Crap Brakes

[ford focus edge]

Hi guys, the mot time has come along with a 6yr service all in one month woopie.

My rear drums are squeeking though and my brakes really dont feel to well, i think the drums just need new shoes and the hardbrake adjusting accordingally. They only squeek when i work the pedal though and abuse the handbrake.

On another note im also getting bad vibrations through the wheel (under any kind of braking) ive been told this means warped discs and is a simple replacment easy to do (ive done discs and pads before).

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300369895728&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT I was thinking of fitting these on as a replacment from what i can tell 80 quid for performance shoes, disc's and pads is pretty good and will be a fun little experiment to test them out around the lanes :P , What i really want to no is will this fix the problems or could there be more underlying things.

Mike

[stef123]

i am using those same discs (from the same guy) and they are good. im using standard pads though as the uprated ones waste the discs i find.

as for uprated shoes, i dont think you will benefit as ive found in the past (with standard shoes) the drum either warp or expand and then the shoe adjuster moves and when the drum cools its all needing set up again. so i would say its the drums that cant take the heat under harsh braking.

i would change the brake fluid while your at it, that way it will all be fresh and back to how it should be.

[thesilverfox]

Drilled/grooved discs are great in practice, but are most effective at very high temperatures (hence the drilling and grooving to allow for gas to escape and better contact between pad and disc at cooler temps etc).

My ST170 cooked a set of discs and pads and I asked my housemate (Vauxhall master mech) about these sort of replacements and he said they are a waste of time outside of track days, as normal vented discs would do the same job in most conditions and would be quieter than drilled/grooved too.

I got my dad a set of Mintex discs and pads in a brake box kit for £30 off eBay and he thinks they are superb. I had the Mintex on the 170 and they were very good stoppers.

[stef123]

Drilled/grooved discs are great in practice, but are most effective at very high temperatures (hence the drilling and grooving to allow for gas to escape and better contact between pad and disc at cooler temps etc).

My ST170 cooked a set of discs and pads and I asked my housemate (Vauxhall master mech) about these sort of replacements and he said they are a waste of time outside of track days, as normal vented discs would do the same job in most conditions and would be quieter than drilled/grooved too.

I got my dad a set of Mintex discs and pads in a brake box kit for £30 off eBay and he thinks they are superb. I had the Mintex on the 170 and they were very good stoppers.

quite possibly but i know ive never had any issues with noise and i like to give the car some beens down one of the roads up in the highlands that takes a good 40 mins and ive cooked normal front discs and rear drums before very easily. since ive switched to drilled and grooved discs and rear disc brakes with goodridge hoses i can be at it all day and not cook them.

even on a few of the roads local to me ive noticed a huge difference in the brakes with the drilled and grooved discs.

so i suppose it does all depend on where and how you use the brakes but definetly not restricted to track days, even 'legal' driving has some benefits of these discs.

just my 2p worth

[ford focus edge]

I think what im going to have to do is on my day of (thursday) im going to get the wheel off and have a good look at the state of things and also crack the drum cover off, ive got a very sneaky feeling its defo going to need new shoes but i really need to check on it all because theres no question about it when u need to stop and jam on the car stops on a penny be it with alot of juddering through the wheel and a high pitched squeek.

I'm going to try and get those discs ordered very soon though i need them mostly because i do tend to cook my brakes im a keen driver and the standard ford discs dont seem to like the hard abuse it was always on my list of things to do to upgrade the brakes but not until the ford ones are truley spent.

Cheers for the input fellas

Mike

[thesilverfox]

I think you'd find more braking improvement by uprating the brakes to ST170 brakes than you would using drilled and vented discs. 300mm discs over the 258mm standard is a LOT more than it sounds :)

Standard Area: 523cm2

ST170 Area: 707cm2

35% more surface area, and more importantly, the diameter - as the laws of physics dictate that it is easier/more efficient to stop a brake from the point furthest away from the rotational source (i.e. the middle) :)

[ford focus edge]

I think you'd find more braking improvement by uprating the brakes to ST170 brakes than you would using drilled and vented discs. 300mm discs over the 258mm standard is a LOT more than it sounds :)

Standard Area: 523cm2

ST170 Area: 707cm2

35% more surface area, and more importantly, the diameter - as the laws of physics dictate that it is easier/more efficient to stop a brake from the point furthest away from the rotational source (i.e. the middle) :)

Would that mean i need to upgrade the calipers aswell as the discs though, the main reason i was going to just wack on a set of grooved discs was that i didnt need to replace calipers and just make it less hasstle and when i come to sell the car on it dosent seem thrashed if its a little 1.6 with a set of dirty big st discs on the front.

Mike

[thesilverfox]

Would that mean i need to upgrade the calipers aswell as the discs though, the main reason i was going to just wack on a set of grooved discs was that i didnt need to replace calipers and just make it less hasstle and when i come to sell the car on it dosent seem thrashed if its a little 1.6 with a set of dirty big st discs on the front.

Mike

You would need a little work done, yes.

