Focus 1.6ltr poor mpg

[mcouchard]

Thanks all for you advice, but I think it is due to binding brakes I jacked it up today and there is alot of friction when turning the wheel the inside pads and worn right through and the caliper piston appears to be sticking. So that would explain the fuel consumption issues it has its MOT tomorow and so will undoutably fail the nearside lower torsion arm bush is shredded as well. oit will fail in style.

I let you know how much the consumption improves by when the brakes are sorted.

Matthew

[artscot79]

Just a quick update on the last tank of fuel the Focus returned only 26mpg which is now well off the urban figures and even taking into account the cold weather I think this is still pretty poor. I tried removing the spark plugs and they won't budge at all. Which is also concerning so I have left them for now as I don't want to damage the Aluminium head.

I have swapped cars with the wife so I now have the Focus to give it some long motorway runs. There is a part at the end on my journey that just is pottering around the uni campus mostly down hill so I usually dip the clutch in gear and freewheel I have noticed that the Focus unlike my Megane doesn't speed it it feels like it is going to then slows slighty. Could this be the brakes binding? it would certainly explain the poor economy.

Also should I be worried about not being able to lossen the spark plugs? I was using all the force I could muster but it was just a Halfords spark plug tool with very little leverage.

Thanks

to check the brakes jack the car up and the wheel should spin freely if not the brakes are binding you may have water ingress through the washer jets which has corroded the spark plugs in those halford tools are useless a decent socket for it and a ratchet is best also free wheeling damages the engine and doesnt save fuel sounds like the pistons need to be cleaned and greased with coipper grease and worked back and forth to free them up the excessive heat would have warped the disks so ide change these and the pads and check that the heat hasnt effected the wheel bearing

[catch]

Thanks all for you advice, but I think it is due to binding brakes I jacked it up today and there is alot of friction when turning the wheel the inside pads and worn right through and the caliper piston appears to be sticking. So that would explain the fuel consumption issues it has its MOT tomorow and so will undoutably fail the nearside lower torsion arm bush is shredded as well. oit will fail in style.

I let you know how much the consumption improves by when the brakes are sorted.

Matthew

If it's going to fail it's MOT why waste the £50 having it done. I had front disks and pads fitted by an indy on a T reg 1.8 Zetec back in Dec 08 for £100 [in the hand]

[stef123]

to check the brakes jack the car up and the wheel should spin freely if not the brakes are binding you may have water ingress through the washer jets which has corroded the spark plugs in those halford tools are useless a decent socket for it and a ratchet is best also free wheeling damages the engine and doesnt save fuel sounds like the pistons need to be cleaned and greased with coipper grease and worked back and forth to free them up the excessive heat would have warped the disks so ide change these and the pads and check that the heat hasnt effected the wheel bearing

copper grease on a caliper piston? eek! that will scratch the bore to f$ck and it will damage the seals.

when rebuilding calipers, you use brake fluid to lubricate the piston back into the caliper? surely you would do the same to free it up?...

[artscot79]

copper grease on a caliper piston? eek! that will scratch the bore to f$ck and it will damage the seals.

when rebuilding calipers, you use brake fluid to lubricate the piston back into the caliper? surely you would do the same to free it up?...

behind the rubber seal of the piston it should be copper grease in there i didnt describe it well not the actuakl pistio n i push the piston out qa good inch or so and gently lift the rubber seal up then using a syringe pump some copper grease inside refit the seal compress the piston back then out again then back clean up any residue it doesnt damage the seals half youre brakes are lubricated with copper grease

[stef123]

behind the rubber seal of the piston it should be copper grease in there i didnt describe it well not the actuakl pistio n i push the piston out qa good inch or so and gently lift the rubber seal up then using a syringe pump some copper grease inside refit the seal compress the piston back then out again then back clean up any residue it doesnt damage the seals half youre brakes are lubricated with copper grease

copper grease is acidic though? so over time its gonna damage the seals, if not cause of that then it will dry them out and damage that way. also copper grease isnt a lubricant..its an anti seize compound.

i have yet to see any part of a caliper with copper grease in it, only place ive seen it is on the back of pads and even that isnt recommended these days. for 2 reasons, it doesnt burn off and it damages seals. if any grease should be behind the seals it should be red brake grease?

from car bibles...

