Auto-braking Assist incident

[northern_nubie]

Today, I had an alarming experience, out of the blue. Just left a roundabout and was on a dual carriageway. Going about 40mph, in 4th gear. Went to overtake a car, and suddenly it was like a nightmare. Horrible loud, constant noise from engine, it seemed, and couldn't accelerate. The noise was terrible. I thought this is a major problem, an emergency and I needed to stop. For a second I wondered if I had a flat tyre. Luckily there was a bus stop lay-by a hundred yards ahead. Pulled into it, still with the same problem and noise even when stationary (it was like the car had suddenly turned into a tractor, the noise was so bad). Turned off the engine. Then restarted the car. All was fine.

The noise, and maybe what felt like vibration, was the worst. Before turning off the car, I happened to notice a warning 'Auto-brake assist something something'. It seems from the user guide that auto-brake can put the brakes on if it senses a possible collision (part of the pre-collision assist system). I rang the large Ford dealer where I bought the car, then the local Ford dealer. I wanted to know if the noise is something which should happen during auto-braking. But because it's rare for it to happen to anyone, they had not experienced it and couldn't tell me. It feels like the car should be checked for damage, but what checks can they do?

You'd think Ford dealers would have access to a technical manual of sorts, something to let them know what happens precisely during auto-braking. It's made me slightly wary of the car, to be honest.

[northern_nubie]

Of course, I could contact Ford UK, wait over a month for the tech team to get back to the front line staff (as has happened several times to me in the recent past), only to be told very little of any use. They usually say go to the dealer. But if the dealer doesn't have very good information, there is no one to ask. 

[Nimrodmk8]

I personally hate the anti collision, the first time it happened I was going for an overtake must have drove too close and had a red flashing dash, I was overtaking the car and trying to read what it said, very distracting and dangerous, luckily it didn't seem to apply the brakes, which would have made it extra bad if oncoming vehicles were there, I've manage to turn down the sensitivity, but can not turn off, I'm old and don't need the warnings, I know if I've opened the drivers door and the engine is running.

[alexp999]

The car's systems are designed for the indicators to tell the car you are planning an overtake. It will stop things like lane correction and collision assist from intervening in the same way.

I've had very few issues with the sensitivity set to low for pre collision assist. And it has saved me once, so I'm keeping it on.

The issue in OP though sounds like a bug/issue. The system and sounds shouldn't linger once the immediate situation has passed.

[mjt]

5 hours ago, alexp999 said:

The car's systems are designed for the indicators to tell the car you are planning an overtake. It will stop things like lane correction and collision assist from intervening in the same way

Does that mean if you indicate to move into a right-turn lane at a junction it won't prevent you from rear-ending a car in the queue in front of you?

[alexp999]

1 minute ago, mjt said:

Does that mean if you indicate to move into a right-turn lane at a junction it won't prevent you from rear-ending a car in the queue in front of you?

I don't think indicating turns it off completely, but it changes the behaviour, particularly at speed.

Active city stop would be the system used at low speed and is probably not affected by indicating.

[northern_nubie]

10 hours ago, alexp999 said:

The car's systems are designed for the indicators to tell the car you are planning an overtake. It will stop things like lane correction and collision assist from intervening in the same way.

I've had very few issues with the sensitivity set to low for pre collision assist. And it has saved me once, so I'm keeping it on.

The issue in OP though sounds like a bug/issue. The system and sounds shouldn't linger once the immediate situation has passed.

Thanks for the reply, Alex. I've booked it into the dealer (week after next) so they can see if an event has been logged by the system. I hope so, because since posting this yesterday, I've concluded it was far more than just auto-braking. Today, thinking back to what happened, I'm pretty certain the car was accelerating itself. Hard to explain. It was a very odd, alarming and frankly dangerous incident. I only remembered today because to be honest I was a bit in shock yesterday and tired. And the loud noise from the engine, and possible vibration - none of it makes sense to me in the context of the pre-collision assist system. If it had just starting heavily braking, then fine. But it all sorts was going on.

