Hi,

Intending to tap into Kuga 2017 cabin fuse and have a few questions...

I would prefer not to use a critical fuse, also an ignition supply, rather than permanent.  This is appears to be very limited in the cabin, being fuse positions F82-F89.

F85 is listed as Ignition, but I have noted F78 is Push Button Ignition, which is what is in the Kuga ... why two ignition?  Is it ok to use F78?

F84 has a 20Amp fuse, but shown as Not Used in chart.

I also have a 15Amp in F87, which is shown as unused in the specification.  F88 has no fuse, but it appears to be live.  More weirdly, it is live on both sides!! Can anyone explain?

Nb I actually want two taps, one for dashcam, the other to give additional USB sockets.

It will always be live both sides of a fuse unless the fuse has blown if the circuit is live. It’s a fuse not a relay it is protecting the circuit its part of. 
 

I usually use something like a parking module or heated seats, heated steering etc. 

A 2017 kuga should be the same platform as a mk3 focus so I know there is a few ignition switched live on that. 
 

Given your voltmeter is showing 14.5V the engine must be running. You’ll need engine and ignition off to find an ignition switched circuit. You are looking for a fuse with no voltage when ignition is off but live when ignition is on.

The ignition circuits will always be permanent live or they can’t signal the car to start. An ignition or start circuit are not the same thing as an ignition SWITCHED circuit  the latter only comes on after the ignition is on.

I would consider anything to do with ignition or starting as critical and not touch it. You want to tap something that’s not going to stop you driving the car. As I say something to do with heat or parking sensors is usually a good start. 

1 minute ago, alexp999 said:

It will always be live both sides of a fuse unless the fuse has blown. It’s a fuse not a relay it is protecting the circuit its part of. 

Hi, I suspect you didn't get a chance to view the picture.  F88 has no fuse, so I inserted the probe on both sides, 'straight onto the board'.  By doing this, I believe I should on get power one side (being the purpose of the fuse, to break the connection).

If it’s unused I wouldn’t worry about it. 

When was your car built?

Looking at the manual online it says F87 is heated steering, which should be switched live and what I'd probably use. Do you have heated steering?

1 hour ago, alexp999 said:

If it’s unused I wouldn’t worry about it. 

The point being, I would prefer not to use any vital fuses, so it would be a useful if I understood what was going on.  Hence all the questions, including two ignition fuses.

It gets more complicated, as I have found the volt meter gets no readings from the 20Amp fuses in F82-F84.  If I pull the fuse in F82, the washer pump does not work, so it is doing its job.  If I insert the fuse tap here, the pump works, but the dashcam has no (insufficient?) power.

NB the tap works fine in F87, shown as unused, but has a 15amp fuse(!?!?)

It is completely confusing me.  If anyone with a good understanding of electrics, more so the Kuga fuse specs, can provide some (all 😀) the answers, I would very much appreciate it.

The ignition fuses are powering the circuitry to start the ignition, signal you pressing the start button, signal the engine. They will be permanent live.

As I say, online it says F87 is heated steering so use that. It should be ignition switched, not permanent.

57 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

When was your car built?

Looking at the manual online it says F87 is heated steering, which should be switched live and what I'd probably use. Do you have heated steering?

2017 ... not that I am aware of, and I assume I would be (?!?!).

Would you mind giving a link for the specs? I must be looking in the wrong place 😞

https://www.ford.co.uk/support/owner-manuals

33 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

https://www.ford.co.uk/support/owner-manuals

Thank you ... my google came up with fokuman site. Choosing 2017, 09/2017 from link illustrates my fuse spec.

F87 is a great recommendation (I guess they add a fuse even if you don't have it).  Unfortunately, I would like to add a second, and the other positions appear to be important ... wish I knew why the 20Amp fuses don't work, as I would prefer to tap into the washer or locking, rather than ignition or airbags!

Can’t you tap both off the same fuse?

3 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

Can’t you tap both off the same fuse?

Afraid not, the first tap is an additional 12v cigarette lighter for a Road Angel pro (using supplied USB adapter).  I don't want it always on as it drained my battery(!).

The second is for USB step-down to 5V/3A, so a very different device.

So do you want the usb permanently live? But the dash cam ignition only?

If you want both ignition only and you don’t have heated steering but fuse 87 does what you want, then just feed both from the same tap you’ll be no way near its rating. 

 

Just to expand. 15W from the USB is 1.25A at 12V. The dashcam won’t even use 1A. 
 

There is probably another fuse that’s ignition switched live. I’d just think it’s easier and neater to use one for both. 

25 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

So do you want the usb permanently live? But the dash cam ignition only?

Just to expand. 15W from the USB is 1.25A at 12V. The dashcam won’t even use 1A. 

Yes, Ignition only. The USB step-down provides two USB-A connectors.  I will use one for my phone, but the other for Echo Auto, so it has the potential to be always on 😞  As mentioned, I don't trust the Halo Pro.

Very much appreciate the suggestion, but is there a 'double tap' 🤔 ... the taps I have are fairly generic, 'fusing' the 'in car purposed' device, and providing a 'fused positive cable' for an additional device.  I haven't seen a 'tap on a tap', is it done?  I guess the danger would be the load on the fuse board wiring, hence your assurance the 'double devices' would be fine (?)

Added a picture showing the cigarette adapter tapped in, and the USB adapter waiting to find a position 😀

Fuses protect cables, not devices. It’s to stop fires from the cables overheating. If you connect a dashcam with a 1A fuse then it’s still a potentially capable of pulling enough power to damage itself if the unit fails, but the cable to it will be safe. That’s why fuses are always rated more than the device needs, but never more than the cable can handle.

As long as the fuse covers the draw of both devices and the cables going to both devices are rated for more than the fuse I don’t see an issue. You should be able to just put both cables in the one tap if it’s crimp type. Unless you are using a hard wire kit for the cam that has its own tap and you don’t want to mess with the wiring?

Its not about how many devices you connect up but about how much current you are pulling. 

3 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

...Unless you are using a hard wire kit for the cam that has its own tap and you don’t want to mess with the wiring?

Caused my own problem here ... thought Road Angel price for 12v Hard Wire kit was extortionate, and came up with the (brilliant) idea to piggyback a hidden cigarette lighter adapter, and simply use the provided USB cable --- 'tap 1'.

Now trying to add a second tap for usb, as described above.

Real shame there are so few ignition fuse positions (you will see tap 1 is actually blocking the above two fuses 😞 )

Is this a REALLY BAD IDEA (lemmig stupid)???

Theoretically, I think it is the same as suggested, perhaps with added fuse 😉 Nb as discussed, I am not aware of heated steering, so that wouldn't draw any power.

If it’s the correct way round then electrically it’s probably ok. But I’d worry a bit about the strain particularly in a car when going over bumps etc. 

Are they both already terminated as fuse taps? I was thinking you could just put both wires in to one tap’s crimp connector. 

15 hours ago, alexp999 said:

Are they both already terminated as fuse taps? I was thinking you could just put both wires in to one tap’s crimp connector. 

I imagined what you were suggesting, but the USB accessory had such thin wire, I chose to solder into the bullet connector to ensure a good connection.  The dashcam cigarette lighter is well and truely tucked away, so I camw to the conclusion is was 'too much effort'.  Appreciate the warning about bumps, but the 'double tap' feels secure, so will see how it goes 😀

Thank you for your patience with me, and really quick replies on a Sunday.

All the best