Needles flickering on startup (plus other weirdness)

[bezzawezza]

Hi guys, this has been an ongoing issue for a few months but I hadn't spotted some of the signs until now.

It started out with my wife's 2013 Fiesta Zetec occasionally resetting some of the trip computer (average mpg, average speed) for no reason on starting the car and that's continually been happening for months. I've since noticed that this coincides with the needles flickering at zero for a few seconds at startup (which I've read indicates  a battery test is in place???)

in August I had the battery and alternator checked and was told they were fine.

on investigating this further I've read that the 2014 fiesta had issues with bluetooth draining batteries so I've today switched the bluetooth off completely.

Got in the car an hour later and started it and low and behold it does it again (it started fine first thing when I switched off Bluetooth). Take it for a drive to put an average mpg back on the clock and whilst driving the CD randomly ejects.

Take out the CD and return home but now the flickering of the needles happens each and every time the car starts (and presumably the trip computer resets too had it not already been reset by a previous start).

ive put the bluetooth back on - still happens

switched off radio on start - still happens

switched on radio on start - still happens

does anyone have any idea what could possibly be causing this? Are you able to confirm the needles flickering is a battery test? I'm thinking this may end up going to a specialist ford dealer now as my garage didn't have a clue when I've mentioned it previously.

i have taken a video of the needles flickering but can't figure out how to upload it sorry.

please help, this is stressing me right out now and I'm worried it'll get worse and leave my wife and kids stranded or cause some serious issues.

[ThaiFiesta]

Two things come to mind from reading various forums:

1. The earth cable is making poor/intermittent contact with the body. Take it off, clean it down and ensure it has good contact before replacing. 

2. There are poor connections in the various engine bay fuses due to water getting into the fuse box and causing rust. 

[bezzawezza]

Okay thanks for the advice. I'm very much an amateur though so where would I find the earth cable? Aren't there a number around the car (some in awkward to reach places)?

I'm dubious on whether it's a water issue to be honest as, whilst it's wet today and doing it every time, it was also doing it intermittently in June and July when we had that bit of a heatwave.

 

[ThaiFiesta]

3 minutes ago, bezzawezza said:

Okay thanks for the advice. I'm very much an amateur though so where would I find the earth cable? Aren't there a number around the car (some in awkward to reach places)?

I'm dubious on whether it's a water issue to be honest as, whilst it's wet today and doing it every time, it was also doing it intermittently in June and July when we had that bit of a heatwave.

 

The main earth cable runs from the battery to the body near the passenger strut tower. 

The water could have got in some time before and caused rust. Take the lid off the fuse box and check none of the fuse mountings are rusty. 

[bezzawezza]

Okay, I'll have a look into this. Could this cause the symptoms I've described then? 

[bezzawezza]

When you say passenger strut tower are you referring to the suspension strut or the strut of the car chassis between the front and rear doors? Sorry to be dense.

if it's the earth from the battery then it could add up as we had the battery replaced in January and the issue went away for a bit. Possibly the earth worked it's was loose again.

[bezzawezza]

Sorry one other question. If I give the car a run (so presumably the battery gets charged a bit) the problem seems to go away for a bit. Could that still point to earthing or fuse box issues? It could earthing and fuse box issues cause the battery to discharge? I'm convinced what I'm seeing is because the battery is beginning to drop below some sort of threshold but it's been tested okay along with the alternator.

So my theory is that when the car gets a run the battery goes to 100% and the car starts fine. When it drops to 95% the flickering needles starts but it's still enough to start the car. I take the battery to be checked but the run the garage charges it to 100% and it reads fine (along with the alternator).

The question then is what is causing the battery to discharge? Could this be the earthing/fuse box mentioned above?

[ThaiFiesta]

2 hours ago, bezzawezza said:

When you say passenger strut tower are you referring to the suspension strut or the strut of the car chassis between the front and rear doors? Sorry to be dense.

if it's the earth from the battery then it could add up as we had the battery replaced in January and the issue went away for a bit. Possibly the earth worked it's was loose again.

That's the earth lead I was referring to

There is another one under the glove box to the inside chassis but it's not usually a problem (might be worth checking though)

[bezzawezza]

That's awesome cheers mate. Sorry to bang on but could that cause battery drain then? I've given the car a 20-30minute run and seems fine again.

[ThaiFiesta]

29 minutes ago, bezzawezza said:

Sorry one other question. If I give the car a run (so presumably the battery gets charged a bit) the problem seems to go away for a bit. Could that still point to earthing or fuse box issues? It could earthing and fuse box issues cause the battery to discharge? I'm convinced what I'm seeing is because the battery is beginning to drop below some sort of threshold but it's been tested okay along with the alternator.

So my theory is that when the car gets a run the battery goes to 100% and the car starts fine. When it drops to 95% the flickering needles starts but it's still enough to start the car. I take the battery to be checked but the run the garage charges it to 100% and it reads fine (along with the alternator).

The question then is what is causing the battery to discharge? Could this be the earthing/fuse box mentioned above?

It's hard to diagnose be post but best ruling out the simple causes before the complex. You've already checked the battery, however modern electronics can be quite sensitive to charge so it still could be the battery. Leave that for later.

Check the earth described above and check to see the fuse box shows no signs of corrosion.

Assuming both of those are ok then it's likely your battery - a local garage might allow you to swap a good one around for testing.

Failing all that it is likely to be an ECU / instrument cluster problem.  

Has the car thrown any codes or check engine lights?  Worth checking this with an OBDII reader which a local garage will have or can be purchased cheaply online. 

[Stoney871]

Could well be a parasitic power drain sonewherw ib the system (boot light staying on or suchlike).
My cousin works with a security company and last year his duty car wouldn't start with a battery showing 6v at rest.
All their vehicles have telematic boxes fitted and the one in his was constantly drawing .3A when the car wasn't running which was enough to kill the battery after 9 months.
The AA patrolman disconnected it and fitted a new battery, the vehicle has been fine since.

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[bezzawezza]

Okay thanks for that although ECU problem concerns me! ;)

We had a weird code come up in January which is when we replaced the battery but nothing has come up since and no check engine lights.

Hopefully you're right and it's the earthing or fuses.

[bezzawezza]

Right, checked the earth cable and it seems fairly solid and okay. Also took the top of the fuse box in the engine and visually it looks fine. (See pictures)

Starting to worry it's the cluster or the ECU now as they're gonna prove expensive.

 

[bezzawezza]

Is there an easy way to see if something is drawing power whilst switched off as I'm convinced this is what's happening.

sorry for so many questions guys. I really do appreciate your assistance.

[ThaiFiesta]

22 minutes ago, bezzawezza said:

Is there an easy way to see if something is drawing power whilst switched off as I'm convinced this is what's happening.

sorry for so many questions guys. I really do appreciate your assistance.

Sorry that's a bit out of my depth. You'd need to ask an auto-electrician. 

Both ends of your earth cable look terrible to me. They should be clean not cruddy like they are. The battery end appears to have corroded. Do you have a more clear photo?

[bezzawezza]

I'm not by the vehicle now but will get one later. That's a big dollup of grease on the battery end though. Should that not be there?

[Stoney871]

Too much grease isn't good.
That earth cable looks terrible to me, god knows what it's like inside the core.

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[bezzawezza]

Hi guys, better pictures as requested. Do these look bad then? Whilst a bit full of grease I thought they looked okay tbh 

[cjay1]

The earth cable looks to have been attached to a painted surface as well as being grubby I thought these had to be attached to bare metal surface to allow the electrical current to flow properly?