Stophen

Ford Focus Mk2 DPF Error Code P2463 'DPF - Excessive Soot Accumulation'

Recommended Posts

If my oil level was above the Max mark I would not drive my car until some oil was drained off and I would definitely not even attempt a Static Regeneration if the level was high because of Diesel contamination.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Stophen said:

It seems they also produce a certificate to present at an MOT and the price doesn't seem to bad either.

From what I'm reading about this services is the DPF will need to be deleted from the ECU and then re-added / mapped. I'm guessing this is something that is beyond the limitations of FORScan?

If you have evidence of cleaning, then the MoT manual states that this is not a fail. See:

https://www.mot-testing.service.gov.uk/documents/manuals/class3457/Section-8-Nuisance.html#section_8.2.2.1

Make sure the tester has the evidence before the test.

Forscan has a facility to "Reset the Diesel Particulate Filter Learned Values" , for the Mk2 (2008 on) Focus 1.6 Stage 5, which should be adequate for a new DPF. That is from the Download Forscan page.

Diesel has reasonable lubrication properties, which is one of the main reasons the fuel is used, to lubricate the high pressure pump & injectors. The lower auto ignition temperature is also a reason, but Petrol and Diesel are surprisingly close in ignition temperature. (250C vs 210C for Diesel, while the compression temperature in an 18:1 Diesel is over 400C. Sorry about the technicalities, but I find these things interesting :blush:)

So short term use of an Oil / Diesel mix will not be catastrophic, but certainly change it as soon as reasonably possible. Probably not worth it before solving the regen problem though.

This conflicts a bit with TIzer (above), making sure the oil level is below max is certainly a good idea, high rpm and high oil will force excess oil past the piston rings. Whether to change it before a static regen is up to you, it depends on what you suspect is the amount of contamination, ie how much volume has been added to the total.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Stophen said:

Wow, was that damaged in post or did they actually think it was ok to send to you like that?

I've found this place: https://www.thedpfcleaningco.co.uk/dpf-cleaning-in-glasgow.php which looks like they do what I'm after. It seems they also produce a certificate to present at an MOT and the price doesn't seem to bad either.

From what I'm reading about this services is the DPF will need to be deleted from the ECU and then re-added / mapped. I'm guessing this is something that is beyond the limitations of FORScan?

Cheers, Stophen.

Lol, who knows?  It had tonnes of bubble wrap and a huge box so I suspect it was sent like that but no way to prove it.  They sent me another for free anyway! 

Yes, that looks like the right sort of cleaning.  Price looks reasonable too.

The DPF doesn't need to be deleted or remapped, that is only necessary when the core has been smashed out.  I reckon the 'updates' their website mentions are probably the same ones as the DPF Doctor put on.

12 hours ago, Stophen said:

Right @TomsFocus & @Tdci-Peter,

Sorry to bother you again but I've just got back from being away and thought I would check my oil level before attempting a static regeneration tomorrow. 

When I tested it I found the level much higher than it should be. Would I be right in assuming that when the system has being trying to regenerate the fuel being used has been leaking into the oil when it fails (the P253F fault code is starting to make sense)?

I guess I will need to add an oil / filter change to my list of jobs once the DPF is fixed?

Also, is this higher level of oil/fuel mix doing major damage?

Cheers, Stophen.

Really depends how much higher the level is...  Mine was always above the max mark until I removed the DPF lol, I never had to top it up before that! :laugh:  It's above in the Golf as well, same reason.  This type of regen (using post injections) will always put the level over eventually.  I'm sure this is factored into the level on DPF equipped cars though...

The main issue with the rising level is a diesel runaway which usually ends in needing a new engine.  Oil and filter change is definitely needed once the problem is rectified.  It's up to you whether you decide to do one before as well, but bare in mind that a static regen will also dump some diesel into the oil which is why I'd rather not do one before unless the level is very high.

I think the P253F code is just 'guessing' oil quality based on mileage, starts and importantly the amount of regens.  As said earlier in the thread there's no sensor for it so it's only an estimate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Guys (@TomsFocus, @Tdci-Peter & @Tizer),

Thanks for all of your input so far!

I think I'm going to send the DPF off to the DPF Cleaning Company (www.thedpfcleaningco.co.uk) and see if it can be cleaned. I realise this might not completely resolve my issues but at 125,000 miles it could probably do with a decent clean anyway. The cost is good and if they find it to be beyond saving there's no charge, so not much to loose.

I will then change the oil and filter, use FORScan to "Reset the Diesel Particulate Filter Learned Values" and hope for the best. Are there any other sensors I should be resetting?

