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A series of worsening events


MarcHilton
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Hi guys,

I posted on here a few months back about my problems with my Focus 1.6 tdci estate (110hp). I was having intermittent drops of turbo boost which would occur randomly and usually reset with turning the ignition off then back on again. Well still not fathomed that one yet, but I have since had to change my injector seals due to one particularly bad one on no.3. So a few weeks ago I did it all, and blanked up my egr valve. Had a bad leak from the HP lines so had to nip them all up. It drove fine for a few weeks but seemed down on power and still the same lack of turbo boost almost all the time.

Then it threw up a few faults. Egr blocked/high + low circuit codes. Turbo boost low. So I removed the blanking plate from the egr and had the fault codes removed. Got some turbo boost back again with the same issue as before. After a week or so I noticed the familiar smell of exhaust and that little "chirping" sound from the engine bay; the injector seals again! This time on no.1 and no.3. So off it all came again. As it was off the car I cleaned out the egr valve and it was still freely moving. This time I tried as hard as possible to clean the seats and have put it all back together. The plot now thickens.

When I tried to start the car it just turned and turned and turned. Not even an attempt to cough into life. The last 2 times I've had the injectors or HP lines off it has always turned, splattered then eventually self-bled and started. Nothing. Tried bleeding the fuel through the filter with a hand pump. Still nothing. Tried a new egr valve as I heard a stuck valve can prevent proper starting. Nothing. Brilliant.

I'm absolutely stumped. It seems to be a fuelling issue, but I can hear the fuel going through the pipes at the back of the bay when I used the hand pump. I'm totally wracking my brains but I'm not very in the know with common rail diesels tbh. 

Can anybody help me out?

And well done for reading this far :-D

Marc

 

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Greetings Marc!

Sorry you're experiencing problems in the 1.6 tdci department. As you may have discovered these engines need plenty of care (and oil changes) to get the best out of them! As regards your boost problems could either be turbo, variable vane or boost pressure solenoid problems. These turbos are prone to failure and sticking vanes due to inadequate or dirty oil feed and, sadly, ultimate failure due the excessive carbonisation of the engine oil. Blanking the egr certainly helps to reduce the gunge that contaminates the variable blade pivots but can throw error codes as you've discovered.

The copper injector seals are prone to failure due to the inadequate injector retaining studs which require regular attention to check that the "nuts" are nipped up (not too tight or the studs shear) to ensure the copper injector washers are maintained in intimate contact with the injector shoulder and aluminium head seat. I stuck some star shake proof washers under the hex drive nuts to reduce their constant loosening. If they've been leaking a while the seats will need re cutting to remove the grooves that compression gases will have effectively channelled in the head seat or they'll leak again soon. You can usually spot the failed copper seals by the black gunge around the injector body and it's reluctance to come out! Ford claim the hp lines are single use because of the compressibility of the swaged  ends but I've had mine on and off several times without any leaks and saved a few quid. 

I would think your latest non starting issue is probably air in the fuel system especially if you've had the diesel filter off. They can be a real problem to prime and start. Ensure you bleed on the exit side of the filter and fill the inlet pipe to the injection pump to overflowing with something like a hypodermic syringe before reconnecting to the fuel filter outlet. Cleanliness is paramount! Injection pumps and injectors aren't cheap!

Despite bad press these engines are highly efficient with an impressive power curve but need plenty of tlc especially in the lubrication and dreaded dpf departments to achieve high engine mileages. Just been to Gibraltar and back in mine and averaged over 58 mpg. Not bad for a 17 year old banger and didn't use a drop of oil! Thankfully it doesn't have a dpf and no problems with the blanked egr either.

Good luck. Hope you get it sorted.