[northern_nubie]

12 hours ago, Nimrodmk8 said:

I personally hate the anti collision, the first time it happened I was going for an overtake must have drove too close and had a red flashing dash, I was overtaking the car and trying to read what it said, very distracting and dangerous, luckily it didn't seem to apply the brakes, which would have made it extra bad if oncoming vehicles were there, I've manage to turn down the sensitivity, but can not turn off, I'm old and don't need the warnings, I know if I've opened the drivers door and the engine is running.

Since posting, I've concluded it may be far more than a problem with the pre-collision assist coming on when it shouldn't. Just replied to Alex below, and added a bit more info about what happened.

[northern_nubie]

On 4/20/2023 at 9:14 PM, northern_nubie said:

Today, I had an alarming experience, out of the blue. Just left a roundabout and was on a dual carriageway. Going about 40mph, in 4th gear. Went to overtake a car, and suddenly it was like a nightmare. Horrible loud, constant noise from engine, it seemed, and couldn't accelerate. The noise was terrible. I thought this is a major problem, an emergency and I needed to stop. For a second I wondered if I had a flat tyre. Luckily there was a bus stop lay-by a hundred yards ahead. Pulled into it, still with the same problem and noise even when stationary (it was like the car had suddenly turned into a tractor, the noise was so bad). Turned off the engine. Then restarted the car. All was fine.

The noise, and maybe what felt like vibration, was the worst. Before turning off the car, I happened to notice a warning 'Auto-brake assist something something'. It seems from the user guide that auto-brake can put the brakes on if it senses a possible collision (part of the pre-collision assist system). I rang the large Ford dealer where I bought the car, then the local Ford dealer. I wanted to know if the noise is something which should happen during auto-braking. But because it's rare for it to happen to anyone, they had not experienced it and couldn't tell me. It feels like the car should be checked for damage, but what checks can they do?

You'd think Ford dealers would have access to a technical manual of sorts, something to let them know what happens precisely during auto-braking. It's made me slightly wary of the car, to be honest.

I've got my Focus booked in with a dealer, next week, so they can plug it in and perhaps see what happened. But I was browsing the user guide today and came across Lane-keep Assist. I've never used it, but I see it's very easy to turn on, on the end of the indicator stalk. I'm wondering if at least part of horrible thing I experienced was me inadvertently turning it on. I usually indicate when pulling out to overtake on a dual carriageway, which would disable lane-keep assist if I'd accidentally just put it on. But maybe I didn't indicate. Maybe lane-keep assist kicked in. The warning, I read, is vibration, exactly what I experienced - but in my case really bad vibration. But also Auto-brake kicked in too, I saw it on the dashboard display when I pulled in.

When the technicians plug into my car, will they be able to see all events - such as whether lane-keep assist was used on that day, at that time, do you think? And auto-brake too?

[pcaouolte]

I think that you can change the levels of vibration in the cluster menu and if you do this with the engine running and your hand on the steering wheel you can feel the different levels of vibration as you select them in the menu. This might give you an idea if that it what you felt.

[northern_nubie]

On 4/29/2023 at 5:36 PM, pcaouolte said:

I think that you can change the levels of vibration in the cluster menu and if you do this with the engine running and your hand on the steering wheel you can feel the different levels of vibration as you select them in the menu. This might give you an idea if that it what you felt.

In the Lane Keeping System I've now changed the mode to Alert (other two options are Aid, and Alert & Aid). It was set to the Alert & Aid. I set the Alert Intensity to the lowest setting. It was on the medium setting. When I changed the setting it didn't demonstrate the vibration intensity, so I've no idea how less intense it will be. When you change the intensity in settings, with engine turned on, does the steering wheel vibrate in your Focus?

I'm in two minds about whether to take it into a dealer. It's booked in for Wednesday. I never use Lane Keeping, but may have turned it on accidentally as I started to overtake. In the stress of what happened I'm fairly certain that it was more than just steering wheel vibration (though it might just have been that). Strangely, even when I'd pulled in a 100 yards further on and was stationary, the vibration was still taking place - until I'd turned off the car. Is the vibration supposed to turn itself off after a while, or after you've taken action to get back in lane?

