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Throttle body conversion


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4 minutes ago, tomshepp said:

I was taught how to use a lathe 45 years ago and the mill 30 years ago by people who really knew metallurgy and machine tools. I dabble fairly competently but it isn't my trade.

Cheap micro or mini lathes are a complete waste of money. If you want to learn how to turn, read a couple of old books and look out for somebody who can properly evaluate an old Myford ml7 which will last longer and provide better results even if half knackered. A good one will be as good as its user; well up to making model aircraft engine parts, for example.

Reckon to spend £1000 getting going and ten years getting good.

I would have thought the skills involved to properly and diligently use any machine would take some time, but ten years seems a bit excessive. I am just thinking of the cost of electric for those ten years haha, can't be cheap, for now I'll stick with paying someone who knows what they are doing, at least the job will be done quick enough and to a specialist degree, I am happy giving my money to someone who has already got ten years experience under their belt.😉

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The 60 mm throttle body (2.3.Duratec HE engine) is a direct fit upgrade for the 55 mm 1.8/2.0 Duratec HE engine. The 1.25, 1.4 and 1.6 Duratec engine uses a smaller 45 mm throttle body. This type

I do a certain amount of work on a home built cnc milling machine. It has its limtations but only cost £1500. When I wanted the  wing strut ends for my aeroplane, I did not trust my workmanship. I too

Throttle body has been installed today the car runs sweet as a nut now.👍 There is a definite increase in throttle response and acceleration. One of the best mods so far added to engine. I would h

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Recognise the metal. Know it's properties. Make a tool to work the metal. There is the first ten years learning if you are doing it every day. Set the machine up. Turn the piece to the correct dimensions and tolerance.

My company's apprentices are  getting into 3d printing. Most of it is draughtmanship. The basics of the CAD package can be learned in a few months. The design skills take years and not everybody has the conceptualisation and 3 dimensional thinking to be good at it which is the difference between a design engineer and a CAD jockey.

 

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3 minutes ago, anon said:

Recognise the metal. Know it's properties. Make a tool to work the metal. There is the first ten years learning if you are doing it every day. Set the machine up. Turn the piece to the correct dimensions and tolerance.

My company's apprentices are  getting into 3d printing. Most of it is draughtmanship. The basics of the CAD package can be learned in a few months. The design skills take years and not everybody has the conceptualisation and 3 dimensional thinking to be good at it which is the difference between a design engineer and a CAD jockey.

 

cad jockey lol you will make loads of friends in a design office😁

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5 minutes ago, anon said:

Recognise the metal. Know it's properties. Make a tool to work the metal. There is the first ten years learning if you are doing it every day. Set the machine up. Turn the piece to the correct dimensions and tolerance.

My company's apprentices are  getting into 3d printing. Most of it is draughtmanship. The basics of the CAD package can be learned in a few months. The design skills take years and not everybody has the conceptualisation and 3 dimensional thinking to be good at it which is the difference between a design engineer and a CAD jockey.

 

so many different aspects to learn about then, I will hopefully be undertaking an engineering access course but unsure at what route to take after that, it was my idea to go through electrical engineering and maybe then dabble with the hardware/fabrication side. It will be an enjoyable ride I'm sure.

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2 minutes ago, FiestaForever said:

so many different aspects to learn about then, I will hopefully be undertaking an engineering access course but unsure at what route to take after that, it was my idea to go through electrical engineering and maybe then dabble with the hardware/fabrication side. It will be an enjoyable ride I'm sure.

I'm a mechanical engineer with over 35 years of design experience - if you are starting out go electrical as CAD has devalued the job you just press a button people think.

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Got the throttle body back from the engineers machine shop today. Was pleasantly surprised of the cost too, £35 all in, so total cost was £65 with £30 for cost of the throttle body itself. Will be fitting it tomorrow, weather allowing, forecast shows some drizzle but will probably persevere. 

