Just wondering what fellow ST owners make of this German superior quality frame of mind, I can agree with that statement but the ST is quality built, apart from the flimsy arm rest haha!

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The build quality of the ST isn't too bad, it's not as high as the German brands but neither is the price. It does what I want it too very well and I'm not bothered that it doesn't sound like a golf when I close the for.

Oh and the ST is German too.

Gti is not normally top of the range anyway in the same way that st is beaten by RS

for instance gti gets beaten by r32

Gti is not normally top of the range anyway in the same way that st is beaten by RS

for instance gti gets beaten by r32

It's still made the same though. Build quality isn't going to be better the more power it has. The base spec golf will be screwed together just as well as the R.

Fiesta isn't even aiming at the golf. Its class equivalent VW is the Polo.

The Golf GTI equivalent is the Focus ST. I don't think VW have a Polo GTI do they? The fiesta STs main competition is from the French manufacturers.

250bhp Polo R on the way though apparently.

Polo GTI is 1.4 Turbo/Supercharged engine with a 7 speed DSG dual clutch gearbox.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/volkswagen/polo/first-drives/volkswagen-polo-gti

Ah so they do do one. Although the review seems to suggest it doesn't really live up to the GTI badge so maybe that is why I haven't really heard of it before.

My partner had the polo gti and exchanged for the golf gti and the golf is miles ahead of the polo. As said above the golf should be "compared" to the focus st but the polo gti had nothing on the fiesta st anyway... (slower, no special equip, looked duller etc etc). Must admit my st keeps up with the golf gti

Polo R is already out. Have you guys ever taken the time just to look at the panel gaps between a golf gti and a focus st? Or polo gti and fiesta St. It's shocking. Some panels are like 1 mm apart, the headlight washers are flush with the body work and almost no gap for a moving parts that impressive quality. Ford on the other hand doesn't even have xenons/washers for the fiesta and washers on the focus are body mounted rather than flush, huge gaps around bonnet etc. Love my focus I just cannot deny the german quality even though ford Europe is based in Germany.

Polo R isn't out yet, don't think it's more than a prototype either. Did you mean the golf?

You are paying for the quality though, if I was paying £35k for an car I'd expect it to be well put together. The ST is about £16k and is fun to drive so I don't need to go measuring panel gaps to find something good to say about it or to justify the price.

Pointing out the panel gap because on the Mk2.5 focus when the gaps on the rear quarter panels gets that close it strips the paint and rust happens as a result. That's an important difference to vw.

A golf gti is 26k and focud St currently is 22k. It's not fair to compare the price of a golf gti to a fiesta St furthermore the golf r is 30k

The OP wasn't comparing an ST to a GTI or an R, fiesta, focus golf or polo. He was asking what people thought of the perception that German cars are better built and that the ST isn't that badly put together in his opinion.

Considering the price difference of similar models then you would expect the German car to be better built, even though this doesn't make it any faster or better or more fun to drive.

I know what you mean on the focus though, usually it just needs the bumper adjusting.

German cars are just as good/bad as anything else on the market. They have produced some shockingly bad cars recently.

On my motorway drive to work every day the most common car I see on the hard shoulder? German!

Everybody laughed when I bought a diesel Mondeo in 2002 but 9 years and 158K miles later it had seen off their Passat/A4/3 Series with its original clutch/flywheel/turbo/fuel pump and injectors.

All these 'Premium' German cars had clutches/flywheels/turbo & gearbox replacements.

Give me a Ford any day!