on.

The first problem here is that they do not clip on, but are secured by three 10mm nuts and one of those star-shaped screws. Two of the nuts came out easily enough, but the second problem is that, even with the steering at full-lock, there isn't enough space between the tyre and the third nut to fit a socket spanner into the gap. And the same applies to the star-shaped screw; not enough room to correctly align the screwdriver up to it, because the tyre is in the way.

And so, contrary to the user manual, I reckon that removal of the front wheel is necessary in order to change a front fog lamp bulb. I don't regard that as the pinnacle of good design, to be honest, and I gave up at this stage.

My options, I think, are to try and get the dealer to replace the bulbs, or to go to a local garage and get the job done there. And, as I'm sure neither will fit non-road-legal LEDs, I won't have that option if the Osram Night Breakers are not up to expectation.

Not a happy bunny...

Yeah it’s a bit of a pain but managed to replace my brothers fog lights without moving the wheel we had a bit of a problem with the one further in the wheel arch as said make sure the wheel is turned to lock and then when ***** the bolts out use a bit of strength to twist them. I think you will need a T20 torqes star tool 

[jamkart]

2 hours ago, quaffa said:

Well, I tried fitting my new bulbs this morning...

The user manual makes it sound so simple:- "Use a suitable tool, for example a screwdriver, to carefully remove the wheel-arch liner fasteners. Pull the liner back toward the tire [sic] to gain access to the bulb." This suggests [to me anyway] that the liners merely clip on.

The first problem here is that they do not clip on, but are secured by three 10mm nuts and one of those star-shaped screws. Two of the nuts came out easily enough, but the second problem is that, even with the steering at full-lock, there isn't enough space between the tyre and the third nut to fit a socket spanner into the gap. And the same applies to the star-shaped screw; not enough room to correctly align the screwdriver up to it, because the tyre is in the way.

And so, contrary to the user manual, I reckon that removal of the front wheel is necessary in order to change a front fog lamp bulb. I don't regard that as the pinnacle of good design, to be honest, and I gave up at this stage.

My options, I think, are to try and get the dealer to replace the bulbs, or to go to a local garage and get the job done there. And, as I'm sure neither will fit non-road-legal LEDs, I won't have that option if the Osram Night Breakers are not up to expectation.

Not a happy bunny...

According to this video guide you don't need access via the wheel arch:

 

[quaffa]

Thanks Martin.

I had seen the CEUK video, and indeed CEUK is where I sourced my LED H11s, but their video shows them being fitted to a Fiesta ST, which has a completely different fog lamp installation to that on the standard Fiesta.

As far as I know they haven't done a similar video for the standard Fiesta. 🙁