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Good. Either peen over the throttle plate screws(preferred) or use a strong grade of Loctite on the threads. If one gets free it will (never might!) hold a valve open wide enough for the piston to bash it and you won't enjoy that.

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Note to self, When the correct operation of the throttle plate is not realized, do not thread seal all the bolts and fit it all back together again, you may be fighting with a single bolt for ten minutes trying to get it free!🤯

Ok so I put it all back together again, and played around with the throttle plate within the bore of the body, I noticed some thing, too late in fact, but noticed something. 🤔

"Was my poor memory getting the better of me?", I asked myself. Did the throttle plate move back into its original, closed, position it started in when you let your finger off it, after opening it? 🤨

I had to remove the throttle body on my car and take it to pieces to see what I had done wrong. I was sure everything went back into its proper location and it was assembled in the reverse order of taking it apart. Hmm, it was a conundrum. I Checked, and double checked. I thought it was obvious that the spring behind the cog was the culprit. "Did it need a bigger spring to cope with the larger, heavier, throttle plate?", I mumbled to myself! It occurred to me I may have to buy an ST throttle body and salvage the spring from there and retrofit it to this throttle housing.😒

Looking at the old throttle body I came to the conclusion that the spring looks more tightly wound! "Hmmm, interesting", the thought, echoing inside my head. 🤪

Pushing the shaft with the cog and spring back through the bearing centres allowed me to twist the shaft and spring freely. This twisting motion started to wind the spring up, after spinning it a few times the spring is now tightly wound. This motion has now, thoroughly, increased the springs resistance against the shaft and throttle housing. I push the shaft with spring and cog back through the bearing centres, reconnect the throttle plate, and rejoice.😄

It now works perfectly, praise god and sing hallelujah😂

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20 minutes ago, anon said:

Good. Either peen over the throttle plate screws(preferred) or use a strong grade of Loctite on the threads. If one gets free it will (never might!) hold a valve open wide enough for the piston to bash it and you won't enjoy that.

Got that extra strength loctite on the job👍

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Throttle body has been installed today the car runs sweet as a nut now.👍 There is a definite increase in throttle response and acceleration. One of the best mods so far added to engine.

I would highly recommend this to anyone who wants a more responsive car. Cost is relatively low and gains are pretty impressive. Ok so we not talking turbo charged gains but there is a noticeable difference in engine performance that would put a smile on any car owners face.

This brings an end to this project, I don't think I will be seeking to enlarge the bore further but who knows what the future may bring😀. I would like to thank JW1982 for the inspiration and technical help, would not have been able to complete this without his help.😁 would also like to thank all those who have read and also inputted there comments in the thread😃

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1 minute ago, FiestaForever said:

Throttle body has been installed today the car runs sweet as a nut now.👍 There is a definite increase in throttle response and acceleration. One of the best mods so far added to engine.

I would highly recommend this to anyone who wants a more responsive car. Cost is relatively low and gains are pretty impressive. Ok so we not talking turbo charged gains but there is a noticeable difference in engine performance that would put a smile on any car owners face.

This brings an end to this project, I don't think I will be seeking to enlarge the bore further but who knows what the future may bring😀. I would like to thank JW1982 for the inspiration and technical help, would not have been able to complete this without his help.😁 would also like to thank all those who have read and also inputted there comments in the thread😃

bet your fuel consumptions gone down😁

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2 minutes ago, st line x 140 driver said:

bet your fuel consumptions gone down😁

Up or down? I would say fuel consumption up, perhaps. MPG down for sure, lol. But then I guess if it takes less of a lead foot on accelerator peddle to get it to move maybe less consumption.

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45 minutes ago, FiestaForever said:

Up or down? I would say fuel consumption up, perhaps. MPG down for sure, lol. But then I guess if it takes less of a lead foot on accelerator peddle to get it to move maybe less consumption.

did you change your fuel filter and pump?

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1 hour ago, st line x 140 driver said:

did you change your fuel filter and pump?

