Ford Focus 1.8tdi 2008 Poor starting cold or hot

[wraith1966]

Hello everyone.

I have and ownered since new Ford Focus 2008 1.8Tdci. Miles on the clock is 131k never had any trouble with it till now, as i service it often as most of my driving is short trips, only thing changed is clutch due to failure and knocking and timing belt and the normal stuff.

Problem happens after the car as been standing over night, even if its a warm morning or cold, heater plugs have been charged after finding 3 out of 4 was not working only to find out nearly 1 week later they where not to blame. tested the hidden menu only thing it says is the wording is "test" no codes come up.

Car turns over fires then runs for few secs, very lumpy then cuts out, then i have to turn it over and over 9 times out of 10 it will not fire up, then after good few goes its fires up and runs fine.

I have read many posts where people have had the same kind of trouble on there fords where people have changed there Starters and batterys, do think it would be best to get it a electrical on the starter and battery before i start to waste money ? or anyone else had this kind of trouble and what was wrong with yours ?

EXTRA INFO

About 2 years ago i started the car and think now it was something like this, but it started the second go and did not think any more of it, but for a split second it flashed up the wording "EPG" this as not happen again and does not happen now and no wording, the car gets great miles to the gallon, pulls under throttle, also this problem does not happen every day ! could go for many days before it happens, but say all that it did happen twice last week back to back.

I have read its best to run the fuel cleaner at times incase the EGR is sticking or does BP fuel really work ? or would the EGR stop my car starting ? but would that not appear on a test ?

Things i have not changed since new "starter motor" "battery" "tubro"

Would love to read anything you like to say that could help

[Tdci-Peter]

1 hour ago, wraith1966 said:

Problem happens after the car as been standing over night, even if its a warm morning or cold, ....

Car turns over fires then runs for few secs, very lumpy then cuts out, then i have to turn it over and over 9 times out of 10 it will not fire up, then after good few goes its fires up and runs fine.

First points to check are fuel filter and pipes. Air getting in to the system could easily cause this. Clogged filter, loose filter top, bad gasket in filter, cracked pipes, loose pipe connections, are all ways air can get in. The fuel system up to the diesel pump runs under suction almost all the time, so leaks will let air in, not fuel out.

Glowplugs are only needed on the 1.8TDCI when starting with the engine below about 5C. EGR remains closed while starting, and will affect normal running with little power dips or unexpected stalls. Turbo has no effect on starting. If the engine turns over ok, and fires up, then battery and starter motor are not prime suspects.

Fuel system is deffo the prime suspect area.

[wraith1966]

On 12/9/2018 at 11:31 PM, Tdci-Peter said:

First points to check are fuel filter and pipes. Air getting in to the system could easily cause this. Clogged filter, loose filter top, bad gasket in filter, cracked pipes, loose pipe connections, are all ways air can get in. The fuel system up to the diesel pump runs under suction almost all the time, so leaks will let air in, not fuel out.

Glowplugs are only needed on the 1.8TDCI when starting with the engine below about 5C. EGR remains closed while starting, and will affect normal running with little power dips or unexpected stalls. Turbo has no effect on starting. If the engine turns over ok, and fires up, then battery and starter motor are not prime suspects.

Fuel system is deffo the prime suspect area.

ok Peter should have added, car had a engine service before this problem, and its still there no smell of fuel under the bottom when running and none when its just been turned off, mmm i need to have a very close look since you are saying it could be air.

*UPDATE

if i put my foot down before turning the key  "lets say less than half throttle " 2000-2500 revs"   which i have been doing since the first post above it as not cut out, but it tried once on the 13/12/2018, but like i said above with that extra bit of throttle it stopped it and never felt like a lumpy start.

EGR INFO I have this problem as well but was thinking it was not linked to the starting problem.

little power dips, thats what i some times get when driving down the road lets say i release the throttle and put it back on i get power dips, also from roundabouts, but also from releasing and putting throttle back on around corners. come to think about its always when putting the throttle back on but only when not heavy footed "could this be the trouble ? EGR Valve not be cheap to replace on my car i have been told and a pig to get to as i would not be carrying out this work. is the car worth it as it as done 131k miles on the clock, heard people blank them off but i do not want to go down this road.

Shame i have had it since new i do not like getting rid of my ford cars had so many from p-reg mk2 escort back in 80s all the way up to some of the best, all feel abit of me this could end up been a very cheap car for someone. if they can fix it them self

OK may have to start looking for Ford Focus 1.6 zetec s 2011 to 2015, white would be nice, with black windows and the Y spoke rims, but i am not that lucky lol

just added £70 worth of the BP Ultimate Diesel with ACTIVE technology fuel for cleaning diesel engines and will keep adding this every 2 weeks from now on, if its true it really works ?

love to read more feed back peter and anyone else with the extra bit i have added.

thx for the extra info peter and Merry blue ford christmas to everyone

 

 

[Tdci-Peter]

11 hours ago, wraith1966 said:

car had a engine service before this problem,

Fuel filter is not part of a routine annual service, it is about every 3 years. Also changing the filter is one way to get leaks. The lid may not be tightened properly, the gasket damaged or misplaced, and fuel pipes have to be disconnected, bent about and re-connected. There is no tank pump on these (or almost any Ford diesel), so fuel is very unlikely to leak out unless there is a major pipe break, and that is not the case since it runs ok once going.

I have solved the EGR hesitations on my car by changing just the actuator part of the EGR valve. This is the visible part at the back of the engine, and is quite easy to remove. Actuators are widely available on the 'net for about £50. They are a common problem. I did a little guide here:

I really ought to transfer the content of that to a topic about EGR valves instead of ERG valves .

I also did a pdf about it, though it is a bit out of date now and mostly superseded by the post above:

https://www.fordownersclub.com/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=38763

I am not sure what the accelerator pedal does when starting. There is no direct link to the fuel system, it is all entirely under control of the software in the ECU. But maybe it makes the ECU give a bit more welly to the fuel pump or injectors.

I am not convinced about any fuel additives, at least not to solve existing problems. Maybe they have some cleaning effect inside the cylinder, but fuel does not go near the EGR valve, unless unburnt fuel passes through to the exhaust.

[FatHead1979]

+1 for @Tdci-Peter post above.

 

It is very easy to not seat the rubber o-ring correctly when refitting the fuel filter housing "lid" after replacing the filter and I know 1st hand not putting locking collar back on quite tight enough can let just enough air in to cause problems (but the car can still be driven).

I'd start off with the cheap things like checking the fuel filter is "fresh/new" and that the sealing o-ring isn't scrunched up.

[wraith1966]

I did not do the service but a friend did, everything looked fine, i will have another look in couple days.

when i get a service i ask for the fuel filter as well. was going to check around the pipes today but omg its cold outside lol