Engine Malfunction

[SenorC77]

Morning All, 

 

I was driving to university this morning when an engine management message came up saying Engine Malfunction 

There was a loss of power in high gears going up hill, I could watch my speed falling despite my foot being on the floor.

There doesn't sound like any change in the running noise of the engine and there is no smoke from the exhaust although I did notice it was making a high pitched whining/spinning noise for a moment after the engine was turned off.

Plan is to take it to the garage when I get back from classes this afternoon and have them hook it up to see whats going on.

In the meantime though any thoughts on what this could be?  I'm a bit worried the whining noise could be the turbo?

[DJ_Andy_M]

You have a MK2 1.6TDCi. These engines need to be cared for like small children and oil needs to be changed every 6000 miles which is half the service interval.

I suspect it's going to be DPF related. It could be the DPF eloys fluid is out and therefore your DPF is blocked so much it cannot regenerate. The other thing I'd be checking for is leaky injector seals, and possible turbo failure.

I had a car from exactly the same year, and exactly the same engine. I had issues with my DPF becoming blocked, which then later on when I had my engine decarbonised resulted in my injector seals going and the engine running away with its self because I'm guessing the process removed any carbon blocking a leak.

[madmole]

Noisy turbo spinning down from lack of oil, spect you've lost boost pressure

[isetta]

when the engine light comes on it it usually goes into limp home mode which is limited power and lower max rpm (my fiesta 1.6tdci could not go above 3000rpm in limp home mode even with full throttle in neutral). sometimes it resets itself next time you start the engine.  depends on what the detected fault was and if it still detects it next time you start the engine.

you need to get a code reader on the OBD socket to see what the error code (s) is/are and then should tell you what the engine thinks it has a problem with .

Code readers are cheap on eBay etc.  many people on this forum reccommend the Tunnel rat code readers:

http://www.spanglefish.com/tunnelratelectronics/

I have one (the USB type with the switch on)

if your injectors are leaking you normally get a chuffing noise under the bonnet &/or the smell of burning diesel fuel as it cooks on the top of the engine as it seeps out round the base of the injectors (I had this on my fiesta 1.6tdci but that never caused any warning lights/codes)

[Albert27]

8 hours ago, SenorC77 said:

Morning All, 

 

I was driving to university this morning when an engine management message came up saying Engine Malfunction 

There was a loss of power in high gears going up hill, I could watch my speed falling despite my foot being on the floor.

There doesn't sound like any change in the running noise of the engine and there is no smoke from the exhaust although I did notice it was making a high pitched whining/spinning noise for a moment after the engine was turned off.

Plan is to take it to the garage when I get back from classes this afternoon and have them hook it up to see whats going on.

In the meantime though any thoughts on what this could be?  I'm a bit worried the whining noise could be the turbo?

I have the same car as you and I had this happen about 6 months ago.  Was driving and got a sound followed by ! Engine Malfunction ! and then the car went into limp mode (reduced power, it does this automatically to protect itself from further damage).  Pulled up and restarted and it went back to normal.  It happened once more about 5 mins later. Again I parked up and restarted.  Back to normal and has never come back again.  I had forscan on mine since and it wasn't showing any fault codes.  It could just be a glitch. However if it's staying on and there's a clear whining noise then it may be more serious.  

Re the DPF ; just be aware you may not have one on yours, mine doesn't thankfully.  And my car makes a high pitched noise after switching off, not sure what it is......but it's normal on mine.

[v530anh]

It can be quite scary the first time you experience limp mode, best to put warning lights on if on a road.

[SenorC77]

Thanks for all the replies guys, much appreciated  

So it could be a number of things then so tomorrow I'll get out and check the oil and may well do an oil change if it needs topping up.  I've only had the car a month and was told it had been serviced in January but better to be on the safe side I guess and this way I'll know it has decent oil in it.

I've also ordered an Elm327 which should be here for Thursday so that may shed some more light on whats occurring.

In terms of the fault it unfortunately hasn't gone away and was there when I got back in the car to come home again.

There's no chuffing noise, burning smell or smoke which I'll take as a plus.

[DJ_Andy_M]

21 hours ago, Albert27 said:

Re the DPF ; just be aware you may not have one on yours, mine doesn't thankfully.  And my car makes a high pitched noise after switching off, not sure what it is......but it's normal on mine.

