[RESOLVED ] 2008 Focus 1.6TDCi 90PS - ENGINE MALFUNCTION

[TehJazzi]

Hi all, newbie here will post up an intro in a minute.

I've had a quick look through previous posts regarding this issue but can't find one identical to my issue so I'll start from scratch.

Bought my 2008 (facelift model, April '08 registered) Focus 1.6TDCi 90PS model back in 2012 and its been a great car until now. Its done just over 69,500 miles and yesterday after putting £15 of BP Ultimate Diesel (usually use standard Sainsbury's diesel but felt like it could use a little clean out) in I had an Engine Malfunction message flash up on the dash. Quick stop and restart of the engine cleared it and it was fine for the rest of the day.

This morning I've had it flash up almost immediately after every start, accompanied by a complete loss of turbo and not able to go above 3500rpm, which I'm assuming is its limp home mode. I have no error codes, no warning lights, no odd noises or anything which flags up any other issues. 

My other half has plugged in an OBD reader and its throwing up no error codes. I'm almost certain its a Non DPF model, there is no DPF sensor at the back of the engine bay. We've gone through the on board diagnostics and its not throwing up any issues either. 

Can anyone give us some insight as to what the potential issue could be? We haven't had a chance to check hoses/pipes or anything yet and haven't got a way of getting it up on a ramp at the moment either. 

 

The car does around 8000 miles a year and 90% of those are city miles, I know its not the ideal choice of engine for this type of driving but it was an urgent purchase after our old car died and didn't read up too much on the potential issues.

 

Also, is there any issues in driving it in limp home mode? We won't be able to get anything sorted until the end of the month and the car is a major life line.

 

Thanks!

Giulia

[sean.kerwin]

Limp mode won't hurt the car. THats the reason it does it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TehJazzi]

42 minutes ago, sean.kerwin said:

Limp mode won't hurt the car. THats the reason it does it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks for the reply, that's a bit of a relief!

[TehJazzi]

I've just picked up a new fuel filter that I'll be fitting tonight, and looking at doing an EGR delete at the weekend. Really hoping this solves the problem! 

[Tdci-Peter]

On 05/06/2016 at 3:31 PM, TehJazzi said:

This morning I've had it flash up almost immediately after every start, accompanied by a complete loss of turbo and not able to go above 3500rpm, which I'm assuming is its limp home mode. I have no error codes, no warning lights, no odd noises or anything which flags up any other issues. 

My other half has plugged in an OBD reader and its throwing up no error codes.

There must be some diagnostic info stored in there. A basic OBD2 scanner is very limited really, it can not read much from any module except the PCM (Engine Computer), and perhaps not all codes there.

A full diagnostic system may reveal a lot more codes. You will find a lot about ELM327 & Forscan on this site, which together provide a very comprehensive diagnosis & maintenance tool.

For ELM327 see:

http://www.spanglefish.com/TunnelratElectronics/index.asp?pageid=516992

One of these will pay for itself in no time.

you ill also need a program called Forscan, its free and you can get it from

http://forscan.org/download.html

Without some DTC codes, or some really positive symptoms, no diagnosis is possible. EGR problems did not put my car into limp mode, but did light the warning light. But it is not the same car, of course.

Please keep us informed here of any changes. A lot of very knowledgeable people regularly look around this site.

Peter.

PS: How often is the oil changed? 1.6TDCI owners on this site strongly advise 5000 to 6000 mile oil changes on this engine. Lots of info to be found here.

[TehJazzi]

On 11/06/2016 at 0:57 AM, Tdci-Peter said:

There must be some diagnostic info stored in there. A basic OBD2 scanner is very limited really, it can not read much from any module except the PCM (Engine Computer), and perhaps not all codes there.

A full diagnostic system may reveal a lot more codes. You will find a lot about ELM327 & Forscan on this site, which together provide a very comprehensive diagnosis & maintenance tool.

For ELM327 see:

http://www.spanglefish.com/TunnelratElectronics/index.asp?pageid=516992

One of these will pay for itself in no time.

you ill also need a program called Forscan, its free and you can get it from

http://forscan.org/download.html

Without some DTC codes, or some really positive symptoms, no diagnosis is possible. EGR problems did not put my car into limp mode, but did light the warning light. But it is not the same car, of course.

Please keep us informed here of any changes. A lot of very knowledgeable people regularly look around this site.

Peter.

PS: How often is the oil changed? 1.6TDCI owners on this site strongly advise 5000 to 6000 mile oil changes on this engine. Lots of info to be found here.

Thanks for all the info and links, I'll for sure look into getting one of those! I've got a guy coming out to do the EGR delete and put a little remap on it tomorrow so I'll update after that. If it doesn't solve the issue then I'm not that bothered as its something I wanted to get done anyway. 

For the past 4 years the oil had been changed every year, so around 7000 miles. I'll be honest, no idea what the service history was before I got the car at 34000 miles, but as the engine is getting on a bit we're swapping to an interim service from this year so will be changed every 3500/4000 miles. 

 

I'll update when I get any more info on the issues!

[Tdci-Peter]

Thanks for the feedback.

If your guy can do a re-map, he can certainly read any DTCs. And hopefully confirm whether it has a DPF. It does sound a little like a DPF issue.

One simple point to check, how is the battery? I have recently had a case where a poor battery was allowing the power to the electronics to go out of spec. It was upsetting the PCM, & causing errors. If you have access to a voltmeter, do the following:

*** battery Test
Start engine. After recovering from starting (normally under 1 minute), voltage should rise to at least 13v at idle, and with the engine at about 1200rpm, charge voltage should stabilise at 14.0 to 14.6v. This range should be maintained with headlights on or off.