And, as I said above, just before turning off the car, I noticed the display behind the steering wheel said something about Auto-brake having operated (or similar words). But there'd been no audible warning.

 

 

 

[Nimrodmk8]

17 hours ago, northern_nubie said:

In the Lane Keeping System I've now changed the mode to Alert (other two options are Aid, and Alert & Aid). It was set to the Alert & Aid. I set the Alert Intensity to the lowest setting. It was on the medium setting. When I changed the setting it didn't demonstrate the vibration intensity, so I've no idea how less intense it will be. When you change the intensity in settings, with engine turned on, does the steering wheel vibrate in your Focus?

I'm in two minds about whether to take it into a dealer. It's booked in for Wednesday. I never use Lane Keeping, but may have turned it on accidentally as I started to overtake. In the stress of what happened I'm fairly certain that it was more than just steering wheel vibration (though it might just have been that). Strangely, even when I'd pulled in a 100 yards further on and was stationary, the vibration was still taking place - until I'd turned off the car. Is the vibration supposed to turn itself off after a while, or after you've taken action to get back in lane?

And, as I said above, just before turning off the car, I noticed the display behind the steering wheel said something about Auto-brake having operated (or similar words). But there'd been no audible warning.

 

 

 

You never use lane assist? you probably use your eyes, like me.

[tomo2001]

We have lane keeping assist on our 2019 MK4 and TBH it is very inobtrusive. The vibration and corrective steering is quite mild. I think what you felt is possibly the active breaking which sometimes kicks in when you don't expect it. Not sure if this uses camera, radar or both but I've encountered it when you think you have given another car plenty of space, I've had it in bright sunlight so I would assume it does use the camera and is affected by reflections or bright light. These system are manufactured by electronic companies like Bosch as an e.g. and fitted to all different makes of vehicles. My other car also suffers from 'phantom' breaking but the worse one I had was a Nissan Qashqai. I even saw a video on the Nissan forums where it is triggered by someone driving at night who's headlights are reflected by someone walking on a footpath with a jacket on with reflective strips on.

[Nimrodmk8]

Thanks to this forum I now know where the button is for lane assist, I also know to avoid it as it's not required.

[northern_nubie]

On 5/2/2023 at 5:25 PM, tomo2001 said:

We have lane keeping assist on our 2019 MK4 and TBH it is very inobtrusive. The vibration and corrective steering is quite mild. I think what you felt is possibly the active breaking which sometimes kicks in when you don't expect it. Not sure if this uses camera, radar or both but I've encountered it when you think you have given another car plenty of space, I've had it in bright sunlight so I would assume it does use the camera and is affected by reflections or bright light. These system are manufactured by electronic companies like Bosch as an e.g. and fitted to all different makes of vehicles. My other car also suffers from 'phantom' breaking but the worse one I had was a Nissan Qashqai. I even saw a video on the Nissan forums where it is triggered by someone driving at night who's headlights are reflected by someone walking on a footpath with a jacket on with reflective strips on.

I'm a bit late responding, but better late then never. I never did find out the cause. Long story. Despite the seriousness of the incident (in heavier traffic I reckon it may well have caused an accident) I was told that Ford diagnostics would not identify what happened because no dash warning light was illuminated after the incident. And if they didn't find anything, I'd be charged for a diagnostics check, despite still having over three years warranty left on the almost new vehicle. So they never plugged into my car.

The whole experience with dealers and Ford UK trying to sort out my issue, has been very frustrating and disappointing. I don't use FordPass, but the dealer said if I started using it, it would download the last 60 days of info, possibly showing my incident flagged on the date it happened. A number of weeks later, but still within the 60 days I decided to start using FordPass to try to find out the cause of incident, but before I did I happened to ask if it only logs faults if you're already using the app. The dealer said, oh, actually the app wouldn't show my incident, because I wasn't using the app at the time. So i didn't start using the app. Why he didn't say at the start is beyond me.

I find it a bit silly that diagnostics won't list a series of recent untoward events, but the app generates it . It's like a form of DIY diagnostics. I enjoy driving the car, but find the support from Ford not too good, although the frontline staff are always first rate.