Windows 7 update - I just got one, thought they'd stopped?

[StephenFord]

I just received notification that I have an 'update' available though I'm running Windows 7. On the cessation date in January, I was fully up to date, and not expecting anything further. Have MS changed their mind, or are the scammers already at their work? (I can't find any info on t'internet...) Looks legit, but the best scams all do.

[Milkman]

The way to find out if the update is genuine is to go on the Microsoft website and search for the update number, KB890830  and if genuine should come up and be the same, Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool. Or find it in your 'recent updates' folder, highlight it and right click which opens the details.

[StephenFord]

I should have updated this LOL I just ignored it, and in MS infinite wisdom, it went ahead overnight and installed it! Got the standard notification from MS saying that 'new updates had been applied'. It is now listed under the full list of updates which leads me to believe it was legitimate. Just surprised that it arrived after the cut off date for 'no further support on Windows 7'

[Milkman]

I'll have to dig out my W7 laptop and have a look to see if there are any pending updates on it. It could have been that your updates were pending before the cut off date but downloaded at a 'scheduled' time which was a bit later.

[StephenFord]

I have 2 x W7 devices, a laptop & desktop - it arrived 2 weeks after deadline on both. I genuinely hate MicroSoft for discontinuing support for W7. On XP, I could understand as it wasn't stable, and you got the BSOD (blue screen of death) on a monthly basis.

W7 just works and is exceptionally stable, I have no reason at all to upgrade. It's estimated that they have made over 500 Million devices (presumably landfill material now) obsolete, and their own official advice was to buy a new device as elderly ones may find it difficult to run W10. I'm surprised the tree huggers aren't all over this issue, though I suppose their trust funds will easily pay for new 'stuff'!

[alexp999]

Every product generally has an EOL, it's just not sustainable to keep supporting a product indefinitely.

Windows 7 came out over 10 years ago.

Microsoft are still offering some enterprise customers paid support, so some work is still ongoing, basically you are no longer guaranteed any updates, the fact that some may still make it through general availability as it's still phased out is just a bonus.

Windows 10 can be installed for free in a lot of cases, with a valid Win 7 licence. In fact the Win 10 installer accepts Win 7 product keys.

You should be mindful of the fact you may no longer receive security patches and the software you are using will at some point no longer be supported or updated on Win 7. That is a risk in itself for a computer connected to the internet.

[StephenFord]

1 minute ago, alexp999 said:

Every product generally has an EOL, it's just not sustainable to keep supporting a product indefinitely.

Windows 7 came out over 10 years ago.

Microsoft are still offering some enterprise customers paid support, so some work is still ongoing, basically you are no longer guaranteed any updates, the fact that some may still make it through general availability as it's still phased out is just a bonus.

Windows 10 can be installed for free in a lot of cases, with a valid Win 7 licence. In fact the Win 10 installer accepts Win 7 product keys.

Just in the same way that some folk here run 15 year old cars LOL It still works great, I can still get spares, and lots of good advice. I don't really want, nor can I afford the latest with all the most recent gizmos - doesn't interest me... (I'll stick to my W7 thanks...) 😀

[alexp999]

The difference is the the car is still repairable and runs, does it's job.

Windows 7 will be a security risk, it will have unpatched vulnerabilities as time goes on and there will come a point when other software developers also drop support for it, so you'd either not be able to use software on it, or have even more potential security vulnerabilities by running out of date software on an unsupported OS.

There is every chance your current systems will run Win 10 just fine and it probably wouldn't cost you anything.

[StephenFord]

Unfortunately, according to MS own verification tool, both my laptop & desktop will struggle with windows 10, besides, I use it at work and hate it with a passion! I still don't see why at a whim from MS, I have to spend money on something I don't want, as what I have does me just fine. I have a neigbour that still runs XP on his desktop, he just send  a few emails and does a bit of light surfing. He keeps his antivirus up to date, and loses no sleep LOL

[alexp999]

It's a risk you have to be willing to take. If you want a car analogy, it's like driving with no seat belt (the person still using XP has unplugged their airbags too).

There is also no whim from Microsoft, the EOL date has been set since the product released, everyone has had 10 years to prepare.

If you don't want to pay for a service you have only paid once for (no ongoing subscriptions to MS Win), there is always Linux.

[StephenFord]

You are obviously an IT boffin, I'm old and really can't be arsed anymore. I've been using windows since 3.1! I simply want to turn my device on, and have it work in the same way it did yesterday, and the day before... I know I'm a dinosaur, and like them, will eventually be extinct, and will leave the world to young'uns like you to do what you wish. By the way, the seat belt analogy is almost correct apart from the fact that it was MS that removed my seatbelt, not me...🤣

[Eric Bloodaxe]

Lol, I also suffer dinosauritis. I'm still using Vista on my old PC. When MS stopped supporting, I simply unplugged it from the router, and just use it for the occasional  spreadsheet and bit of word processing. I use phone or tablet for my limited internet requirements (bit of googling, emailing and lurking round sites like this). I intended to eventually get a new PC or laptop but haven't yet found the need, tbh.