Then turn engine off, monitor battery voltage (at the terminals, direct on the lead battery post itself if possible), turn ignition & headlights on (do not start engine), see how quickly battery drops. It should drop to about 12v quite quickly, then hold, and not go below about 11.5v even after a few minutes.

If battery fades away quickly, it is duff. Also if charge voltage is too high, either it is duff, or there is a serious problem with the charging system.

Peter.

 

[TehJazzi]

6 minutes ago, Tdci-Peter said:

Thanks for the feedback.

If your guy can do a re-map, he can certainly read any DTCs. And hopefully confirm whether it has a DPF. It does sound a little like a DPF issue.

One simple point to check, how is the battery? I have recently had a case where a poor battery was allowing the power to the electronics to go out of spec. It was upsetting the PCM, & causing errors. If you have access to a voltmeter, do the following:

*** Battery Test
Start engine. After recovering from starting (normally under 1 minute), voltage should rise to at least 13v at idle, and with the engine at about 1200rpm, charge voltage should stabilise at 14.0 to 14.6v. This range should be maintained with headlights on or off.

Then turn engine off, monitor battery voltage (at the terminals, direct on the lead battery post itself if possible), turn ignition & headlights on (do not start engine), see how quickly battery drops. It should drop to about 12v quite quickly, then hold, and not go below about 11.5v even after a few minutes.

If battery fades away quickly, it is duff. Also if charge voltage is too high, either it is duff, or there is a serious problem with the charging system.

Peter.

 

My boyfriend seems to think its something to do with electrics, we sometimes have issues with the date and time resetting itself and when my phone is plugged in to charge it will sometimes randomly stop charging and then restart again. Same issue with out plug in dash camera. So it could be a battery issue like you've mentioned. I'l give that a look into if I don't manage to get anything sorted tomorrow. We had a quick look at the battery a couple of days ago and I think it looks a little corroded around the terminals, a new battery won't do any harm though as I think its still on its first. I think it flickers around the 12.5v mark on the self test when the engine is off so you may have a good point there. Will try and get hold of a voltmeter and test it!

[TehJazzi]

Had a quick look at the onboard readings, engine off its reading 12v and engine on it stabilizes at around 14.3. Still going to try with a voltmeter.... And as for the DTC the onboard computer comes back with none!

I'll get my guy to run it through a diagnostics tomorrow and see if that brings up anything. 

[jack1997]

I had this same issue, turned out it was the glow plug that had gone wrong. Please do keep us updated.

 

[TomsFocus]

As above, I had the glow plugs do the same on a 110ps model.

They didn't leave a generic OBD code, needed something specific (forscan in my case) to find the problem.

It could also be EGR or other things as you say though.

 

I've no idea about the time and date resetting but mine does it as well, only once or twice a year but cannot work out why lol!!

[TehJazzi]

Glow plugs will be my next port of call in that case! I've wanted the EGR and remap done for a while now anyway so I'm not going to be too bothered if this doesn't sort it.

The guy coming to do them has had to cancel all his Liverpool jobs today due to a fire closing part of the motorway and he's running late for his Manchester jobs, but he's coming tomorrow so will update then

[TehJazzi]

Got my remap man out at the moment, having a bit of trouble getting the ECU. He ran the car through his diagnostics which confirmed the above comments about glow plugs! I honestly cant be bothered doing that one by myself so it'll be going to my local guy to fix that one. 

 

ECU is now off and he's working on the remap and EGR delete. And it's just started thundering!

[Tdci-Peter]

Hi, Thunder rolling round here, too

Lost all power a few minute ago, computer power off while using it. Must check the disk.

Though why the Glow plugs put it into limp mode, I do not understand. They are normally only used on a cold start, at least on my 1.8 engine. Anyone know why they affect the 1.6TDCI so much?

[TehJazzi]

I've heard that they're used on cold idles on the 1.6TDCi also but don't know much about it to be honest.. You would think that a glow plug issue would flash up the glow plug warning symbol on the dash though! I do a lot of city miles and the engine doesn't get up to temperature on a lot of occasions, maybe something to do with it. 

The remap guy has been VERY helpful, he's mentioned a couple of things that are likely to be an issue with this engine to get checked out to further help it from bogging down. service every 4000 miles and new mass air flow meter sensor when the plugs get done. The known turbo issues are the main one but he said that the turbo is in great working order at the moment! 

Error is still up, but all done now and should feel like a brand new car by the end of the month!

Edited June 16, 2016 by TehJazzi

[TomsFocus]

The glow plugs are used for DPF regen and emissions reduction on modern cars, brings up limp mode so as not to fill the EGR and DPF quickly!  I know it's a non dpf model but they must use the same fault software on both.

[TehJazzi]

Yeah that makes sense! 

Should be back up to its now increased power by the end of the month, after the Stage 1 ECU remap I should be running 111bhp and 251lb-ft which is a nice increase over the original output. Should also have a smoother power delivery now and better MPG. Will update this again in a couple of weeks when the glow plugs are replaced.

[TehJazzi]

Managed to book it in with my local garage for Monday morning, a week earlier than expected! Should run like a new car by Monday afternoon 

[TehJazzi]

Well I've just picked up up from the garage after having all four glow plugs replaced and limp mode and the horrid Engine Malfunction message have disappeared! She is now back up to full power and feels fantastic after the extra little modifications too. Thought I would post up the result incase anyone else gets this problem in the future. 

Happy once more. 

[Lee16 focus]

 From what I can see it's a faulty ECU unit 200-750 at most for that then labour I bought a car a couple days of go and this happend and told can't take car back