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2011FocusTDI -DMF replace, now battery drain issues?


Sweedie
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Hello , i am a new member to the forum but have been a silent stalker of the forum topics for a while.. I have recently bought  (end of April 16 ) A used 2011 Focus, Titan-1.6- TD, it had 64k on the clock when i bought it from the dealer... Love the car but not the problems i have encountered in such a short period of time after purchase :( .. First off was the end of July i suddenly hear a loud knocking sound coming from the engine whilst sat at traffic lights almost a fast thudding/rattle when the clutch was depressed it was still there but less obvious , any way after searching the forums here , i came to the conclusion that it sounded like the DMF was the noise i was hearing (thank you to those that had answered others on a similar topic here ) So lucky for me , i was JUST within my 3 month warranty, so had the DMF and clutch replaced by Evans Halshaw, not without having to cry like a baby in the showroom first , not my usual behaviour but after being fobbed off after them having my car in their service centre for the whole day and then to be told in true (talking to a ditsy blond style) That diesel engines are supposed to sound like a bag of spanners being placed on spin cycle !!! :O That there was nothing wrong with the car, the noise was normal Hmmmm OK .. Treat me like a silly girl i will act like one, on this occasion it worked in my favour heheee and i then got a second more experienced opinion , resulting in the replacementof the clutch &  DMF... So now a few months on and i seem to be having issues with my battery dying overnight and even when  stopping for shopping after a long motorway drive from Oxford to Cardiff.. The push button start just makes a clicking sound and nothing, lights and computer all work when this happens?
I have been told that diesel cars need to be driven on longer journeys often to maintain battery charge?
Seems if it is driven and loses charge anyway overnight , surly there is a reason ? I had a 2013 model before and i could pretty much rely on it after being left parked up for a few days at a time (My ex took that with him)  i ended up with the dud! anyway i am desperate to try and get this sorted as an unreliable car is all i have at the moment and i am struggling to know what to do about it, paid 8k for it so i don't really have the money to spend on this ATM , Is it likely this might be linked to something that was potentially damaged when the flywheel was going bad, can that affect other mechanics, battery drain an hour after driving it is surly extreme? has to be something draining it so fast , my auto stop start has never worked either and the bluetooth voice command doesn't work either ... Or have i just been unlucky? Thanks and apologies for the rant ;
)
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6 hours ago, Sweedie said:

So now a few months on and i seem to be having issues with my battery dying overnight and even when  stopping for shopping after a long motorway drive from Oxford to Cardiff.. The push button start just makes a clicking sound and nothing, lights and computer all work when this happens?

If the lights do not dim when pressing the start button, then it almost has to be the starter solenoid, or the wiring from the battery to the stater motor. These can give intermittent faults.

Yes, there is a link to the clutch, the motor and its wiring would have been disconnected. It is on the bellhousing.

Follow the fat wires from battery (+ve & -ve), I bet (well 20p anyway), the earth wire is loose or dirty at the engine end.

If the wiring is ok, it is probably the solenoid on the starter motor. That part is sometimes available separately, though it is hard to track down. Usually it ends up being a full starter motor replacement.

---

You were lucky & smart to get the DMF done in the nick of time! Pity there is no video of the acting performance needed to make the garage see sense! There seems no limits to the lengths some garages will go to avoid spending money.

One word of advice on the engine: If it is the earlier (16 valve) 1.6TDCI, then 6k oil changes are usually advised. It is a weakness of it that the oil can get heavily carbonised & gum up feeds to camshaft & turbo. I think the later 8 valve version is less sensitive.

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Hi Peter, What a fantastic reply to my epic novel  hahaaa , .. So sorry for the long winded explanation with the extra drama thrown in!! Hahaa Glad you did not lose the will to live half way through! And now you mention it , i rather hope there is NOT a video of my rather brilliant but awkward (for all concerned) emotional outburst! Shame on me :laugh: Actually it was thanks to answers like this, on someone elses thread, i was a little more clued up than i would have been, :biggrin:

I do have a video of the noise it was making and the function of the lights when pressing the start button, can they be posted on here,  or are links prefered? The lights did not dim but they did flash on and off in conjunction with the silly clicking noise when trying the push start button!

I called recovery today as i could not find anyone to try and jump start it , the battery reading was 4v and took ages to to get up to an 8.? which is when it finally fired up, as soon as the engine started running the voltage went up to 16 , i think i remember that correctly? i tool it for a long drive straight away and managed to stop twice on the way home without trouble starting, i am hoping the same for the morning,.. Thank you so much for taking the time to reply Peter, so appreciated , i will take youre advice on board and check out what you have suggested, i might learn something else hahaa, My car is a 61 plate so i am not sure if it would be later version?

Oh and you might be onto something with the wire and dirt , i was really shocked how much debris was under the bonnet, thought that might have been cleaned when i bought it, i really should have checked, bit naive on my part.. Thanks again Peter,  will keep you updated of any updates, i have a feeling i haven't seen the last of the issue, i will even try to keep it less than 100 pages heheee! :rolleyes:

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5 hours ago, Sweedie said:

the battery reading was 4v and took ages to to get up to an 8.? which is when it finally fired up, as soon as the engine started running the voltage went up to 16 ,

That does sound like a dead (or very nearly so) battery. Were the readings from the battery terminals with a meter, or using the in car display? If from the car display, it could still be bad connections at the battery.

I have uploaded files up to 5MB to this site without problem. Links to "cloud" servers sometimes fail, and often break after a while.