Copper grease and rubber

Whilst copper grease such as Copaslip works well in the short term to solve brake squeal, long-term, it has an adverse affect on the rubber dust seals of the caliper pistons. This can lead to the seal deteriorating or failing completely. If that happens, it leaves the piston and it's surface exposed to the very elements from which it should be protected. Just so you know.

i know if i bought a car and found copper grease inside the caliper seals i would be ditching them for new ones.

[artscot79]

copper grease is acidic though? so over time its gonna damage the seals. also copper grease isnt a lubricant..its an anti seize compound.

i have yet to see any part of a caliper with copper grease in it, only place ive seen it is on the back of pads and even that isnt recommended these days. for 2 reasons, it doesnt burn off and it damages seals. if any grease should be behind the seals it should be red brake grease?

sorry i agree with you im confusing myself here yes red brake grease on seals yep it does corrode and isnt advised but almost every garage doing brakes will use it either on the back of the pads gudgeon pins and slides though its not recommended the syringe was brake fluid in it i used not grease ( like to see me squeeze that out of a syringe ) should have advised to use a syringe with brake fluid to lube the piston before compressing it back in just as well you corrected me there having one of those days. all ill say is ive being doing a custom intake on friends car today and he hasnt stopped asking !Removed! queations and talking drivvle in my ear since 11am till i got rid of him 15 mins ago my heads buzzing

[mcouchard]

If it's going to fail it's MOT why waste the £50 having it done. I had front disks and pads fitted by an indy on a T reg 1.8 Zetec back in Dec 08 for £100 [in the hand]

Its a free restest within 14 days, regardless of whether you take it away or not.

[mcouchard]

to check the brakes jack the car up and the wheel should spin freely if not the brakes are binding you may have water ingress through the washer jets which has corroded the spark plugs in those halford tools are useless a decent socket for it and a ratchet is best also free wheeling damages the engine and doesnt save fuel sounds like the pistons need to be cleaned and greased with coipper grease and worked back and forth to free them up the excessive heat would have warped the disks so ide change these and the pads and check that the heat hasnt effected the wheel bearing

Thanks artscot yeah I had jacked it up already and the wheels would stop about a quater turn after I stopped pushing them. The brakes have been squelling for a while but I just assumed it was brake squel because someone hadn't put copper grease (regardless of whether that is advisable or not, Im avoiding that debate ;)) when actually its metal on metal as the inside pad has gone completely. I rang a local Ford delership and they seemed resonable £80 for pads and cleaning the calipers or £164.50 for the pads, discs and cleaning up the calipers. If is that easy to free the calipers up though I may do it myself, I have done brakes in the past but ford pads are a bugger to put on due to that ridiculous spring clip.

Would the wheel bearing be affected and is it a simple rock test of the wheel also will the MOT pick up on the bearing?

Thanks, Matthew

[catch]

Its a free restest within 14 days, regardless of whether you take it away or not.

Well it just shows you how long it is since I had a car that fail an MOT :D Mind you my mechanic also does MOT tests for the garage next door.........but he never told me that...you live and learn.......good idea though.

[catch]

Would the wheel bearing be affected and is it a simple rock test of the wheel also will the MOT pick up on the bearing?

Thanks, Matthew

You can drive on a bearing on the way out, but the noise over time [dependent on how many miles you do] gets progressively worse, until its a pain driving the car. Mind you if its on the way out, and your going to do the disks and pads, and money is not a problem, get it done at the same time.

PS: funny thing, our car had not been driven since Friday, and its parked on a slopping drive. This morning on releasing the hand brake the car remained motionless, until the clutch was lifted. First time it's done that since we bought it 4 months ago. All this crappy weather we have been having I suppose.

