Fiesta MK7.5 140PS can't downshift to 2nd gear

[Guest]

Hi all,

For the last few days I've been unable to downshift into 2nd gear. I can upshift from 1st to 2nd gear to problem, but when I try and downshift into 2nd I can't physically move the gearstick into the slot.

Weirdly, if I'm stationary even with the engine running I can downshift no problem - the issue only presents itself if the car is rolling.

My current workaround is to downshift to 1st then up to 2nd.

Would the cold temperatures we've been having cause this?

Thanks!

[Eric Bloodaxe]

On 2/10/2021 at 2:47 PM, echoantz said:

Would the cold temperatures we've been having cause this?

Hi Anthony.

I've certainly experienced gear selection difficulties on various cars in the past during extremely cold temperature, so it's always a possibility. You'll know if it improves when things warm up. If not, probably a garage/dealer issue.

Some owners have reported adjustment/lubrication of selector cables sorting their problem.

However, there is a known issue with synchros on the Mk 7.5 140 giving up the ghost. There are several threads on this site on the subject if you have a bit of a search around.

Some members have had gearboxes replaced under warranty (normal or extended), a few have had a contribution from Ford on out of warranty cars with full Ford service history.

 

 

[dtulip8]

The gearbox in my MK8 is pretty rubbish atm, I blame cold weather and not being driven much. Strange that you can’t get it in at all, could be synchros as mentioned above as they are a known issue particularly on the 140 MK7’s.

[Blatto]

Try double declutching see if that allows you to downchange ok, if it does it may well be syncro related.

[Edge of Reason]

In case you don’t understand double declutching, when you change down say from 3rd to 2nd, depress the clutch and move the gear stick from 3rd to the central (no gear) position, release the clutch, then depress the clutch again and move the gear stick to 2nd. As said above, if this helps select the gear then the synchromesh may well be at fault. 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

8 hours ago, Edge of Reason said:

In case you don’t understand double declutching, when you change down say from 3rd to 2nd, depress the clutch and move the gear stick from 3rd to the central (no gear) position, release the clutch, then depress the clutch again and move the gear stick to 2nd. As said above, if this helps select the gear then the synchromesh may well be at fault. 

I would add to that, on a downchange, give the accelerator a blip while the gear stick is in the neutral position to match engine and transmission speed.

[Blatto]

Yeah sorry I was forgetting I'm from an era when many cars had no syncro so Double de-clutching was the only way to change gear.

This video explains it fairly well including going down gears with a blip

 

 

 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

4 hours ago, Blatto said:

Yeah sorry I was forgetting I'm from an era when many cars had no syncro so Double de-clutching was the only way to change gear.

Lol, from this thread it looks as if there are at least 3 of us from the same era!😃

[Guest]

Many thanks for all the suggestions above. Double clutching and applying some acceleration does allow 2nd gear to engage when downshifting.

I've got the car booked in next week to replace the synchros. I've been advised that they've seen a lot of these and that 'it would probably happen again' - and to take it easy downshifting to 2nd gear if I can help it.

Out of interest I do have it running a bluefin remap, looking around on here would suggest this puts extra wear on the gearbox.

[Edge of Reason]

8 hours ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Lol, from this thread it looks as if there are at least 3 of us from the same era!😃

I’ve got an early 90’s DAF Horsebox. Sometimes double de-clutching is the only way once things get worn. But yes I’m slightly older than the majority here I suppose. 😉 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

9 hours ago, echoantz said:

Out of interest I do have it running a bluefin remap, looking around on here would suggest this puts extra wear on the gearbox.

Ah. Now if you'd only mentioned that in your first post.........😃

[Eric Bloodaxe]

2 hours ago, Edge of Reason said:

I’ve got an early 90’s DAF Horsebox. Sometimes double de-clutching is the only way once things get worn. But yes I’m slightly older than the majority here I suppose. 😉 

Yes, I last regularly used the technique back in the 70's when there were still a number of cars around without full synchro. 2 of my first 3 cars had "crash" firsts, as did our Morris Minor pool cars at work.

It's still a good trick to have up your sleeve if you encounter a dodgy box!

[Blatto]

11 hours ago, echoantz said:

Out of interest I do have it running a bluefin remap, looking around on here would suggest this puts extra wear on the gearbox.

Considering the gearbox is already close to it's max torque rating in the standard car, it's not surprising that it will be more likely to fail in a modified one. 

As far as I know 1st and 2nd gear are already artificially torque limited i.e you don't get the full engine torque in those two gears. Do you know if the map you have removes that limit? 

