jamesm182

Got A Question About Tyres? Ask The Michelin Expert!

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Michelin have kindly agreed to be available to answer all your questions on tyres.
"Ask the Expert" will run for the month of October 2015.
FordOC-Michelin.jpg
Ford Owners Club are pleased to announce that we have managed to acquire the services of Jamie McWhir, Michelin UK Technical Manager, for our "Ask The Expert" thread on tyres.
So if it's a question on tyre pressures, tyre choice, tyre ratings, tyre wear, mixing tyres, brands, Super sports, Cup 2's, Primacy 3's, Pilot Sport 3's, Cross Climates, Energy Savers or just about anything and everything tyre related then please ask away in this thread ... :)
Questions will be answered by Jamie McWhir, Michelin UK Technical Manager

Profile: Jamie McWhir, Michelin UK Technical Manager
Career Highlights:
- Worked in the Michelin motorsport team with the BTCC and Vauxhall 888 from 1997 to 2000
- F1 Race Engineer for Michelin, France with the Renault F1 team, working with Alonso, Button, Fisichella, Trulli, McNish & Webber
- Masters Degree in Motorsport Engineering at Cranfield t
- Tyre Support Engineer, Red Bull Racing in 2007-2009
- Now Michelin Technical Manager, UK , responsible for Car, Van & 4x4 tyres
"Ask the Expert" begins on Thursday 1st October

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Hi,

My !.6 ltr Petrol Ford Focus Mk 2.5 is fitted with Michelin Primacy 3 tyres. The recommended pressures for the 205/16/R16 are 30psi on the front and 33psi at the rear. I find this unusual as normally with the heavy engine it the front I would have though it to be the other way round. It handles well and the tyre wear seems normal. I would just welcome your comments.

Thank you

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what is the real legality of the Load & Speed Index of tyres fitted to particular (and different spec of basically same) vehicles either as originally "type approved" or as aftermarket. In particular winter tyres where road conditions mean very unlikely to get to such speeds as "H" rating even if the summer tyres are "V" rating

If the load rating of a tyre (per such as ETRTO) is above the permitted maxim loaded mass of the vehicle axles from the VIN plate but below what was originally fitted what is counted as the legal position?

thanks

Richard

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Could you recommend a quiet running tyre for a 2011 Fiesta 1.25 as the tyres installed give a considerable amount of road noise even at modest speeds.

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Hi Jamie,

With UK weather more temperate than the continent, for the few possible weeks of snow in the winter months, it has been too much a trade off for me to sacrifice the ride and noise quality as well as the bother of swapping to Winter Tyres for the few months and storing them back again. So I have instead gone for All Season tyres over the past years. But for them to be effective in the winter months, I need to change them well before they are at the minimal tread depth, right?

My main question though, has Michelin ever done back to back testing with All Season / Winter tyres fitted to just the fronts only on front wheel drive vehicles rather than both front and rears at varying road conditions? If you have how can you share your findings?

Thanks

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now that we have tyre expert on board can we expect any discounts on tyres

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now that we have tyre expert on board can we expect any discounts on tyres

He's here to answer questions & give advice to us Free of charge..

FOC supporters will find that we already have a

5% discount at "tyre shopper"

&

5% discount at "etyres"

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I've got a 2011 Mondeo on 215/50R17 tyres and alloys. I'm thinking of using steel wheels and winter tyres from my old 2014 Mondeo 205/55R16 (only used for 2 winters so very little wear). I'd be grateful for some advice.

I calculate that there's a 15mm drop in diameter. Is this a problem?

Would I be better off replacing the tyres with ones of matching diameter?

Will I need different wheel nuts?

I'm planning on using plastic wheel trims on the steel wheels (might look naff?) as alloys (which would look a lot better) seem too costly just to use for the winter. Is there better solution, which might also offer a better wheel/tyre combination?

Thanks,

David

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Guys

Firstly.. Hello..

