WPWsyndrome Posted June 5 Share Posted June 5 Hello guys, I hope everything is good. Recently, I started to have an "Engine Malfunction" error on my Ford that's shutting off the engine while driving. The diagnostics found following codes: P0193 - Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor "A" Circuit High P0698 - Sensor Reference Voltage Circuit "C" Low P0490 - Exhaust Gas Recirculation "A" Control Circuit High P042F - Exhaust Gas Recirculation "A" Control Stuck Closed I am looking everywhere over the internet to find some engine diagram that would tell me where I can find the Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor for my car but I can't manage to find it. Did anyone change it and could give me a an explanation where should I look for it? Other than that, I have found one video on YouTube (link) that says that an issue with EGR valve (all the other codes the diagnostics found on my car) might short circuit the FRP Sensor as well. I wanted to ask if anyone had similar issue, and if changing EGR valve also corrected the FRP issue, or if you had to exchange the FRP Sensor. Either way, I will exchange the EGR valve and try it out to see if this was the main issue or if the FRP sensor will have to be replaced as well. (this is my first fault of my first car, and after going through multiple tutorials and posts,I didn't expect it to be so complicated hahaha) Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 11 hours ago, WPWsyndrome said: (this is my first fault of my first car, and after going through multiple tutorials and posts,I didn't expect it to be so complicated hahaha) Well, this is a difficult fault to start with... Like taking your driving test in a bus! The fuel rail on this engine is very awkward to access, right behind the engine. I can't post a picture because even with the engine removed from the car, you still can't see it. The best advice I can give here is to locate any one of the solid metal fuel pipes coming from any injector and then follow that back down the engine. Those pipes go directly into the rail. Then the sensor is on the end of the rail, it's the only electrical part of the rail itself so you can't mistake it. Personally, I would also tackle the EGR fault first, so I think you've made the best choice there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPWsyndrome Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 7 minutes ago, TomsFocus said: Well, this is a difficult fault to start with... Like taking your driving test in a bus! The fuel rail on this engine is very awkward to access, right behind the engine. I can't post a picture because even with the engine removed from the car, you still can't see it. The best advice I can give here is to locate any one of the solid metal fuel pipes coming from any injector and then follow that back down the engine. Those pipes go directly into the rail. Then the sensor is on the end of the rail, it's the only electrical part of the rail itself so you can't mistake it. Personally, I would also tackle the EGR fault first, so I think you've made the best choice there. Thank you for the reply! The reason why I am panicking a little is because the MOT is in around 10 days and I have been trying to plan the most optimal approach which is also cost effective (some DIY with the help of my cousins workshop). I have read also that the EGR can be deleted from the car's software for smaller price than actually replacing it (I have found a workshop that would do it for 100 euros), and the argument was that it has also other benefits to the fuel consumption. Nevertheless, the car might not pass through emission test if they measure for NOx, which I am yet to find if they do in my country. Do you think it might be one solution to tackle EGR related faults in the future? I will let other readers of this post know how the replacement went once it's done, and if the FRP has to be replaced still. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 7 minutes ago, WPWsyndrome said: Thank you for the reply! The reason why I am panicking a little is because the MOT is in around 10 days and I have been trying to plan the most optimal approach which is also cost effective (some DIY with the help of my cousins workshop). I have read also that the EGR can be deleted from the car's software for smaller price than actually replacing it (I have found a workshop that would do it for 100 euros), and the argument was that it has also other benefits to the fuel consumption. Nevertheless, the car might not pass through emission test if they measure for NOx, which I am yet to find if they do in my country. Do you think it might be one solution to tackle EGR related faults in the future? I will let other readers of this post know how the replacement went once it's done, and if the FRP has to be replaced still. Cheers. Ah, that's not an ideal situation with the MOT so soon. There are no benefits to removing the EGR at all, it won't give you more power or decrease your fuel consumption compared to a working EGR. (Obviously it could be better than a broken EGR). Personally, I'd still recommend replacing it rather than removing it, but it's your choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPWsyndrome Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 10 hours ago, TomsFocus said: Ah, that's not an ideal situation with the MOT so soon. There are no benefits to removing the EGR at all, it won't give you more power or decrease your fuel consumption compared to a working EGR. (Obviously it could be better than a broken EGR). Personally, I'd still recommend replacing it rather than removing it, but it's your choice. I called the previous owner and he mentioned the same issue with EGR valve. He mentioned that it was replaced 2 