[mcouchard]

Well it just shows you how long it is since I had a car that fail an MOT :D Mind you my mechanic also does MOT tests for the garage next door.........but he never told me that...you live and learn.......good idea though.

Well it passed I was extremely surprised so now I'm not sure on my diagnosis on the brakes binding, unless I freed it up on the way there, it was fast country roads on the way there. do they check to see if the brakes are binding as part on the MOT?

I think it is a concession the garage offers usually its only 10 days and dependant on what it fails on.

[stef123]

Well it passed I was extremely surprised so now I'm not sure on my diagnosis on the brakes binding, unless I freed it up on the way there, it was fast country roads on the way there. do they check to see if the brakes are binding as part on the MOT?

I think it is a concession the garage offers usually its only 10 days and dependant on what it fails on.

first of all, from your other post - the bearings are checked so if one had play or was rough then it would fail.

the brakes are inspected then they are checked on brake machine which gives very accurate readings of their efficiency. if one of your pads was down to metal they would have spotted it. and yes the machine also tests for bind

from the certificate i have here, the brakes are tested for (on the machine)

wheel drag

brake force

imbalance

hand brake

rate of increase

rate of decrease

[mcouchard]

first of all, from your other post - the bearings are checked so if one had play or was rough then it would fail.

the brakes are inspected then they are checked on brake machine which gives very accurate readings of their efficiency. if one of your pads was down to metal they would have spotted it. and yes the machine also tests for bind

from the certificate i have here, the brakes are tested for (on the machine)

wheel drag

brake force

imbalance

hand brake

rate of increase

rate of decrease

So back to square one on the very poor fuel consumption then? I will have another look at the brakes later but the pad on the inside must be low as I could see a good 10mm of the piston.

[stef123]

So back to square one on the very poor fuel consumption then? I will have another look at the brakes later but the pad on the inside must be low as I could see a good 10mm of the piston.

i would still be having a look at the pads, probably even change them just to be on the safe side. £20? if that for a set. will be some piece of mind if nothing else and one less thing for next years mot.

[catch]

Well on having the car for a tad over five months now, I've undertaken some varied driving environments.

I'm finding its returning about about 28/29mpg in heavy traffic in town, on short one mile journeys.

Ballpark 43mpg on free flowing A roads, passing through the odd urban area, but not subject to heavy queuing traffic. Driving on or near the prevailing speed limits in force on the route.

And on a short motorway journey, again free flowing at a cruising speed of between 70/75mph I obtained 37.50mpg.

Now we don't do a lot of miles, as the wife likes to walk to work, only driving if she is running late or its raining, and I work from home. Holiday driving [mostly motorway ] will account for about 40% of our total annual mileage. So on doing the maths at the last time I "brimmed" the tank, prior to any motorway driving. So on 1,270 miles covered over 140 days, predominately urban town driving we are averaging 31mpg.

Obviously the driving mix will have a baring on overall annual mpg. OK in a real world environment they don't match the "official" consumption figures. But I suppose they are not to bad all considered, and in comparison to what we were getting out of our 2.0 turbo as state below. Mind you I used to hammer it a lot more than I do the 1.6 petrol.

Volvo S40 2.0 Turbo Diesel [engine shared by the Ford range] was giving us Urban 35mpg, Touring 44mpg, and overall average 39mpg

[thesilverfox]

Seems rather low :( I've got the manky old 1.8 TDCi and I rarely see below 50 mpg with town and motorway mix (65% motorway). 65 mpg is easily had at 60 mph for a few hundred miles.

[mcouchard]

Well on having the car for a tad over five months now, I've undertaken some varied driving environments.

I'm finding its returning about about 28/29mpg in heavy traffic in town, on short one mile journeys.

Ballpark 43mpg on free flowing A roads, passing through the odd urban area, but not subject to heavy queuing traffic. Driving on or near the prevailing speed limits in force on the route.

And on a short motorway journey, again free flowing at a cruising speed of between 70/75mph I obtained 37.50mpg.

