Hi.

Had my 125 72 plate Festa vignale 5 weeks.Three times i have been stuck after a stall.

The car was in normal mode the car stalled and would not restart.Dash was fully lit with the manual restart sign.Clutch up and down.button press.Stuck at a T junction luckily quiet each time and suddenly after 3 minutes or so it goes.

Even when not conking out when stop start knocks the engine off it often wont restart on lifting the clutch and only will when re dipping the clutch to the floor which has been dangerous several times when driving out into a gap.

My previous few fiestas had stop start that had no issues.Not this one.

Any advice appreciated.

Mark

The Engine should restart when pressing the Clutch to the floor, not when lifting it up.

If this is an MHEV with rolling stop it may restart when lifting the clutch.  As you don't need to select neutral in those, the engine stops at about 7mph while slowing.  I can't remember exactly how it was setup now though.

This fault sounds like the MHEV battery is too low on charge to restart - if indeed it is an MHEV.

If it's just conventional ICE then ignore this.

7 minutes ago, Tizer said:

The Engine should restart when pressing the Clutch to the floor, not when lifting it up.

My 19 plate st line did that I assumed this was a different system.When stationary and clutch down engine is off and starts when clutch is lifted but sometimes id doesn’t.

Its horrible.

4 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

If this is an MHEV with rolling stop it may restart when lifting the clutch.  As you don't need to select neutral in those, the engine stops at about 7mph while slowing.  I can't remember exactly how it was setup now though.

This fault sounds like the MHEV battery is too low on charge to restart - if indeed it is an MHEV.

If it's just conventional ICE then ignore this.

It’s mild hybrid.Problem is if clutch isn’t fully depressed it sometimes doesn’t redstart on lifting even though it is set to low speed in the menu.

Still perplexed over the times it literally wont restart but I’ve read of the same issue once  from another owner.

13 hours ago, Markie B said:

It’s mild hybrid.Problem is if clutch isn’t fully depressed it sometimes doesn’t redstart on lifting even though it is set to low speed in the menu.

Still perplexed over the times it literally wont restart but I’ve read of the same issue once  from another owner.

There are two clutch switches.  One detects when the clutch is right down.  The other detects when the clutch is right up.  So if the pedal isn't pushed right down that might confuse the system and the process.

Warm restarts are done by the MHEV battery & generator, so there is still potentially an issue with those.  I'm not whether a manual restart on a warm engine uses the 12v battery & starter motor or not.  Perhaps such a short time switched off is confusing that as well.  The 19 plate wouldn't have been MHEV so it is a very different system on these.

It's a 2023 car, it should still be under warranty, take it back to the dealer as it's their problem...

4 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

There are two clutch switches.  One detects when the clutch is right down.  The other detects when the clutch is right up.  So if the pedal isn't pushed right down that might confuse the system and the process.

Warm restarts are done by the MHEV battery & generator, so there is still potentially an issue with those.  I'm not whether a manual restart on a warm engine uses the 12v battery & starter motor or not.  Perhaps such a short time switched off is confusing that as well.  The 19 plate wouldn't have been MHEV so it is a very different system on these.

Just had a go in my neighbours puma with same engine.Similar to mine but doesn’t switch off as soon or as often as mine and both set to low.I do think its the pedal not being pushed all the way down but need to get the not starting at all problem sorted.I’ll keep you posted.

4 hours ago, StephenFord said:

It's a 2023 car, it should still be under warranty, take it back to the dealer as it's their problem...

Yes.Thats going to be the case though I’m miffed as I sold a mint 19 plate that never went wrong.

Yes, I'd agree with referring back to the dealer on a car still in warranty.

I've swerved MHEVs so far, so my experience is limited to the odd test drive.

We've seen a few issues with these, and other makes forums seem to have their share also. I just wonder if the MHEV battery is as prone to insufficient charging as 12v batteries are these days? If your driving circumstances don't give enough opportunities for regen, what happens when the 48v battery drops to a critically low level of charge?

 

On 11/1/2024 at 2:57 PM, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Yes, I'd agree with referring back to the dealer on a car still in warranty.

I've swerved MHEVs so far, so my experience is limited to the odd test drive.

We've seen a few issues with these, and other makes forums seem to have their share also. I just wonder if the MHEV battery is as prone to insufficient charging as 12v batteries are these days? If your driving circumstances don't give enough opportunities for regen, what happens when the 48v battery drops to a critically low level of charge?

 

It went today again and refused to restart.I had to push it off the roundabout as no combination of clutch,start button key bob would start it.After a few minutes it started and was fine afterwards.

I reckon when I take it to the garage they will take it around the block and say all is well.

It seems to be brought on when it stalls when rolling slightly not at an absolute stop.

3 hours ago, Markie B said:

I reckon when I take it to the garage they will take it around the block and say all is well.

Personally I would start the process now of rejecting the vehicle, as is your right to do so. Then I bet all of a sudden the garage will pay a lot more attention to the problem and even get Ford technical help involved.

2 hours ago, unofix said:

Personally I would start the process now of rejecting the vehicle, as is your right to do so. Then I bet all of a sudden the garage will pay a lot more attention to the problem and even get Ford technical help involved.

Yes.It’s a driving school car.Today was a nightmare.If it happens on a test I’m screwed.I’ll get it in and keep you posted.