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Thanks Focusoap,

I actually forgot to mention I have changed the turbo boost solenoid valve as this was suggested to me previously. It has always been well serviced and I've even had the sump off when I bought it to check for any sludge and the condition of the pick-up pipe. All was well. The inlet tract has always been very oily, but I know diesels usually exhibit this behaviour. It is a high ish miler (now on 150,000+) but it's always been so reliable and never uses oil or coolant. Used to average 64mpg doing longer motorway journeys. It's all gone downhill lately. Seems it all happens at once. I bought some seat cutters and the 17 x 17mm one for the Bosch injectors was too big. ***** manufacturing tolerances! So I had to make my own out of 15 mm wooden dowel with some 320 grit wet & dry paper glued to it. Seems to have worked ok. As I said I've done this job before and never had this issue. I will try bleeding it again and see if it helps. Absolute nightmare.

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The 17x17 cutter should fit ok that's the size I've used a few times. Is the retaining allen grub screw fully in? The injector bore may be carboned up preventing the reamer getting down. If the gunge has been there a while it's like coke to remove! 

Are you checking the error codes with a specific reader like Forscan which may give some more clues as opposed to a more general obd2 reader? Sounds like you've done all the right things on the engine lube side. Is the turbo impeller spinning ok and no major play allowing the blades to foul on the casing? Next thing to have a look at is to check the variable blades in the turbo are free and the linkage moving to the vacuum actuator works. (Check the vacuum pipes as well as the large bore pipes to the inter cooler). Forscan live data can help to see what's happening with the manifold boost pressure when you get it running again and offer some clues. Don't know much about DPFs which yours will have (I think) but have read that blocked ones cause lots of problems too. If the EGR was full of carbonated gunge chances are the inlet manifold and variable turbo impellers are bunged up as well and the only solution is a good clean out. Last time I had mine apart the inlet manifold bores were about half what they should be with black tar -mucky job! Good luck just what you need for Easter weekend!

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Yeah I can't believe my luck! I have the euro 5 dpf which doesn't use any of that eoyls fluid. The turbo single is free spinning with about the right amount of end float and radial movement. Not sure about the variable vanes though. I did indeed have an inlet manifold completely filled with that horrid, thick black tar. It took my 2 trips to my local engine builder's big parts washer and a few hours of scooping, brushing and scraping the gunk out. I've tried bleeding the filter again and am charging my battery to give it another go. I noticed the camshaft sensor plug wasn't 100% fitted correctly as some of the blue weather proofing bellows were bunched up on one side. Not sure if it was enough to cause a bad connection but that could have caused a non start. I am using a bluetooth OBD2 plug with the Torque app. It's not really providing much useful data while the engine isn't running though. I admit I am not very experienced in using it so maybe I could experiment with what data I look at. I've gone back over all the plugs and hoses etc which were removed during the job and it all seems ok. Fingers crossed it might have been that plug.

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Oh and the seat cutters I bought are definitely too big, it gets caught on the lower lip about 12mm from the seat face even in the clean guide sleeves. I guess maybe I should have paid a bit more for them?

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Well I've been out and tried it again still no joy. I used the Torque app and looked at fuel rail Px. Nothing while cranking over the motor. It seems there's no fuel or an air lock between filter and HP pump. Anybody know how to more effectively bleed this as I've done the filter outlet bleed a few times now with no result?

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Try cracking the union nuts on top of the injectors after you have filled the inlet pipe to the injection pump and reconnected to the filter outlet although the injectors should be self bleeding. Give it a few turns on the starter and see if your getting anything at the injector union  nuts. How old is the fuel filter? The starter motor isn't man enough for continuous cranking so do it in short bursts to avoid overheating.

You really need a specific code reader like Forscan which is Ford orientated and the ability to log live data once you've got it running again to help point you in thr right direction. If it was running before you stripped it down them it's more than likely to be a  fuel bleeding issue stopping you getting it running now. They can be a real pain. 

If your inlet manifold was gunged up then the chances are the turbo variable vanes could be sticky as well. It's not too bad to strip down and there are plenty of guides on line to help. 

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A few years back my 05 Mondeo had a issue, it was like I was pressing and releasing the accelerator.

 

It turned out to be a crack in the turbo pipe.