[alexp999]

I'm an IT admin, I loathe updating systems (servers even more), but I value the security updates bring more. It's just the way things are with software.

To Microsoft's credit, they basically gave Win 10 anyway, to make it as cheap as possible.

[Milkman]

If you listen to the shops and retail outlets for PC's and they tell you that you should buy an up to date device, rubbish!, all they want to do is take your money. You can do a 'clean' install of W10 on your older Vista, 7, 8 and 8.1 without issues and you'll have an up to date PC, back up anything you want to keep to another hard drive or discs, remove the previous operating system and load the new one, I have a 13 year old HP laptop running Vista, my local computer doctor upgraded it to W10 and it is now as new, cost me £20, much better than spending upwards of £500 to replace it with an equivalent new one and have an old unsupported PC that no-one can use or wants. I don't think XP operating PC's can be upgraded to the latest OS. 

Steven, my advice would be to get it upgraded and save yourself a shedload! 

[StephenFord]

I have just had a weird experience yesterday! My mother-in-laws laptop, running windows 8.1, kept demanding a restart to update. I finally gave in. It took a long time, most of the afternoon, but after restarting several times, it is now running Windows 10 home! (I have checked several times to see if I was mistaken, but no, it is now running Windows 10) Running as sweet as a nut, and no request to back up data or anything. I didn't know MS could do this. TBH, if my windows 7 laptop could be updated so easily, and automated, I would just hit the 'OK' button!

[TomsFocus]

Windows 8 was such a horrific fail they gave everyone the option to upgrade to 10 for free a few years ago!  

Sadly my laptop isn't quite powerful enough for it, and the sound card hasn't worked properly since either...but it's still better than 8!!

I didn't know they could force it on anyone though, I reckon your MIL inadvertently clicked 'ok' on an MS pop up...

[Milkman]

At the time the upgrade to W10 was offered the upgrade downloaded to every-ones PC as two updates with KB numbers and an icon appeared on your bottom taskbar, if you did not want the upgrade you could turn it off by going into your settings>updates>see available updates and then deleting the two, but you needed to know which KB numbers to delete as they were not named. If you deleted them they would keep coming back every time your PC downloaded updates and the icon on the taskbar would return, so, you had to go through the delete process again. If you did nothing by a certain date the W10 upgrade would automatically install weather you wanted it or not. In the early days there were a multitude of problems with this new system, programmes you had previously installed disappeared and your anti virus protection programme was removed and a plethora of 'features' of the new system just didn't work, many PC's were actually totally wiped beyond repair or recovery costing MS a small fortune in compensation claims. It's pretty much okay now but they forced it on everyone and didn't beta test it properly before releasing it.

[alexp999]

From a software point of view, a PC is never beyond recovery/repair.

Worst case you have to wipe the drive and start again, as long as the hardware is ok.

[Milkman]

With the introduction and acceptance in the offer period, and after for quite some time for W10 it actually did wipe lots of programmes off your PC and no, they were not recoverable as they were regarded as 'non compatible with the new system' so you had to either upgrade to a newer version of that software that was compatible or find an alternative. This is where some PC's were totally wiped beyond repair because the hardware was not capable of running all elements of the new system although running  a compatibility test showed that it was which forced people to go out and buy a new PC. Even some of the W10 programmes conflicted with one another which caused freezing and crashing problems.

[alexp999]

3 minutes ago, Milkman said:

With the introduction and acceptance in the offer period, and after for quite some time for W10 it actually did wipe lots of programmes off your PC and no, they were not recoverable as they were regarded as 'non compatible with the new system' so you had to either upgrade to a newer version of that software that was compatible or find an alternative. This is where some PC's were totally wiped beyond repair because the hardware was not capable of running all elements of the new system although running  a compatibility test showed that it was which forced people to go out and buy a new PC. Even some of the W10 programmes conflicted with one another which caused freezing and crashing problems.

My point is just that the hardware is never dead because of what happens at a software level.

You could put Windows 7 back on it if Windows 10 was a no go, at least until this Jan, or load on Linux. The hardware itself is never beyond repair as it's not broken by software.

[StephenFord]

As an experiment, I booted up an old IBM PC last year, one of my first. It had 512Mb hard drive (yes, that is not a typo), and ran windows 3.1 LOL Booted up just fine, and still had some photos on it I had totally forgotten about! It has now had a decent burial. Yes, old PCs never really die, just get old, like the rest of us...🤣

[Milkman]

The hardware certainly does die. The hard drive does fail and nothing can be recovered on it, I've had that experience. The sound card can fail, the CMOS can fail and the motherboard can go boobies up  The life of any of the components and boards in a PC are only as good as the quality of them, some of which are very poor.

[alexp999]

Just now, Milkman said:

The hardware certainly does die. The hard drive does fail and nothing can be recovered on it, I've had that experience. The sound card can fail, the CMOS can fail and the motherboard can go boobies up  The life of any of the components and boards in a PC are only as good as the quality of them, some of which are very poor.

You're still missing my point, I was merely saying it doesn't matter how bad the software gets you can wipe and reinstall, the hardware is not broken, by software.

Hardware failures are something totally different and can happen even to a newer device running Win 10.