Apologies for me taking my time to get on here, but after a few days of testing @ MIRA (motor industry research institute) near Nuneaton and a few very looooooooonnnnnnnnngggggggg days.. I'm catching up. so hello and thank you for allowing me the chance to discuss tyres..

I'm a bit of a blue badge man myself, (although I do have a BMW Z4 as a toy at present) I've had XR2's, several Focuses (including a MK1 RS :ph34r: ) and my company car is a 2012 Mondeo TDCI Titanium X.. so I'm Ford through and through..

Right now to some answers...

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Hi,

My !.6 ltr Petrol Ford Focus Mk 2.5 is fitted with Michelin Primacy 3 tyres. The recommended pressures for the 205/16/R16 are 30psi on the front and 33psi at the rear. I find this unusual as normally with the heavy engine it the front I would have though it to be the other way round. It handles well and the tyre wear seems normal. I would just welcome your comments.

Thank you

Tyre pressures do have to cover the load of the vehicle, so while the loads do influence the tyre pressures, the main reason for the pressures being different, tends to be due to getting the approriate vehicle handling balance

So whilst Ford was developing the car, they will have tried different set ups and found the one that gave the car the balance they were looking for. So that's the reason why..

The tyre manufacturers never set the pressures, the vehicle manufacturers do.

Hope that helps

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what is the real legality of the Load & Speed Index of tyres fitted to particular (and different spec of basically same) vehicles either as originally "type approved" or as aftermarket. In particular winter tyres where road conditions mean very unlikely to get to such speeds as "H" rating even if the summer tyres are "V" rating

If the load rating of a tyre (per such as ETRTO) is above the permitted maxim loaded mass of the vehicle axles from the VIN plate but below what was originally fitted what is counted as the legal position?

thanks

Richard

The legal position in the UK is straight forward

The speed rating must cover the maximum speed of the vehicle. The load rating must be capable of carrying the maximum permissable load in service.

What would I recommend? Well the other thing you need to take into account is the approved LI/SI (load index speed index) by the vehicle manufacturer, as your insurance company may consider this. Some do, some don't

The other thing I'd say is that the manufacturers sometimes choose a higher load and speed index than the car needs as the stiffness of the tyre can suit the handling more than a standard spec of tyre.

There is also a consideration for mixing. I would never recommend mixing specs on an axle, and there is a lot to be said for having the same spec on the car, both from safety and grip.

I'd always say stick to what's on the car if you can..

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Could you recommend a quiet running tyre for a 2011 Fiesta 1.25 as the tyres installed give a considerable amount of road noise even at modest speeds.

Depends upon the size.. let me know if you want a specific recommendation

The new CrossClimate tyre is very quiet and has brilliant all year round capabilities.. (Winter and Summer) and it's one wave and 68/69db in the noise figures for Tyre Labelling..

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Hi Jamie,

With UK weather more temperate than the continent, for the few possible weeks of snow in the winter months, it has been too much a trade off for me to sacrifice the ride and noise quality as well as the bother of swapping to Winter Tyres for the few months and storing them back again. So I have instead gone for All Season tyres over the past years. But for them to be effective in the winter months, I need to change them well before they are at the minimal tread depth, right?

My main question though, has Michelin ever done back to back testing with All Season / Winter tyres fitted to just the fronts only on front wheel drive vehicles rather than both front and rears at varying road conditions? If you have how can you share your findings?

Thanks

Well.. That's why I was @ MIRA

I can really recommend our new tyre (and this isn't an advert.. it's the best advice for this B) ) the Michelin CrossClimate

As it gives you the best of Summer performance, and great winter performance (it's winter certified (3pMSF)

I'd never recommend just doing a pair of winter capable tyres on the front axle (drive axle) as you end up unbalancing the car in winter conditions, e.g. you have grip on one axle and no grip on the other..

Yes, you do need at least 2-3mm for the winter tyre to be effective but that depends.. some brands don't have full depth sipes (unlike ours) so they can lose performance as the tyre wears.