times in a workshop and it didn't work, so he got mad and went to the workshop to overlook the replacement (distrust is very common here, but to be honest I can't blame a frustrated Ford owner). They replaced it with a more expensive one for the 3rd time and it worked. I ordered a cheaper EGR valve (for about 60 euros) from a trusted distributor (they distribute in 2 countries to workshops) since my friend has a good experience as they have been purchasing numerous times for their workshop. It should arrive tomorrow and the added benefit is that I can return it in case it would still show a faulty message (and possibly the engine malfunction warning won't be resolved - of course with the pain in the ***** engine turning off). I have one additional question if you don't mind. I understand that after replacing the EGR valve, I should reset the EGR valve learned values. They have their hands on some software that we also used for diagnostics (I believe it's from TEXA, most possibly the IDC5) and I hope that I can find how to reset the learned values. I just wanted to make sure, is that the standard procedure, and if so, should I be aware of something before I do that? Thank you once again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizer Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 You need to be careful with the EGR Valves for these cars. The original ones were made by Valeo and are Identical to the ones fitted to the Peugeot/Citroen variations of the exact same Engine except the Ford ones are different Electrically, so an aftermarket one that the makers claim can be used in Ford as well as Peugeot/Citroen cars may not work properly. It is normal to reset the EGR Learned Values with a Diagnostic Tool. FORScan is the Ford Specific one that most people on this Forum use. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPWsyndrome Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 14 hours ago, Tizer said: You need to be careful with the EGR Valves for these cars. The original ones were made by Valeo and are Identical to the ones fitted to the Peugeot/Citroen variations of the exact same Engine except the Ford ones are different Electrically, so an aftermarket one that the makers claim can be used in Ford as well as Peugeot/Citroen cars may not work properly. It is normal to reset the EGR Learned Values with a Diagnostic Tool. FORScan is the Ford Specific one that most people on this Forum use. Thank you very much for the comment. When it comes to the reset of the learned values, I have read somewhere that after replacing the EGR and reseting the learned values, you should let the engine idle for 5 minutes so that the new one has time to learn and adapt. Do you have experience with this? I will follow this procedure as there is nothing to lose just 5 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizer Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 1 hour ago, WPWsyndrome said: When it comes to the reset of the learned values, I have read somewhere that after replacing the EGR and reseting the learned values, you should let the engine idle for 5 minutes so that the new one has time to learn and adapt. Do you have experience with this? I will follow this procedure as there is nothing to lose just 5 minutes. I have never heard of doing it that way and I don't know if it works or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveT70 Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 I would strongly recommend only purchasing a genuine Ford EGR valve. Values can be reset using forscan. Fix the EGR before you start messing with the fuel rail, that may cure it Clear all the DTCs before resetting EGR learned values Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPWsyndrome Posted June 7 Author Share Posted June 7 UPDATE: I have changed the EGR valve with a new one that I got for a fair price (it's this one - link, however I payed significantly less since it was wholesale price for my cousins workshop). Since there was an issue with the fuel rail pressure (FRP) sensor, I initially wanted to replace only the EGR valve and see if the FRP sensor issue will resolve itself (as I mentioned here in the thread), as I have found in one video that short-circuited EGR valve can cause problems with FRP sensor. Nevertheless, when I dismantled the EGR valve, I found out that the FRP sensor is located just below the valve (see attached photo), so it would be pain in the *** to dismantle the new EGR again just to replace the FRP sensor in case it was faulted. As such, we ordered new sensor (this one - link), that came in couple of hours while the hood was opened and EGR dismantled, and replaced both FRP sensor and the EGR valve. After changing both, we reset EGR learned values through diagnostic tool (before turning on the engine). After that, we deleted the faulty codes and started the engine. I also read that you should let it idle for 5 minutes before driving so that the software learns to work with the new EGR valve, and after 5 minutes we took it for a drive. No shutting off so far, and I noticed increase in output straight away. As such, the whole problem was solved for around 90 euros, and I can imagine if I just sent it to a workshop, it wouldn't take so short and I would ended up paying significantly more. Nevertheless, I had the privilege of working in my cousins workshop (it's a tire workshop/garage) and the prices were also lower since they buy directly from wholesale. I have read that many of you guys had issues with the EGR shortly after replacing it, so I hope that it won't happen in my case. Good luck with your endeavours! Also thank you for your comments. Cheers! 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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