Oh, can anyone suggest a good cleaner for the engine before I refill the oil?

And finally, a FORScan question. How can you read the battery condition?

Cheers again, Stophen.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Stophen said:

Hi Guys (@TomsFocus, @Tdci-Peter & @Tizer),

Thanks for all of your input so far!

I think I'm going to send the DPF off to the DPF Cleaning Company (www.thedpfcleaningco.co.uk) and see if it can be cleaned. I realise this might not completely resolve my issues but at 125,000 miles it could probably do with a decent clean anyway. The cost is good and if they find it to be beyond saving there's no charge, so not much to loose.

I will then change the oil and filter, use FORScan to "Reset the Diesel Particulate Filter Learned Values" and hope for the best. Are there any other sensors I should be resetting?

Oh, can anyone suggest a good cleaner for the engine before I refill the oil?

And finally, a FORScan question. How can you read the battery condition?

Cheers again, Stophen.

 

 

No other sensors to reset, although there must be some sort of oil change reset on the Euro5 models given the oil quality code.  I wasn't aware of any Mk2 having a service reset so you'll have to see if there's one in Forscan.  If not, you can try the generic Ford foot on brake & acc pedals, then switch ignition on (not engine) for about 10 seconds.

I don't recommend engine cleaners on these personally.  If you do use one Wynn's is a decent brand.

You can read battery voltage of the Mk2's on FS but I'm not sure about condition...  You seem to be getting on well with it though, if it's there, I'm sure you'll find it! :biggrin: 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A wise move, that's what I would have done in your position.

There might be a Service function to reset the Pre Particulate Temperature Sensor learned values on that car, but I can't remember.

Personally I would not use any kind of Engine Oil Cleaner my car, but maybe that is just me. Asda regularly reduce their Magnatec Oils to £20, just make sure you get the correct one, 5W30 A5 if I remember correctly.

Unlike for newer cars I don't think FORScan can tell you much about the battery on that car other than the Voltage. If there is anything it may be under the Bodywork Control Module.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi @TomsFocus & @Tizer,

19 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

I wasn't aware of any Mk2 having a service reset

I've just always used the brake / accelerator combo but maybe there is something at a service level..?

Out of interest why don't you guys like using an engine cleaner, it seems every time I take my car to Ford for a service they try and force one on me!

I've just booked the DPF in for later this week so will hopefully not have too much trouble getting it off the car later today. They offer a 24hr turn around service so I'm hopeful (providing the core is not completely destroyed)!

Thanks again for all of your help and I will let you know how I get on!

Cheers, Stophen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Stophen said:

Hi @TomsFocus & @Tizer,

I've just always used the brake / accelerator combo but maybe there is something at a service level..?

Out of interest why don't you guys like using an engine cleaner, it seems every time I take my car to Ford for a service they try and force one on me!

I've just booked the DPF in for later this week so will hopefully not have too much trouble getting it off the car later today. They offer a 24hr turn around service so I'm hopeful (providing the core is not completely destroyed)!

Thanks again for all of your help and I will let you know how I get on!

Cheers, Stophen.

Ah, fair enough, they must have added the standard service reset to the Euro5 models, learn something new every day. :smile: 

The problem I have with engine cleaners on the DV6 is that they can cause more issues.  Loosening/breaking up bits of carbon which can then get stuck in the turbo feed pipe or oil pump gauze for example.  Without the engine flush they would've remained where they were doing no harm at all.  If you've had regular oil flushes then it's less likely to be a problem but I still wouldn't risk it personally.  Ford are out to make money from servicing, I don't think they're particularly interested in your engines longevity...if anything they'll want it to die early so you buy another one! :biggrin: 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Stophen said:

Out of interest why don't you guys like using an engine cleaner, it seems every time I take my car to Ford for a service they try and force one on me

I would not use it for the same reasons as @TomsFocus said. I believe that a lot of the earlier engines suffered catastrophic engine failure because the gauze filter in the Turbo oil feed pipe became blocked, although I believe this was modified in later engines.

I did not realise that Ford dealers were offering engine flushing at service time, although I have heard that a lot of places offer a Diesel clean. I would not take up that offer either for the same reasons. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks guys, that will save me some money!

I got the DPF off today, although it was a fair fight as the sensors would not come loose and I didn't want to risk rounding of the nut heads.

I can defiantly hear something rattling around inside, I'm hoping it's just loose ash (some white flakes did come out), but knowing my luck it's probably the core.

It's getting picked up tomorrow so fingers crossed!