All facelift 1.6tdci's had a DPF, and i'm pretty sure most if not all of the pre-facelift 1.6tdci engines did too as the engine complies with Euro 4 emissions rules.

[SenorC77]

Am I right in thinking that Magnatec 5w30 Fully Synthetic A5 is the best oil to go for?

http://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/c/Ford_Focus_1.6_2008/p/car-accessories/engine-oils-and-car-fluids/engineoils/5w30-engine-oil/?521773421&&cc5_247

 

Also if I'm changing the oil it makes sense to do the filter at the same time so this Bosch one would be ok?

http://www.eurocarparts.com/oil-filter

[Albert27]

2 hours ago, DJ_Andy_M said:

All facelift 1.6tdci's had a DPF, and i'm pretty sure most if not all of the pre-facelift 1.6tdci engines did too as the engine complies with Euro 4 emissions rules.

Mine is the facelift (mk 2.5 1.6 TDCI) and it definitely doesn't have a dpf. I rang 3 ford dealers to confirm this when I needed to check re oil change. If I'm wrong I'd have killed my car by now as I've been putting Triple QX in for 12 months  

Edited July 5, 2017 by Albert27

[Albert27]

1 hour ago, SenorC77 said:

Am I right in thinking that Magnatec 5w30 Fully Synthetic A5 is the best oil to go for?

http://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/c/Ford_Focus_1.6_2008/p/car-accessories/engine-oils-and-car-fluids/engineoils/5w30-engine-oil/?521773421&&cc5_247

 

Also if I'm changing the oil it makes sense to do the filter at the same time so this Bosch one would be ok?

http://www.eurocarparts.com/oil-filter

If you intend to change the oil you should find out whether you have a DPF filter or not. Ring more than once dealer.  If you do have a DPF ( diesel particulate filter) you need the more expensive low SAPS (Sulphated Ash, Phosphorous,sulphur) oil.  If you don;t have a DPF, like in my case, I use this; cheapish and cheerful:

 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Triple-QX-SynPlus-SAE-5W30-Fully-Synthetic-Car-Engine-Oil-5L-Ford-Spec-5-Litre-/291985598083?epid=1491155177&hash=item43fbb2a683:g:rdoAAOSwmfhX7XOI

And yes change the filter as well  And just a tip if you're doing it yourself the bracket directly above the oil filter needs to be out the way to get the new filter on. It just won't go on flush without doing that and causes a right headache if you don't know  Oil filter socket is 27mm and sump plug is 21mm.

[SenorC77]

My Elm327 USB with switch was delivered yesterday.  I plugged it into the OBD port, turned ignition on without starting engine,but nothing was showing on Forscan (version 2.3.9 beta for windows).

 

Have I got the correct software or am I just doing something wrong?

[v530anh]

For my car the driver did not work, so I downloaded a different driver, then it worked.

[SenorC77]

I think I've found what I need, ts amazing what happens when you read things properly 

http://www.spanglefish.com/tunnelratelectronics/index.asp?pageid=520030

Which then leads me to here:

http://www.totalcardiagnostics.com/support/Knowledgebase/Article/View/1/0/how-to-install-elm327-usb-cable-on-windows-and-obd2-software

That will be my job when I get back from work.

[SenorC77]

So I managed to get the Elm sorted and now know what my fault codes are.

 

P2458 21: DPF Regeneration Duration

P242F E1 DPF Ash Accumalation

P2409 60 Fuel Cap Sensor/Switch Circuit Range or Performance

U1900 20 Missing Message for Engine Speed

 

On the plus side I guess this means I have a DPF which is handy as none of the main dealers I contacted have been able to tell me or return my call...

On the not so plus side it sounds horribly expensive 

[DJ_Andy_M]

On 7/7/2017 at 5:42 PM, SenorC77 said:

So I managed to get the Elm sorted and now know what my fault codes are.

 

P2458 21: DPF Regeneration Duration

P242F E1 DPF Ash Accumalation

P2409 60 Fuel Cap Sensor/Switch Circuit Range or Performance

U1900 20 Missing Message for Engine Speed

 

On the plus side I guess this means I have a DPF which is handy as none of the main dealers I contacted have been able to tell me or return my call...