Now we don't do a lot of miles, as the wife likes to walk to work, only driving if she is running late or its raining, and I work from home. Holiday driving [mostly motorway ] will account for about 40% of our total annual mileage. So on doing the maths at the last time I "brimmed" the tank, prior to any motorway driving. So on 1,270 miles covered over 140 days, predominately urban town driving we are averaging 31mpg.

Obviously the driving mix will have a baring on overall annual mpg. OK in a real world environment they don't match the "official" consumption figures. But I suppose they are not to bad all considered, and in comparison to what we were getting out of our 2.0 turbo as state below. Mind you I used to hammer it a lot more than I do the 1.6 petrol.

Volvo S40 2.0 Turbo Diesel [engine shared by the Ford range] was giving us Urban 35mpg, Touring 44mpg, and overall average 39mpg

Is this the Diesel or petrol. On my petrol 1.6 the last tank managed 36mpg finally but 75% of that was long (over a hour)motorway and A road journeys. The previous three tanks returned 33mpg ( a mixture of motorway and town)

I have yet to refill since I have replaced the brake discs and pads but so far the fuel gauge is indicating levels to suggest 33mpg, still this is better than the 26mpg my wife was getting before Christmas.

[hawker]

I have a 2006 1.6 TDCi and I'm quite disappointed with its MPG.

I'm getting around 45 mpg with extremely conservative driving, and I would say 80% of this is fast road/dual carriageway conditions. The trip computer consistently states 5 mpg over (ie. around 49 mpg)

Its only recently had a service and has been serviced regularly throughout its life. I've heard such good remarks about how frugal the 1.6 diesel is, I was expecting low 50's.

I can hear a slight pinking on acceleration which I believe could be EGR and/or injector related so perhaps this is affecting the consumption.

[catch]

Seems rather low :( I've got the manky old 1.8 TDCi and I rarely see below 50 mpg with town and motorway mix (65% motorway). 65 mpg is easily had at 60 mph for a few hundred miles.

Yours will be the non DPF version won't it?

The mk2.5 TDCi looks the best option mpg wise. Anybody own one? I'd be interested to know if it has the renewable DPF, or the newer type that does not need either the DPF replacing, or additive renewals. As even with our low mileage, along with the RT duty saving, on our mileage we would save £439 per annum even if we only averaged 50.5mpg return.

[thesilverfox]

Yours will be the non DPF version won't it?

The mk2.5 TDCi looks the best option mpg wise. Anybody own one? I'd be interested to know if it has the renewable DPF, or the newer type that does not need either the DPF replacing, or additive renewals. As even with our low mileage, along with the RT duty saving, on our mileage we would save £439 per annum even if we only averaged 50.5mpg return.

Correct - Stage IV no DPF on mine. However, while I am returning close/better than book quoted miles, your 1.6 TDCi should return even better in most circumstances - 58.9 combined (1.8 TDCi is 54.3 combined).

[hawker]

Could a dirty MAF have something to do with poor mpg in a 1.6 TDCi?

If so, where is this exactly (i assume its attached to the air box somewhere) and is it difficult and advisable to clean with some carb cleaner, or should a new one be bought?

[artscot79]

Could a dirty MAF have something to do with poor mpg in a 1.6 TDCi?

If so, where is this exactly (i assume its attached to the air box somewhere) and is it difficult and advisable to clean with some carb cleaner, or should a new one be bought?

it could but i wouldnt think its anything to do withthe maf simple things like air filter spark plugs etc are best to check first

[catch]

Is this the Diesel or petrol. On my petrol 1.6 the last tank managed 36mpg finally but 75% of that was long (over a hour)motorway and A road journeys. The previous three tanks returned 33mpg ( a mixture of motorway and town)

I have yet to refill since I have replaced the brake discs and pads but so far the fuel gauge is indicating levels to suggest 33mpg, still this is better than the 26mpg my wife was getting before Christmas.

petrol mate

[thesilverfox]

petrol mate

I misread - apologies.

Ford book the standard 1.6 at 51.4 combined and the 1.6 Ti-VCT at 52.3 combined. Still a way out from what you are getting though; this talk of diesels made me think you had an oil burner.