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Hmm, it's a bit dangerous to crack the hp unions on a common rail diesel. The delivery Psi is very high and a jet could cause serious injury or damage. I have tried the bleeding again with the hand pump "inline" so I could see fuel was being drawn down to the hp pump while it was cranking. The Torque app is equivalent to Forscan, and I've used it for real-time data. It was showing no pressure in the fuel rail while cranking over, however there was fuel flow registered. It showed a weird dtc of U1900 "network" which I've searched for online and can find no reference to. It's all very frustrating and I think it will get towed down to my local Ford garage on Tuesday. I think I've done as much as I can, unless anybody else has any further ideas?

 

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Davejavu

Was this a crack in the solid pipe from the intercooler to the throttle body?

 

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So still no progress on this problem.

I've talked to my local Ford dealership and they've suggested taking it to a local diesel electrician in Glastonbury as they use him when they get a car with an unusual fault. I've tried bleeding the injectors the old fashioned way by cracking the hp line unions at each injector. They let some diesel out but nothing under any pressure. My Torque app is saying there's no common rail fuel pressure, so I'm suspecting something on the pump. I've read a bit about the Bosch pump and there seems to be a flow regulator valve and an hp pump deactivation switch on them. Haynes says these are not interchangeable, however the fuel regulator valves are available separately. 

Has anyone got any experience of these Bosch pumps?

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I can't recall ATM, I'll have a look though the receipts I kept to see if it says anything.

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If it was running ok before you dismantled bits of the fuel/injector system (apart from your original spasmodic boost problem) then,short of some rubbish getting into the hp pump, it's unlikely that a new problem with the pump has come into the equation. If there's irregularly "spurting" from the injector union when you cracked it then it still may indicate entrapped air. If you getting zero common rail pressure and it was ok before I'd revisit the fuel bleeding again (there's plenty of fuel in the tank and it runs without entrapped air when you manually prime the filter).

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Had exactly this issue earlier this year after changing injector seals.Camshaft sensor got slightly knocked in the process, stopping the car from starting whatsoever. Replacing that got it living again.

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1 hour ago, synaesthesia said:

Had exactly this issue earlier this year after changing injector seals.Camshaft sensor got slightly knocked in the process, stopping the car from starting whatsoever. Replacing that got it living again.

Hmmm, interesting. That little plug is one of the hardest ones to get off when moving the fuel lines and injector loom out of the way of the EGR valve assembly coming out. I was thinking it might be a sensor somewhere as there is just no sign of life from the engine at all. It's going to a local guy hopefully tomorrow as I've tried all I can. Thanks for the input.

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2 hours ago, Focusoap said:

If it was running ok before you dismantled bits of the fuel/injector system (apart from your original spasmodic boost problem) then,short of some rubbish getting into the hp pump, it's unlikely that a new problem with the pump has come into the equation. If there's irregularly "spurting" from the injector union when you cracked it then it still may indicate entrapped air. If you getting zero common rail pressure and it was ok before I'd revisit the fuel bleeding again (there's plenty of fuel in the tank and it runs without entrapped air when you manually prime the filter).

Yeah there's plenty of juice in the tank and I've been out trying to bleed the injectors again tonight before the rain arrived. Changed the fuel filter as I had one ready and the hand pump did draw the fuel through it much more easily than the older one ( had done about 20k). Still not a whiff of it starting and still the lazy ooze of diesel from the unions, no pressure at all. I spoke to a local guy and he advised trying the bleeding again and if I drew a blank take it to him. Looks like it's going tomorrow.

I'll keep everyone posted if it gets sorted. Thanks for the suggestions. Keep them coming!

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On 2017-4-20 at 6:25 PM, Focusoap said:

So a quick update and resolution to my problem. Turns out one of the HP fuel lines from the fuel rail had a leak which was not noticeable from above very easily. The guy I took it to spent 3 hours testing other things and was as stumped as I was. He then went off to do another job, came back to mine and decided to look underneath and took the undertray off to find a puddle of diesel in it! Nipped it up, and it then splattered back to life. Feel like a ***** for not finding it myself, but at least it's sorted. Still have the lack of boost issue but at least I can drive it again now.

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