Not just yet, have a filter but think the pump might be ok, but may look into a higher flowing one. I have a malpassi rising rate fuel pressure regulator, remotely, supplying the rail so a pump probably is not necessary, or at least that is what Glencoe LTD advised.

I had took a peek at uprated in tank filters and inline high flow ones but unsure if it is really going to be needed to be done as yet. I think that the fuel pump on these cars are good up to around 120hp anyway, and that is around the region I am aiming for eventually.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Not too sure, what is the bore for the 1.6? As far as I understand is the bolt holes may be different on larger engine TB’s and the bore would not match the smaller engine bore which would mean the engine couldn’t make use of the extra air/bore.

A member named jw1982 here went further with some boring projects going larger than 50mm but noticed that the engines idle was affected. He has more knowledge on the subject, if you were interested in this it would be an advantage to contact him.

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Yes, I've just read the thread, interesting stuff. I may just buy a spare 45 mm body and get the local bike shop to machine for me. I have just been scouring eBay for a 50mm butterfly plate with no luck

12 minutes ago, FiestaForever said:

Not too sure, what is the bore for the 1.6? As far as I understand is the bolt holes may be different on larger engine TB’s and the bore would not match the smaller engine bore which would mean the engine couldn’t make use of the extra air/bore.

A member named jw1982 here went further with some boring projects going larger than 50mm but noticed that the engines idle was affected. He has more knowledge on the subject, if you were interested in this it would be an advantage to contact him.

 

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10 minutes ago, cooperscooter said:

Yes, I've just read the thread, interesting stuff. I may just buy a spare 45 mm body and get the local bike shop to machine for me. I have just been scouring eBay for a 50mm butterfly plate with no luck

 

You can buy that part from here, it is perfect for the job, an exact fit once it is all bored and the shaft has been filed.

https://www.webcon.co.uk/products/4920-throttle-plate-50mm-83-deg/

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I posted earlier that total cost was £65, I actually forgot to add the throttle plate cost to that lol. Cost in total with plate was more near to £90 as throttle plate cost £25 after vat and shipping was added to it. Still a good investment in my mind

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hey guys , this topic is perfect because i have fitted St150 60mm throttle body to my zetec s mk6 fiesta and when turning the car over it does not want to hold idle or rev from the accelerator pedal. what would be the cause of this?

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6 hours ago, lucasse said:

hey guys , this topic is perfect because i have fitted St150 60mm throttle body to my zetec s mk6 fiesta and when turning the car over it does not want to hold idle or rev from the accelerator pedal. what would be the cause of this?

It could be that your car needs to relearn the throttle buddy. there is a procedure to do so. I have heard of a few procedures, it needs to be done whenever the throttle body has been unhooked from electrics and removed. I believe the best a easiest way is to turn the key in the ignition to the first part but do not turn the engine on. Wait with the key turned to the first position for around 1 minute. Turn the key back to the off position and then start your engine. If this method does not work I will explain the next one to you.👍

Just out of interest did you remove the battery negative lead before you unhooked the electrics to the old throttle body?

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On 1/14/2021 at 6:51 PM, FiestaForever said:

It could be that your car needs to relearn the throttle buddy. there is a procedure to do so. I have heard of a few procedures, it needs to be done whenever the throttle body has been unhooked from electrics and removed. I believe the best a easiest way is to turn the key in the ignition to the first part but do not turn the engine on. Wait with the key turned to the first position for around 1 minute. Turn the key back to the off position and then start your engine. If this method does not work I will explain the next one to you.👍

Just out of interest did you remove the battery negative lead before you unhooked the electrics to the old throttle body?

Yes mate I removed the negative lead off the battery before I took anything apart. However I did try this method because I have heard how the ecu needs to learn the throttle body but I literally had no input from the throttle pedal I even tried a ST150 pedal and still nothing. It was running really rough and couldn’t idle for ***** haha

if you could help that would be appreciated but I’m going to ST150 swap it soon anyways just think it’s best thing to do haha

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