You can do the CrossClimate in pairs (with winter/summer or all season pairs on the other axle) but 4 is the best and safest option

Let me know if you want other specific info (send me the tyre size for the S-Max..)

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The legal position in the UK is straight forward

The speed rating must cover the maximum speed of the vehicle. The load rating must be capable of carrying the maximum permissable load in service.

What would I recommend? Well the other thing you need to take into account is the approved LI/SI (load index speed index) by the vehicle manufacturer, as your insurance company may consider this. Some do, some don't

The other thing I'd say is that the manufacturers sometimes choose a higher load and speed index than the car needs as the stiffness of the tyre can suit the handling more than a standard spec of tyre.

There is also a consideration for mixing. I would never recommend mixing specs on an axle, and there is a lot to be said for having the same spec on the car, both from safety and grip.

I'd always say stick to what's on the car if you can..

Please excuse a follow up

Is the vehicle approved Li/Si likely to differ by model (trim level) variant rather than by engine size (Overall weight) and are such figures something the vehicle manufacturers are likely to let the vehicle owner see

I'm part of both this and an alternative CMax owners forum and the fitting of M+S / Snow tyres is something that comes up quite often especially in relation to the indices

thanks

Richard

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I've got a 2011 Mondeo on 215/50R17 tyres and alloys. I'm thinking of using steel wheels and winter tyres from my old 2014 Mondeo 205/55R16 (only used for 2 winters so very little wear). I'd be grateful for some advice.

I calculate that there's a 15mm drop in diameter. Is this a problem?

Would I be better off replacing the tyres with ones of matching diameter?

Will I need different wheel nuts?

I'm planning on using plastic wheel trims on the steel wheels (might look naff?) as alloys (which would look a lot better) seem too costly just to use for the winter. Is there better solution, which might also offer a better wheel/tyre combination?

Thanks,

David

David

Ok..

Whilst 215/50-17 converts to 215/55-16 closer. The 205/55-16 fitment is also used on some Mondeo's

Hence absolutely no reason at all why you can't fit the four steel wheels and tyres you alreay have.

The best all year round solution is our new CrossClimate tyre giving you great summer and great winter performance in one tyre. So that would avoid you having to use two sets, but if you've got a set of winter's on steels, there's no reason not to use them, unless your 17" tyres are due to be changed. You could go to CrossClimate's and sell the winter tyre set on here or ebay..

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Please excuse a follow up

Is the vehicle approved Li/Si likely to differ by model (trim level) variant rather than by engine size (Overall weight) and are such figures something the vehicle manufacturers are likely to let the vehicle owner see

I'm part of both this and an alternative CMax owners forum and the fitting of M+S / Snow tyres is something that comes up quite often especially in relation to the indices

thanks

Richard

Richard.

The best starting point is the Ford Manual.

LI/SI can vary engine size (and often variant too..) but the information in there will give you the best start point

Winter tyres are commonly lower speed indexes, simply due to the nature of the conditions of use and the design of the tread pattern.. but they will tend to be marked as (m&s) winters in the list

I have stuff on an excel sheet but it's no better than what's in the manual or the pressure sticker on the car

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Hi Jamie I see you've talked about the Michelin Cross Climate that I've seen advertised in a few places.

Thinking of fitting something like this but can't decide between these and the Goodyear Vector.

I appreciate you may be a bit biased to Michelin but what is the benefit of the Cross Climate over its competition?

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Hi

This may not be the way to expand on this question - if not please tell me the correct procedure!

My Mondeo mk 4 (2010) has 235/40 R 18 W 95 tyres on the front which are close to needing replaced. With winter also approaching, I was thinking of replacing them with all-season tyres but Michelin Cross Climates (as with other manufacturers) are not available in this size. On another site I found that 225/40 R 18 tyres only produce a 2% difference in road speed and so must be similar in radius to the originals. Would this be a reasonable thing to do? I have fairly new Michelin Pilot Sport 3's on the back wheels.

I have driven for 48 winters in Scotland without ever having used winter tyres but results with all-season tyres tested in Auto Express (no Michelins unfortunately) gave food for thought!