Hi. I have the same problem with identical car. Been in a few times and can’t find a problem. Last time they said it was the battery and changed it under warranty.

Trouble is I’m a driving instructor too and it did happen on a test. Very angry examiner phoned up shouting my car won’t start!! Was going to terminate test but luckily it started again.

Will be booking in again tomorrow

9 hours ago, Glenn Jones said:

Very angry examiner phoned up shouting my car won’t start!!

I'm not sure they're cut out to be a driving examiner.  

While it's not a fix, it's probably best to ask students to switch it off on their test.

16 hours ago, Glenn Jones said:

Last time they said it was the battery and changed it under warranty.

Hi Glenn, welcome.

Out of interest - which one? The 12v or the 48v?

Hi, I’m a driving instructor too, my fiesta 72 plate that I’ve only had for 4 months is doing the same stalling and not restarting after a manual restart. Took it Ford and they couldn’t find anything wrong with it! Did you find out the reason? So stressed about it! Thanks 

The MHEV features stop in gear technology, so the engine stops below a certain road speed when the car is in gear with the clutch depressed. The engine also stops when the car is in neutral.

The engine should restart it you take your foot off the brake when the car is stopped in gear with the clutch depressed. It should also restart when a gear is selected from neutral.

I find mine takes me by surprise sometimes, as I try to pull away from a junction the car bogs down, I can easily see that a learner would stall the car in these circumstances. I haven't found a solution and I can't predict when it is going to happen. If I was using the car with a learner I would use the button to disable the stop/start during lessons.

Good morning thanks for your reply. I do turn off the start stop button when the pupils drive otherwise yes they get confused and it gently stalls and restarts without any problems.

I’ve noticed when they are a little out of their comfort zone or in the early stages of learning they are pressing the gas a little hard on approach to junctions then forget to put the clutch down and brake hard (it’s also happened moving off up hill when the pupil took her foot off the clutch to quick and practicing the emergency stop) that’s when the car requires a manual start and no matter any combination of clutch/ brake, swapping seats and pressing the start button gets it going until 5 long minutes has passed then suddenly it’s like it’s never happened and restarts when pressing the start button.
I’ve read there might be too much fuel in the engine and that’s why it shuts down? 

Probably out of the 50 stalls in the last 4 months 10 times it hasn’t restarted and have to wait the 5 long minutes. I’m scared it’s going to happen in a dangerous place or on a driving test! 

Ford will hopefully ring me back tomorrow. It’s out of warranty and have offered to have another look at it or should I just change the car? Thanks 

Ah, ok, I had misunderstood your problem. I haven't had to do a manual restart since owning my MHEV Puma so I don't know if it is a regular problem but I expect that we would have heard a lot about it on here if it was happening to everyone.

As an aside my son had a problem on his test in a mini. Stop start switched off the engine at traffic lights near the end of his test. When the light went green the car wouldn't restart. Manual restart didn't work and the examiner couldn't get it to start either. As they were not far from the test centre the examiner walked back to the test centre to fetch the driving instructor who owned the car. Meanwhile the police have turned up to see what is happening, at this point my son is in charge of the car as a learner but unsupervised. The police couldn't restart the car and neither could the driving instructor when he returned to it. The car had to be recovered.

The good news was that my son passed the test, fortunately he was very close to the end of the test when the car failed. I can't imagine a more nerve wracking experience for a learner on a test.

2 hours ago, pcaouolte said:

I don't know if it is a regular problem but I expect that we would have heard a lot about it on here if it was happening to everyone.

Yes and No.

Most qualified drivers don't regularly stall their cars on a daily basis, so most would probably never encounter the problem.

I imagine that this issue of the engine failing to restart after stalling is possibly not something that the whizz kids at Ford gave much thought to.

If qualified drivers stalled their car a couple of times a day, everyday then I suspect this issue would very quickly be come a well known problem, and possibly something Ford would have to eventually look in to.

1 hour ago, unofix said:

Most qualified drivers don't regularly stall their cars on a daily basis, so most would probably never encounter the problem.

Yes, it's a long time since I stalled. That's not in any way due to the driver, btw, but to modern engine management, anti-stall software, etc.

I've only driven MHEVs on test drives,** so very limited acquaintance, but I wonder if there's any benefit in having a fiddle with the settings, such as engine stop speed?

(**I wasn't impressed. I was considering whether to go for a 155 or the ST, but didn't fancy the MHEV system. I can well imagine it being very off-putting for a learner on top of everything else these days.)

PS I wonder would the device you supplied to permanently disable the S/S, work on an MHEV and be of help to our driving instructor members?

3 minutes ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

PS I wonder would the device you supplied to permanently disable the S/S, work on an MHEV and be of help to our driving instructor members?

To be honest, while I know it works on regular Stop/Start engines, I've no idea if it would help or even work with a MHEV 🤔

Thanks everyone,  I think I’ll change the car asap

40 minutes ago, Sully2 said:

I think I’ll change the car asap

Assuming you want to continue teaching manual, it'll be interesting to see what you decide on.

Very few manuals about now, and some of those (like the Suzuki Swift) are mild hybrids though I don't know if they operate quite like the Ford system. The VW Group superminis (Polo, A1, Fabia, Ibiza) can still be had as non MHEV manuals, as can the Renault Clio. Perhaps surprisingly, Hyundai ditched the MHEV system on their i20 fairly recently so that's another Fiesta-ish possibility.