But arguably, someone could see non-standard discs and come to the exact same conclusion :) The discs you saw will be the cheaper option, but you might find the difference isn't quite night and day - a lot of it comes from the fact you are replacing worn discs and pads with new ones - regardless of standard, grooved or cross-drilled.

[ford focus edge]

You would need a little work done, yes.

But arguably, someone could see non-standard discs and come to the exact same conclusion :) The discs you saw will be the cheaper option, but you might find the difference isn't quite night and day - a lot of it comes from the fact you are replacing worn discs and pads with new ones - regardless of standard, grooved or cross-drilled.

Yeah true, i think il try the cheap option first though the standard brakes have always been enough for my liking they just cant take the torture of point to point country lanes and welsh back roads. As i say il really need to get the wheels of and have a good scout at it all before its all set in stone.

To do list for this month

Brakes

Mot

6yr service

Milage correction

Oh fun

Mike

[stef123]

I think you'd find more braking improvement by uprating the brakes to ST170 brakes than you would using drilled and vented discs. 300mm discs over the 258mm standard is a LOT more than it sounds :)

Standard Area: 523cm2

ST170 Area: 707cm2

35% more surface area, and more importantly, the diameter - as the laws of physics dictate that it is easier/more efficient to stop a brake from the point furthest away from the rotational source (i.e. the middle) :)

thats maybe a good idea if you have abs though...that would be suicide in my car.

[thesilverfox]

thats maybe a good idea if you have abs though...that would be suicide in my car.

Didn't pretty much all levels of Focus come with ABS as standard though? Perhaps excluding some entry-level models? Maybe it was more common from the MK 1.5 onwards? Ah, I've no idea!

[ford focus edge]

thats maybe a good idea if you have abs though...that would be suicide in my car.

I agree it is a good idea just very expensive! lol

Didn't pretty much all levels of Focus come with ABS as standard though? Perhaps excluding some entry-level models? Maybe it was more common from the MK 1.5 onwards? Ah, I've no idea!

I think all mk1.5's bar the 1.4 cl maybe? had ABS i thought it was a legal requirment as of 2004 anyway?

As for the brakes ive been busy all day so havent had the time to do the flippin things! doing my head in now sorry about taking so long to write back aswell guys had to take a trip to ford for my dad about his mondeo.

I was having a gander around the showroom and there was a st170 in there and the new rs and my god my brakes look like milk bottle lids compared to the monsters on the rs and even the 170.

I think what im going to do is mintex front discs and pads and get the rear shoes done at the service its desprate for at the end of the month.

Mike

[stef123]

I agree it is a good idea just very expensive! lol

I think all mk1.5's bar the 1.4 cl maybe? had ABS i thought it was a legal requirment as of 2004 anyway?

As for the brakes ive been busy all day so havent had the time to do the flippin things! doing my head in now sorry about taking so long to write back aswell guys had to take a trip to ford for my dad about his mondeo.

I was having a gander around the showroom and there was a st170 in there and the new rs and my god my brakes look like milk bottle lids compared to the monsters on the rs and even the 170.

I think what im going to do is mintex front discs and pads and get the rear shoes done at the service its desprate for at the end of the month.

Mike

i dont think abs was mandatory until like 2007/2008 or something like that? although if manufacturers were waiting that long to put it on their cars i dont think they would be selling many.

mine a a 1.6 'zetec' model and doesnt have abs which is quite poor considering they put alloys and better suspension..

[ford focus edge]

i dont think abs was mandatory until like 2007/2008 or something like that? although if manufacturers were waiting that long to put it on their cars i dont think they would be selling many.

mine a a 1.6 'zetec' model and doesnt have abs which is quite poor considering they put alloys and better suspension..

My edge has the same sort of standard spec as the zetec and that has ABS although mine is an 04 plate

Mike

[stef123]

My edge has the same sort of standard spec as the zetec and that has ABS although mine is an 04 plate

Mike

i think ford put abs as standard on all their cars from 2003.

[artscot79]

i think ford put abs as standard on all their cars from 2003.

stef is correct prior to 2003 it was just an option yet my passat had it standard and that was a 1998 mind you that had aircon climatronic alarm etc as standard but was more expensive when new to be honest i dont have the abs and i find it better in the winter as it allows the car to dig in and gt th grip abs doesnt

[stef123]

stef is correct prior to 2003 it was just an option yet my passat had it standard and that was a 1998 mind you that had aircon climatronic alarm etc as standard but was more expensive when new to be honest i dont have the abs and i find it better in the winter as it allows the car to dig in and gt th grip abs doesnt

ha even my 1999 clio had abs

yeah i agree about the lack of abs in the snow, ive driven a few cars with abs in the snow and i dont like them ;) i know its a safety feature but it has its moments.

[ford focus edge]

ha even my 1999 clio had abs

yeah i agree about the lack of abs in the snow, ive driven a few cars with abs in the snow and i dont like them ;) i know its a safety feature but it has its moments.

I think the world to abs granted in the snow it caused me to slide up the pavement but i find that CONTROLLED use of the handbrake is just as effective as not having abs because it digs the !Removed! of the car down, my 2 pence worth anyway lol.

Mike