Rather unhelpfully, the link I have seen so far just says:

" In 2011 the 16V DOHC was reduced to 8V and only SOHC and called DV-6C/DV-6D."

The 16v version was called DV6, DV6A, DV6B (sometimes with TED4 added for some reason). Google images might help if there is no ID on the car. Or someone more familiar with this engine may know.

Re. Long drives, the extra charging for a diesel is not really valid. Perhaps after a cold start, it will draw a bit more from the battery, but if the charging system is ok, and it did not struggle to start, 5 or so minutes of average driving should replenish it. What does benefit from the occasional longer, higher speed run, is the DPF. This could do with a 30-45 minute run on 60-70mph roads once a fortnight or so.

 

 

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On 21/09/2016 at 9:30 AM, Tdci-Peter said:

That does sound like a dead (or very nearly so) battery. Were the readings from the battery terminals with a meter, or using the in car display? If from the car display, it could still be bad connections at the battery.

 

Hi Peter, so sorry for the delay in my response , getting my son sorted for Uni (first year) is something i never thought would cause such STRESS  LOL .. Any way back to your previous question.. The readings were taken with a meter clipped onto the terminals, i believe the guy also mentioned the reading from the alternator being the same? Not sure i was paying to much attention , perhaps i misheard that?  just know the moment i say this , all will go pear shaped again :/ But so far so g**d 

This happened once before ,it was when i picked it up from having the DMF and clutch replaced , i assumed it was as the mechanic told me,(up on the ramp all day?) and thought no more about it after he gave it a jolt with a battery pack.. It was fine up until my last non start as mentioned above , so in all i think it lasted about a month before failing to start again ..Seem so random and with no apparant warning or reason, i am yet to check the make of the battery as i read something interesting about keyless entry in my manual that triggered some thoughts , i will take a screen shot and post , easier than typing it hahaaa

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On 20/09/2016 at 5:41 PM, Sweedie said:

battery drain an hour after driving it is surly extreme? has to be something draining it so fast , my auto stop start has never worked either

If the battery was in even just reasonable condition, and fully charged, then draining it in an hour would be a huge power draw, something would be red hot & smoking. As for the stop-start, it is notoriously unreliable, everything (battery, charging system, and lots of other bits) needs to be in tip top condition before it will even think about working.

7 hours ago, Sweedie said:

The readings were taken with a meter clipped onto the terminals,

There are two causes for flat battery readings: Dead battery, or poor charging.

Batteries rarely fail in an intermittent manner. I have not known it. They are usually either good, or bad. And once bad, they stay bad.

The charging system is more complex, it can work & not work sometimes. Poor connections, duff alternator, even faulty pcm (the engine computer or ECU) can do it.

If the battery is more than 4 years old, it would be worth replacing it anyway. They do not like being run flat, and this one is either duff, or has been heavily discharged at least once.

Then I would get a cigar lighter voltmeter, just a few quid from eBay. It will enable you to keep an eye on the charging system. It should put out well over 14v (ideally 14.4v to 14.6v) at some time, most likely a few minutes after starting. When the engine warms up, and it thinks the battery is charged enough, it will cut back the voltage to 13v to 14v.

A battery that has been standing overnight should be reading well over 12v, ideally 12.6v, though down to 12.2v is ok, especially if the car has just been unlocked, which draws some power.

My car stands for days on end, 4-5 days most weeks, and has never given any problems with battery dying.

There are lots of other causes for failure to start, starter, immobiliser, keyless system. But the 4v - 8v - 16v scenario you gave does look very much like battery or charging system problems.

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So , unfortunately Peter, I have a problem that is to raise it's ugly head again :unsure: .. Now that i have taken all you have said on board , I feel really annoyed about some of the claptrap i was fed from the Dealer service dept about the reasons my stop/start and battery were causing issue{or just not working}  ..Not driven often or long enough on Motorways at constant speed. Sounded like a fob off at the time,even more certain now .. I thank you for all the time you have taken to clue me up a bit more Peter, i only wish i had taken you with me in my pocket hahaaa!  Although i am not sure you would have been to impressed with my last resort theatrics at the time :laugh:

One more thing , i read in my ford manual that the keyless entry and stop/start models have very specific battery requirments and if ever the battery is replaced, it MUST be replaced with a battery of the exact spec of the original.? This is what started me wondering if the battery has in fact been replaced before i purchased the car and it is not compatible to keep everything it should running smoothly, mainly the computer side of things, this could also account for my blue tooth voice command not understanding a word i say (welsh accent not that strong ..Honest) :rolleyes:

Big Thanks for your time , you have been so helpful! I think perhaps i will go with your suggestion of buying a battery voltmeter and replacing the battery itself, I think the engine is in dire need of cleaning too eeeek

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3 hours ago, Sweedie said:

if ever the battery is replaced, it MUST be replaced with a battery of the exact spec of the original.?

The important term is EFB (Enhanced Flooded battery, if that matters).

(Unfortunately, you may go eeek again at the price! It is no wonder some people put cheaper ones in).

Something like:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ford-Focus-MK3-2011-2016-MK3-Bosch-BOSCH-S4-EFB-BATTERY-UK-REF-110-/381764701010?fits=Car+Make%3AFord|Model%3AFocus|Cars+Year%3A2011|Plat_Gen%3AMK+III|Cars+Type%3A1.6+TDCi&hash=item58e2f30b52:g:MxQAAOSwY0lXQww4

Bosch are one of the best, there may be cheaper makes, but check the EFB term is there.

I am assuming it is a Mk3 Focus, 2011 could have been a late Mk2a Focus.

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