Stophen.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/27/2019 at 8:48 PM, Stophen said:

It's getting picked up tomorrow so fingers crossed!

Any news?

I did have a look at the full Forscan data runs, and wish I had asked for the EGT (exhaust temp). I looked at the ratio of DPF DP to MAF. Assuming the amount of gas leaving the engine is more or less equal to the amount of air entering, there should be a fairly constant ratio, But I saw a slow and definate cycle where the ratio changed, by a factor of more than 2, happen three times over the run. This could be temperature, a substantial rise in exhaust temperature (eg 100C to 500C) would do this. Also I saw that the MAP readings regularly went below 1bar while the ratio was rising, but not when the ratio was falling. To go below 1 bar (atmospheric) requires the throttle valve to be partially closed.

So it looks like the car did three regen attempts during the run, but without the EGT it is hard to be sure. If it was not doing regens, then something very odd was going on with the MAP. MAF and/or DPF DP readings.

The bottom trace in the pictures is not what it says, it is DPF-DP / MAF.

 

scn1.PNG

Scn2.PNG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi @Tdci-Peter,

Thanks for this, you are defiantly a knowledgeable guy!

Well, I sent the DPF away to the DPF Cleaning Company (www.thedpfcleaningco.co.uk) and they have checked it out. Unfortunately it is not salvageable (see picture below):

DPF1.thumb.jpg.e0233256fe92fd02b13e41e849a83115.jpg

I had the engine / DPF TerraClean at about 70,000 miles and they seemed to think this is what caused the filter to fail. A new genuine Ford filter was going to cost me around the £700 mark and as the car is fairly old / high mileage I have opted for a new one from the Catman (www.catman.co.uk) for £238.85. I've got a new gasket and retaining nuts coming from Ford so hopefully the part will not be too difficult to fit - I'll let you know how it goes! The DPF comes with 2 years warranty so fingers crossed!

Oh, here's a picture of my DPF part number (in case anybody is searching for one for a 2010 Ford Focus in the future):

DPF2.jpg.fb9d45569c010f6bd0a92a78843690a9.jpg

Hopefully I will get it fitted this weekend and then I will see what FORScan has to say!

Bye for now, Stophen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Guys (@Tdci-Peter, @TomsFocus & @Tizer),

I have finally got around to installing my new DPF and thought I would give you an update.

The unit from the Catman (www.catman.co.uk) seems ok but needed a small amount of fettling to fit. Some of the screw holes didn't match up and others were a tight fit, but I guess that is to be unexpected from a non Ford part.

So, the label on the new DPF said to reset the diesel particulate learned values and then perform a static regeneration. Below is what happened next:

1. I went onto FORScan and attempted to perform the Service Procedure 'Reset the Diesel Particulate Filter Learned Values'. When going through this procedure it warned me that I shouldn't perform a static regeneration afterwards so I stopped the procedure as the label told me I needed to do this.

2. Next I thought I would perform the static regeneration first and then reset the DPF learned values. I took the car for a quick drive to warm it up and then started the static regeneration. Now, the procedure got about 2% in and stopped due to the error message 'either too much or too little soot to carry out procedure'. 

3. At this point I needed to go to work so I thought I would just reset the DPF learned values and see what happened. I thought it was odd to carry out a static regeneration on a brand new unit as there wouldn't be anything to burn off..?

Below is the log file and data from the test run, what do you think?

2019-09-11.thumb.png.c51972d7ac9bd76ac0ebd5eed1a41b45.png518247477_Data1.thumb.png.75b261c039b7816b1a94fe66fcbbb44b.png902833609_Data2.thumb.png.2f312333742f664a6488146a97335ef7.png875568448_Data3.thumb.png.620f8234a8c8b90724332bc89e5d67f4.png1083000827_Data4.thumb.png.579b25ebc4bc03c22aa6648d435c50ff.png725318076_Data5.thumb.png.59a8d9619bc13a0662b328890df17043.png643810468_Data6.thumb.png.3aa9db5736b2b39f7f0edd37c01ae4e2.png628575458_Data7.thumb.png.bee72669db27786befb7437e4b2d0346.png936616791_Data8.thumb.png.d2c88e67f98224d30c0918606b79b8a1.png135358445_Data9.thumb.png.92e1e3ffe5447d108a0cf10a3750b566.png

11 09 2019 DPF Ford Focus Test Drive (new DPF).txt

@Tdci-Peter, I remember you asking to see the EGT data but I couldn't find that option in FORScan, might it be called something else?