As for the future, once you get your syncros sorted, you might want to think about how you change gear with a view to reducing the possibilty of it reoccuring.

Obviously I don't know your driving style or if that was responsible for any damage to the syncros but the fact that you have a modified engine suggests you might like a sporty drive.😉

I did have the misfortune to get a lift from my friends son a few years back and I was horrified at the abuse he was giving his poor gearbox and brakes in an attempt to drive swiftly. Slamming it down through the gears and braking at the last minute are not the way to drive fast.

This guy is an ex police and performance driving instructor (and he doesn't hang about) and has a number of really good advanced driving videos on you tube.

Might be worth reviewing some of them just in case it's your driving style that's inducing gearbox problems.

 

 

[Guest]

 

6 hours ago, Blatto said:

Obviously I don't know your driving style or if that was responsible for any damage to the syncros but the fact that you have a modified engine suggests you might like a sporty drive.😉

I like it 'quick' 😉 - honestly though I got the remap to give the car better pull in 2nd as with the factory map lags a bit. Helps with overtaking.

Now I know about the 2nd gear synchro issue I'll try and take it a little easier downshifting where possible. The difficulty is I find 2nd gives the best acceleration - typically if I need the 'boost' at lower speeds I'll drop to 2nd.

[Blatto]

I always found 3rd gear at anything over 20mph was the best gear in my MK7.5 140, Wasn't torque limited and was good for over 70mph if you were in a real hurry.

What you might lose in the initial turbo lag you make up in not having an extra gear change later.

 

[TomsFocus]

Overtaking in 2nd!?  I'm definitely going to miss diesel...

 

[Blatto]

Well he must be overtaking at less than 60mph, it ran out of revs just before you got to that speed. I always thought 3rd on that model was a very versatile gear and decently quick for overtaking for a little 1 litre 3 pot.

 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

35 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Overtaking in 2nd!?  I'm definitely going to miss diesel...

 

Lol, I still do. After having about 25 years of oil burners I'd got used to changing up to get the next hit of torque! Using lots of revs in a car still seems a bit strange, though I used to quite happily rev a bike to 15,000. 

[Blatto]

25 minutes ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

I used to quite happily rev a bike to 15,000. 

Never used to go below 8,000 of my Fizzy (Yamaha FS1E for those too old to remember) 🙂

 

[Eric Bloodaxe]

3 hours ago, Blatto said:

Never used to go below 8,000 of my Fizzy (Yamaha FS1E for those too old to remember) 🙂

 

Never had one myself, but my then brother in law did - he was way over 6ft and looked ridiculous on it!😃

[Blatto]

Happy days, when mopeds were unrestricted. Head flat down on the tank and you could get it up to an indicated 55mph with a slight downhill.

Probably doing about 13,000 rpm, and nobody behind could see because of the cloud of two-stroke oil out the back 🙂

[NickNorth]

On 2/13/2021 at 6:12 PM, echoantz said:

 

I like it 'quick' 😉 - honestly though I got the remap to give the car better pull in 2nd as with the factory map lags a bit. Helps with overtaking.

Now I know about the 2nd gear synchro issue I'll try and take it a little easier downshifting where possible. The difficulty is I find 2nd gives the best acceleration - typically if I need the 'boost' at lower speeds I'll drop to 2nd.

Would be interested to know whether this was a synchro problem and is now resolved?

Have a 2016 Zetec S with the same problem. Gears up are ok but unable to select 2nd when shifting down from 3rd.  Found that when shifting down, a small push towards 1st (not selecting) will then allow selection of 2nd on the down shift.  Double declutch doesn't seem to work but that could be me not doing it correctly. 

[Guest]

Just to update this thread - I did have the 1st and 2nd synchro replaced, which did fix the issue... for a while. The issue has now come back exactly as it was before. Very frustrating.

The transmissions garage I used did warn me they've seen a lot of these and that the issue would very likely come back eventually, but I was hoping to have more than a few months.

[Edge of Reason]

I think I’d be taking it back. If you’ve replaced the synchros, then yes I would be expecting years rather than months. Unless of course it’s something else. 

[Bobr]

On 2/12/2021 at 11:20 PM, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Lol, from this thread it looks as if there are at least 3 of us from the same era!😃

Four actually Roger.   Even more important that double declutching is matching the revs.   I used to have a Granada Scorpio 4x4 and it had a bad habit of breaking clutch cables.   However I soon learned to drive it without a clutch simply by matching the revs.   I once drove from Mablethorpe to Nottingham with my mother in law in the car with me with no clutch.   She wasn't happy.