Campbell35

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Hi.

Firstly thanks for taking the time to answer our questions.

I have 205/50/R17 tyres fitted on my Focus Tdci which needs 4 new tyres. This size is harder to find here in Ireland. Would you recommend any other sizes that would fit without altering the car balance or speedo?

Thanks

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Hi Jamie I see you've talked about the Michelin Cross Climate that I've seen advertised in a few places.

Thinking of fitting something like this but can't decide between these and the Goodyear Vector.

I appreciate you may be a bit biased to Michelin but what is the benefit of the Cross Climate over its competition?

It's quite simple (having tested both extensively)

The CrossClimate is a summer tyre with winter certification, meaning it's performance in the summer, dry & wet is as good as our normal summer range, like Primacy3. And it's performance in the winter is close to that of a full winter tyre too

The Goodyear Vector is a traditional All Season, e.g. it's more of a detuned winter tyre, giving slightly worse winter performance than a full winter and it will suffer more in the summer than a summer style product. So for the UK market where we maybe get 5-10 days of bad weather the product performance of CrossClimate is way better for our market. E.g. does the same job in the summer and a cracking job in the winter. We don't call a CrossClimate an All Season tyre for that reason, as it's a summer tyre with Winter certification..

Hope that helps

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Hi

This may not be the way to expand on this question - if not please tell me the correct procedure!

My Mondeo mk 4 (2010) has 235/40 R 18 W 95 tyres on the front which are close to needing replaced. With winter also approaching, I was thinking of replacing them with all-season tyres but Michelin Cross Climates (as with other manufacturers) are not available in this size. On another site I found that 225/40 R 18 tyres only produce a 2% difference in road speed and so must be similar in radius to the originals. Would this be a reasonable thing to do? I have fairly new Michelin Pilot Sport 3's on the back wheels.

I have driven for 48 winters in Scotland without ever having used winter tyres but results with all-season tyres tested in Auto Express (no Michelins unfortunately) gave food for thought!

Campbell35

Campbell..

Thanks for your query.. A few points in response

  • I really wouldn't change the size ideally, and definately never mixed on the car. If you change them, change 4
  • We are expanding the CrossClimate range in 2016 to include 235/45-18 (current Mondeo) and a 225/40-18. So sadly at present you've less options than you will have next year
  • It may be worth looking at a second set of wheels if you are keeping the car any length of time. It's not a massive expense, especially if you buy used genuine wheels (which could run 16" or 17", cheaper tyres and more options..)

I'd thoroughly recommend a winter capable tyre, simply as the benefits on those bad weather days are huge

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Hi.

Firstly thanks for taking the time to answer our questions.

I have 205/50/R17 tyres fitted on my Focus Tdci which needs 4 new tyres. This size is harder to find here in Ireland. Would you recommend any other sizes that would fit without altering the car balance or speedo?

Thanks

Hi

I can't understand (sorry for being honest) how the tyres are difficult to find, as we supply over 40 variants in that size in the UK (and ROI) market

215/45-17 and 225/45-17 are close enough on the overall diameter to work, but you have to change 4 and be aware that you may have clearance issues as they are wider.. you'd need to check that, and ensure that the wheel size is ok.. Is it 6.5 x 17??

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Hi

I can't understand (sorry for being honest) how the tyres are difficult to find, as we supply over 40 variants in that size in the UK (and ROI) market

215/45-17 and 225/45-17 are close enough on the overall diameter to work, but you have to change 4 and be aware that you may have clearance issues as they are wider.. you'd need to check that, and ensure that the wheel size is ok.. Is it 6.5 x 17??

As far as I can tell, outside of the big cities, brand choices are limited for that particular size e.g my local Ford garage only has a set of Kumho tyres currently in that size and previously I got a set of Avon ZV5 from them. Also as a result of this, the prices tend to be more than the more common tyre sizes or they have to be specially ordered.

I'm not 100% sure of the wheel size. It might be 7x17?

Thanks

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