I have also included a screen shot of the service procedures, should I be carrying any more of these out?

986462079_ServiceProcedures.thumb.png.6b368c9bd8669dfbda2d5dac769dd760.png

And finally, is it normally to have a noise coming from the area roughly around the diesel fuel filter after the ignition is switched off (it's kind of a tone and then a click repeating for a few minutes). 

I did get the 'Oil Service' light flash up on the dash so I checked the oil (once it had cooled down) and I must have over filled it. I probably missed seeing the clear new oil and focussed on the black stuff. I've removed some and now it is below the minimum mark so maybe that will make a difference tomorrow..?

Looking forward to getting you comments,

Stophen.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Stophen said:

Below is the log file and data from the test run, what do you think?

Looks pretty good to me, miles better than before. About 1kPa when idling, rising to about 7kPa at 2400rpm and 2.2bar boost.

I have not seen data on a good DPF, people rarely post data about cars that work! But it seems reasonable. Tom knows more about it then me, though.

PPFT is what I was asking for. But I would not have guessed the name!

It is common for the ECU to exercise or test things after Ign off, it is the only time it gets for this. Mine cycles the EGR valve, it whines and clunks for a few seconds.

Doing a forced regen on a new DPF sounds like a waste of fuel. I think I would just monitor it occasionally, to see if it settles down, and maybe does a regen after a few 100 miles.

If the temperature and DP sensors have not been changed, I do not think they need a learned values reset.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Stophen, As @Tdci-Peter says your new DPF looks like it is working ok, although the readings are a little bit higher than mine were. It is recommended that you reset the first 3 service procedures when replacing a DPF so that you are starting from scratch with your new DPF. The DPF Temperature is the bottom one on your screenshots.

My MK2 was all original and I owned it from 15000 to 97000 miles with no DPF problems and never reset any of the values.

I would not do a Static Regeneration with a new DPF and only do one in the future if absolutely necessary. Steady speed driving at reasonably high revs is the best way to force a Regeneration, but it will only do one if the readings tell it that it needs one.

The noise that you hear when switching off is the EGR Valve, which is behind and just below the Fuel Filter towards the Bulkhead. It quickly fully opens and closes several times as a self cleaning procedure before parking itself. The Throttle Valve does the same and the Fuel system dumps most of the high pressure also.

I think the Oil Service light is a time thing and will come on at every restart until reset. To reset it close all the doors, fully press the Accelerator and Brake for about 10 seconds with the ignition on and you should get a message that it has been reset. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi @Tdci-Peter & @Tizer,

Thanks for getting back to me so quickly and for the good advice, it's defiantly helped put my mind to rest!

I will go ahead and reset the 'Exhaust Gas Sensor Temperature Learned Values' & 'Differential Pressure Sensor Learned Values' as @Tizer has suggested and I have performed the 'Oil Reset' so hopefully that will resolve the problem (it hasn't come on this morning so fingers crossed).

I've owned my car from 15,000 and am now sitting at around 126,000. Is there any big things that should be on my horizon to watch for? I've done a fair bit of suspension work / brakes and have replaced a few of the AC components but if anybody has experience of potential things to break it would be good to hear about them!

And finally, a gail force wind took out my used oil and spilled it all over a paving slab, any suggestions on how to remove it before my wife removes me?

Big thanks as always, Stophen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You absolutely should not be doing a static regen on a brand new DPF!!  I can't believe it would even say that on the new DPF...  😮  It may be worth emailing the manufacturer to let them know.

What you should've done (albeit a bit late now lol) is take it for a longish steady drive to set the adhesive/sealant between the DPF & cat cores and the metal DPF cannister.  This ensures no leaks around the edges.

As for oil on the paving slab...just buy another one and replace it before the wife gets home. :wink:  It's too late now if it's soaked in, the best thing to do is to soak up as much as possible with sawdust or cat litter immediately and then use some sort of degreaser to break it down before it has time to settle into the porous concrete.  Once it's in there it's pretty much staying there I'm afraid.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks @TomsFocus,

I thought that might be the case 🤦‍♂️!

The first drive I did was about 40 minutes (motorways and A roads)  so hopefully that would have given it enough time to seal.

I will keep my eye on it!

Cheers, Stophen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Stophen said:

Oh, @TomsFocus,

Here is the DPF sticker:

B94E1835-788D-4658-A4AB-4857E1D7B1D8.thumb.jpeg.f53b10627d649fe614b9520a2c19efe7.jpeg

What do you make off it?

Stophen.

