TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Hi guys, So this morning I get in the car, it starts and drives as normal, bit jumpy but its a cold/damp morning so not unusual. Few mins in I turn a corner and accelerate gently in 3rd when I should've been in 2nd - engine malfunction light comes on. I pull over, switch off, switch on again and no light. Accelerate in 1st and the light immediately comes back on, it now won't go off at all! It's also in limp mode, lacking power and won't pass 3k. Got home and got Forscan on it, few old DPF faults but the only current one is P0380-61. Glow plug control circuit. Now live tests show that the plugs (or at least the circuit) is permanently on, I've been out the probably 15 mins and they haven't switched off at all!! Hopefully this is water ingress short somewhere, but I don't know where the relay(s) are for them? None in the engine bay fusebox look big enough for glow plugs. I should also add it really stinks of part burnt diesel, but theres no visible smoke due to the DPF. Now with plugs stuck on it should be burning really clean, so I'm confused here. Also worth noting the engine fan came on when I hit 3k stationary despite coolant and DPF temps being low - not sure if it was trying to start a regen while idling! But yeah, firstly, where is the glowplug relay and any associated wiring? I don't really want to have to access the plugs themselves if I can help it. Cheers Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 The most common & probable cause is that one or all of the glow plugs are faulty / failing - probably just the one & they need to be tested to see if they all glow when voltage is applied On this engine the plugs are connected in parallel & each plug has a resistance value & when one or more fail the resistance value is negatively altered & a signal is sent to the PCM which then illuminates the EML & results in limp mode I can't help with relay location I'm afraid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Another possibility is poor / bad connections to the plugs themselves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 It is not unusual for glowplugs to '' stay on '' during the early stages of engine operation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 I drove through a lot of flood water last night (not through choice!), and it just seems unlikely that plugs themselves would fail today, odd coincidence if so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 It is not unusual for glowplugs to '' stay on '' during the early stages of engine operationTrue but they usually cycle, on for a few mins then off for a minute then on again, I've never seen them stuck on like that in previous live tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 The fact that you've never seen it before could partially answer your question - this is possibly part of the issue Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Water ingress would cause a temporary short & could easily cause this issue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Check the connections to the plugs for evidence of damp / water Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Just been informed the relay is under the NS headlight (great place for water ingress lol!) so will go and check that now. :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Of course the presence of water where it shouldn't be will cause the same detrimental voltage effects as far as the PCM / ECU are concerned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Well, I can't find the relay... Only things I can see down there are air con drier and power steering bottle (which is covered in PAS fluid). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 PAS fluid leak too ? These things are sent to try us . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Well the fluid is probably leaking out the cap I reckon, level isn't too low so will ignore that for now lol. Haynes manual doesn't mention anything other than the plugs themselves. Not really what to try now other than stripping off the bulkhead panels and checking/changing the plugs. Anyone got any more ideas? Or know how much the plugs cost from Ford? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 As I previously stated, check the connections on the plugs - something is causing a difference in resistance to be logged by the PCM / ECU Easiest & cheapest fix first :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Yeah true, it still needs stripping to even see the plugs or connectors though (I hate this engine haha), don't want to have to put it back together to drive to ford to strip it down again. Might buy a set (price dependant!), strip it tomorrow when I don't need it and check plugs and connectors then. Can always return them if not needed and I need it this afternoon anyway, limp mode will have to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Those of you familiar with the Mk2.5 Focus may have noticed my major error... The AC drier and PAS res are on the OS...I was meant to be looking at the NS!! Fail... I'll go and check again then... ;) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Get your coat while you're at it - you're fired ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 17, 2015 Author Share Posted September 17, 2015 Well, it wasn't there either. Turned out it was in the fusebox afterall. Tried swapping it and no difference. Couldn't see any damaged wiring either.Limped to Ford to buy a set of plugs...£73!? Gave that a miss lol. Used Sainsburys Wifi to reserve some at ECP and... On leaving sainsburys had an IBS episode kick in so had to limp it home as briskly as possible. Half hour later left for ECP, that was an hour round trip. Got back and started stripping the bay...it took about 2 hours just to access the glow plugs!! And then I found out a normal deep 8mm socket doesn't fit glowplugs. So now I have a stripped car and no tool to replace the plugs. Fed up is an understatement... <_< PS - In the unlikely event that someone is local and has an 8mm glowplug socket that they could bring over in the morning, please drop me a PM! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 18, 2015 Author Share Posted September 18, 2015 So, just to round this off (hopefully)... Put the car back together and drove to Machine Mart for a glow plug socket, the do a Laser set of 3 for £20 which isn't bad, especially as I may need the other sizes in the future, seems decent quality too. Have replaced the plugs and so far no more issues, but will be giving it a longer run this afternoon so that should show any more problems. Unfortunately couldn't find the EGR blank, really don't know where that's gone, wanted to fit it while I was in that area but obviously couldn't. Will have to order another! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee_82 Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 The EGR is pretty simple if you move the fuel filter out the way so I wouldn't worry about that, hope that's the end of that drama, did the DPF get sorted yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 The joys of remote diagnosis :) Hope it's permanently sorted Tom :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 18, 2015 Author Share Posted September 18, 2015 Cheers guys. Tbh Mark, I'm still amazed that it was a coincidence the plugs failed after driving through floods! So far no more issues, but tomorrow mornings cold start should be the best test. I had the EGR completely off to access the plugs, the glowplug wiring bracket is held behind the EGR cooler bracket...what a daft design! So would've been easier to do while I was there but not the end of the world, will get another ordered tonight if I remember. No the DPF hasn't been 'sorted' yet, I really want an OE one to gut tbh, though I have had a better priced map as a favour so that's looking possible now. Tbh I'm thinking about buying a spares/repair DV6 Focus with a blocked DPF, chucking an aftermarket dpf on it, or breaking for parts, and either way keeping the OE DPF to gut, using the profit from selling on/breaking to pay for the map... Just an idea atm though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONDEO TXS 2.2 Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 The fault code you posted was accurate, flood or no flood, the most probable cause was as the code suggested - faulty plug (s ) :) Job's a good 'un :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsFocus Posted September 18, 2015 Author Share Posted September 18, 2015 True, I can't argue with that! :D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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