On the not so plus side it sounds horribly expensive 

Same problems I had with my Focus! I had a Terraclean done on mine to clean the DPF. However I will advise you to get the injector seals checked if you go down that route as it will remove a s-ton of carbon and if your injector seals were going like mine were you'll end up with problems! The carbon was apparently preventing my car going to its demise!

Other than that, I'd recommend the Terraclean because it made an incredible difference!

[SenorC77]

Great stuff.  I know nothing about what nay of this means other than expensive so will investigate and get it booked into garage for next week 

[DJ_Andy_M]

2 hours ago, SenorC77 said:

Great stuff.  I know nothing about what nay of this means other than expensive so will investigate and get it booked into garage for next week 

Put it this way, if it wasn't for the terraclean it would have meant a new DPF effectively. It can extend the life of the DPF in a roundabout way, but eventually you'll have to get a new one I guess.

[SenorC77]

I contacted my local Terraclean operator and have just had the following response:

 

Quote

No sorry, a Terraclean will not solve this issue. You have a DPF blockage issue because the car hasn't been regenerating the dpf.

 

Probably caused by the fuel cap sensor. Everytime you fill up with fuel a small amount of Eloys fluid which is in a seperate tank will inject some fluid into the fuel tank. This hasn't been happening because of the fuel flap issue. 

 

So the fuel filler flap switch and eloys fluid tank system needs to be checked and fixed first. After that is fixed the DPF needs to be cleaned and regenerated. This will require a Diesel specialist that knows these systems and how to fix them.

 

[DJ_Andy_M]

Difficult one because its probably just the eloys fluid needs topping up and the figure resetting, then a terraclean to get rid of the blockage will do the job.

But the chances are that when you go to get this done they will try and sell you a DPF in the process.

[SenorC77]

DPF is completely blocked by all accounts and needs replacing and engine is overfilled with oil too which clearly hasn't helped matters either.  No idea how long its been like that for, hadn't thought to check since I got the car a few weeks ago as it had been serviced in May.

New DPF and sensor is being fitted on monday as the only other option is to find somewhere that will remove it and then as I understand it I need to have the ECU reprogrammed and it could cause problems at MOT.  

Some you win... 

[DJ_Andy_M]

10 hours ago, SenorC77 said:

DPF is completely blocked by all accounts and needs replacing and engine is overfilled with oil too which clearly hasn't helped matters either.  No idea how long its been like that for, hadn't thought to check since I got the car a few weeks ago as it had been serviced in May.

New DPF and sensor is being fitted on monday as the only other option is to find somewhere that will remove it and then as I understand it I need to have the ECU reprogrammed and it could cause problems at MOT.  

Some you win... 

Removal of the DPF is illegal regardless. They will check it although difficult as they will can only do a visual inspection.

[ace666]

I have a 2ltr tdci so take from this what you will.

 I had an engine system malfunction come up on my dash, scanned it with forscan and it said that the dpf additive tank was empty.

So I ordered the fluid and refiled the tank. Then reset the module once again with forscan.

 Then I performed a static dpf regen with you guessed it forscan ( but if you go down the static regen make sure your engine is it temperature)

 Then lastly I reset the egr learned values with the forscan software (As you can tell I use forscan alot its awesome )

Hope this is some help

regards Adam   

[DJ_Andy_M]

4 hours ago, ace666 said:

I have a 2ltr tdci so take from this what you will.

 I had an engine system malfunction come up on my dash, scanned it with forscan and it said that the dpf additive tank was empty.

So I ordered the fluid and refiled the tank. Then reset the module once again with forscan.

 Then I performed a static dpf regen with you guessed it forscan ( but if you go down the static regen make sure your engine is it temperature)

 Then lastly I reset the egr learned values with the forscan software (As you can tell I use forscan alot its awesome )

Hope this is some help

regards Adam   

Really helpful actually. However, if its as blocked as mine once was, the back pressure is going to be something insanely high and will need to have something to clean out the excess. Mine went through a terraclean and then he performed a static regen on the car keeping the revs at 2000 rpm for about 15/20 minutes with some magic stick on the steering wheel.