Well, the first 3 are correct...I don't agree with number 4 though.  I can only assume they're trying to heat seal it like that...but it won't work.  There'll be too much pressure around the edges of the DPF core at a constant 4000rpm and you risk cracking the core or worst case causing a bay fire heating it up like that when it's empty. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Stophen said:

I've owned my car from 15,000 and am now sitting at around 126,000. Is there any big things that should be on my horizon to watch for? I've done a fair bit of suspension work / brakes and have replaced a few of the AC components but if anybody has experience of potential things to break it would be good to hear about them!

The stupid Bonnet Catch design will probably give up at some point. There will be a lot of posts in this Forum about it and it is a real pain to fix, so keep all parts of it well lubricated. The 3 year change interval for the Fuel Filter is too long in my opinion. I cut open a used one when I changed mine and it was black inside.

Apart from that and a new Front Wheel Bearing I did not have any real problems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With regards to common faults, I owned mine 3.5 years and 30k and only really had problems with the DPF, which was already blocked when I bought it, despite having tried to research DPFs beforehand. :rolleyes:  Learnt a lot about them after that lol!  I also bought it with no reverse light (just the switch, £8 fix) and a grinding rear door deadlock, which I never did fix because I liked knowing that the noise meant I had deadlocked it!  And needing a pair of tyres because the inside edges had worn out on the fronts which wasn't noticeable when buying.  I should add, this was the most expensive car I ever bought and the first one from a dealer!  Needless to say I wasn't impressed lol.  It also came with one odd floor mat which was a little annoying.

After the initial repairs:

I only ever had limp mode once due to faulty glow plugs at about 55k - which had been overused due to the constant DPF regens on the aftermarket DPF lol.

2 sets of tyres (edges always wore off before the centres, despite many wheel alignments, never could stop the wheel wobble either)

1 set of front discs and pads at 50k - car had been lightly used by previous owner and parked on a damp forecourt for a while I think, discs were awful for such low mileage.

Pair of front wishbones at 68k due to rear bushes wearing, and Hunter wheel alignment done after that.

Cambelt kit at 9.5 years/72k.

Oil change roughly every 6k.

Fuel filter, air filter and pollen filter every other oil change.

New oil filter cap because the hulk had cracked it during a previous change.

I did have the collapsing bonnet catch but only because I fitted a tarty gloss grill that didn't fit properly lol, removed and kept the original grill instead!

I also had to resync the keyfob once as it randomly lost signal.

Also lost radio power once, which was fixed by just removing and refitting the fuse.

1 set of genuine Wiper Blades.

Oh and 2 of the most expensive brake light bulbs ever! :laugh: 

 

It was a decent car tbh...I just wish it had been a later one with the cDPF in hindsight!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks @TomsFocus & @Tizer,

Funnily enough I think all the stuff you have listed I have already done, and a few extras:

New brake pads / rear shoes every couple of years.

Brake discs and rear drums.

Fuel, air & pollen filter and wind screen wipers every other year.

New cam & auxiliary belt (including water pump, idler & pulley).

Front wishbones and later ball and socket joints at.

Bonnet catch.

Sump.

Rear bushes.

Lots of bulbs (and they do cost a fortune!)

New hand brake cable.

Front springs.

Rear reversing switch.

Wing and bumper, silver trim and a few interior and exterior plastic parts.

Brake fluid change.

Condenser.

Oh, and I had the wheels powder coated.

And of course, the new DPF.

I imagine there are other things but I can't quite remember.

I guess I am into slightly unmapped territory so I will have to wait and see. One thing that is on my mind is the clutch but I don't there are any tail tail signs of that yet...

55 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

2 sets of tyres (edges always wore off before the centres, despite many wheel alignments, never could stop the wheel wobble either)

I have that problem also!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Stophen said:
1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

2 sets of tyres (edges always wore off before the centres, despite many wheel alignments, never could stop the wheel wobble either)

I have that problem also

17 inch wheels? My 17 inch wheels (with Sports Suspension) never stayed in balance for long either until I fitted Avon Tyres. The Avons  also gave a much quieter and smoother ride.

When that model of Focus came out it was sold as a Volvo V50 first. My partner had one of the first new ones with 17 inch wheels and Sports Suspension and they lost balance quickly also. Volvo had to take back the car because they could not fix a EGR fault and her new car had different sized wheels and they stayed in balance for a normal amount of time. Maybe coincidence or maybe not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Tizer said:
54 minutes ago, Stophen said:

 

17 inch wheels?

Mine are 16” and still get out far too easily!

I haven’t tried Avons @Tizer, I’ll consider them next time!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.