Automatic Petrol ST at last

[volts]

AutoCar Article

About time for those who can't drive manual but want to experience the Ford ST

[DaveT70]

But no 8 speed auto Diesel, unfortunately, what a missed trick

[Guy Heaton]

Ooh, now that sounds interesting.    I wonder when it will be on the Ford site.

[TomsFocus]

Interesting that the auto is slightly slower to 60 than the manual...  How have they managed to make a modern autobox shift slower than a human!?

I suppose there could be an extra shift on the 7sp to hit 60... 

[dtulip8]

Just now, TomsFocus said:

Interesting that the auto is slightly slower to 60 than the manual...  How have they managed to make a modern autobox shift slower than a human!?

I suppose there could be an extra shift on the 7sp to hit 60... 

I think I read that the ratios are further apart in the auto so it hampers it’s 0-60 ability.

[Guy Heaton]

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Interesting that the auto is slightly slower to 60 than the manual...  How have they managed to make a modern autobox shift slower than a human!?

I suppose there could be an extra shift on the 7sp to hit 60... 

It is a bit weird when the DSG Golfs etc. are faster 0-60 than the manuals.  And this is meant to be the same kind of box, not a conventional slush.

[Eric Bloodaxe]

Wondering what box this is. I assumed it was going to be the 8 speed torque convertor as in other Focuses, but as it's 7 speed I assume it's a DCT as per the revised Fiesta and the Puma? And wonder why Ford have gone DCT in those two models while the 1.0 Focus (for now at least) seems to be sticking with the torque convertor?

[Eric Bloodaxe]

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Interesting that the auto is slightly slower to 60 than the manual...  How have they managed to make a modern autobox shift slower than a human!?

Could it be because we're the most intelligent beings in the known universe and this is just a machine?😀

[TomsFocus]

2 hours ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Could it be because we're the most intelligent beings in the known universe and this is just a machine?😀

You may be, I'm definitely not... 

 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

27 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

You may be, I'm definitely not... 

 

Lol, that's very kind of you,  but I can assure you my Mrs can produce lots of evidence to the contrary!😀

Joking apart, I do wonder why so much prominence is given to 0-60 times, when, say, 30-50 and 50-70 are so much more relevant to everyday driving, and I certainly can't beat kickdown!

[Guy Heaton]

Aye.  0-60 times are great for the pub but it's really how a car performs fully loaded on an inclined slip road that matters.

[Hooded]

2 hours ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Lol, that's very kind of you,  but I can assure you my Mrs can produce lots of evidence to the contrary!😀

Joking apart, I do wonder why so much prominence is given to 0-60 times, when, say, 30-50 and 50-70 are so much more relevant to everyday driving, and I certainly can't beat kickdown!

Agree, rolling times are much more useable in real world driving conditions. 

My remapped F30 330d 8 speed auto does 30-70mph in 4 seconds .. I couldn’t care less what the 0-60 is .. although I guess it could be a sub 5 in the right conditions! 
 

Im surprised the new ST is slower in auto than the manual version though, as it’s not usually the case these days with the latest auto boxes.

[RAIDER32]

14 hours ago, Hooded said:

Im surprised the new ST is slower in auto than the manual version though, as it’s not usually the case these days with the latest auto boxes.

It doesn't mention if the time was auto change or paddle shift, I'm guessing paddle shift will be slightly better, unless it needs that extra gear change.
I'm guessing auto is timed for traction to avoid wheel spin, preventing second gear kicking in too early?, giving the tyres time to gain traction.
I'm sure all manual times have some degree of wheel spin, on a front wheel drive car getting off the line isn't smooth.

[TomsFocus]

1 hour ago, RAIDER32 said:

It doesn't mention if the time was auto change or paddle shift, I'm guessing paddle shift will be slightly better, unless it needs that extra gear change.
I'm guessing auto is timed for traction to avoid wheel spin, preventing second gear kicking in too early?, giving the tyres time to gain traction.
I'm sure all manual times have some degree of wheel spin, on a front wheel drive car getting off the line isn't smooth.

I think the Mk4 ST has an LSD as standard so should be better off the line than the older ones.  

[Eric Bloodaxe]

1 hour ago, RAIDER32 said:

It doesn't mention if the time was auto change or paddle shift, I'm guessing paddle shift will be slightly better, unless it needs that extra gear change.
I'm guessing auto is timed for traction to avoid wheel spin, preventing second gear kicking in too early?, giving the tyres time to gain traction.
I'm sure all manual times have some degree of wheel spin, on a front wheel drive car getting off the line isn't smooth

Whichever, getting the best 0-60 time is very unkind to the car. I've had a couple of sessions in the past where, under the guidance of an instructor, I tried to achieve the best 0-60 time. I think last time the car was an MG Maestro Turbo, so you can tell how long ago it was! Anyhow, I think in the end I got it under 7 secs (which was regarded as pretty quick back then) but the smell of burning clutch and tyres lingered in my nostrils for a long time afterwards!😀

[Hooded]

3 hours ago, RAIDER32 said:

It doesn't mention if the time was auto change or paddle shift, I'm guessing paddle shift will be slightly better, unless it needs that extra gear change.
I'm guessing auto is timed for traction to avoid wheel spin, preventing second gear kicking in too early?, giving the tyres time to gain traction.
I'm sure all manual times have some degree of wheel spin, on a front wheel drive car getting off the line isn't smooth.

Still unusual these days for the auto version to be quoted as slower than the manual version by the manufacturer, a lot of the modern auto boxes really are quick these days. 
 

If the box is any good then maybe the Ford software sucks a bit and perhaps a third party gearbox flash at some point would sort that out. 
 

Here they try and get the manual M2 to match the auto’s 0-60 and fail. Although this auto is a DCT box. 

 

[alexp999]

With the "anit-lag" and rev matching, it is quite easy to do fast shifts in the manual.

I would assume the main reason is that the gearing is just a bit longer in the auto, so it doesn't have the same in gear acceleration.

[karlbbb]

On 6/18/2020 at 3:14 PM, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Wondering what box this is. I assumed it was going to be the 8 speed torque convertor as in other Focuses, but as it's 7 speed I assume it's a DCT as per the revised Fiesta and the Puma? And wonder why Ford have gone DCT in those two models while the 1.0 Focus (for now at least) seems to be sticking with the torque convertor?

Nooooo why have they gone back to a DCT? Slushbox should be the standard on all models, with DCT reserved for only the ST models. Ugh, hopefully the Focus sticks with the 8-speed torque converter box for a few years yet, so when the time comes to replace my Mk3.5 I can get the 8-speed mated to the 1.0. I don't want a DCT.