hi guys

I have a 2006 3 door focus 2.0 duratech petrol with 99k on the clock,i bought it in jan this year and have covered around 500 miles in it since then.

I was going to leeds yesterday so on Friday I checked all the levels and to my horror the dip-stick was bone dry. I re-dipped around 6 times twisting the stick around etc but still nothing so I started her up and let her tick over for 5 mins. as soon as I switched her off I re-dipped and still nothing-not even any residue so I shot down to Halfords in my impresa and bought a litre of Castrol 5w30 fully synthetic,i shoved the whole lot in and re-dipped...........nothing at all.

I started her up and let her run for 10 mins then re-dipped.............nothing again,slightly worried by now.

I took the car to my mate @ a.t.s on Saturday morning to get it on the ramp to check for leaks and its bone dry, oil filter is dry,sump is dry,dip-stick tube is still attached etc etc. he had the same oil there so we started to pour some in and after 3/4 litre it was showing just under max on the stick so off I went to leeds (110 miles each way) problem free.

I checked the oil this morning and to my surprise its bone dry again.

the car runs suberb,no rattling/knocking/smoke/leaks etc

in my ownership I have done around 500 miles short trips only with 1 long trip to Stafford (100 miles round trip)

the car had an oil and filter change the day I bought it and I dipped it on the guys driveway and it was fine.

surely it cannot use that much oil? really baffled with this now.

any ideas please share them with me

thanks in advance

The Duratec-HE engine is an absolute pain to check the oil on in my experience. The engine takes an absolute age to drain back (hours, not minutes!) and the dipstick always shows zero on the first check before you put it back and try again. My advice is to do the following:

1: Always check the oil level in exactly the same place (somewhere level), preferably after letting the car stand overnight. If this isn't possible (e.g. its parked on a hill overnight) leave the car somewhere level for as long as possible before you check the level. 

2: If you do an oil change yourself, use a measuring jug to fill the engine to the stated capacity in the manual. Using the dipstick will mean you end up over or under-filling it. 

 

Just now, rhyds said:

The Duratec-HE engine is an absolute pain to check the oil on in my experience. The engine takes an absolute age to drain back (hours, not minutes!) and the dipstick always shows zero on the first check before you put it back and try again. My advice is to do the following:

1: Always check the oil level in exactly the same place (somewhere level), preferably after letting the car stand overnight. If this isn't possible (e.g. its parked on a hill overnight) leave the car somewhere level for as long as possible before you check the level. 

2: If you do an oil change yourself, use a measuring jug to fill the engine to the stated capacity in the manual. Using the dipstick will mean you end up over or under-filling it. 

hi and thanks for the reply, when I checked it on Friday for the 1st time it had been stood for 7 hours on level ground. when I re-checked it on Saturday morning it had stood for more than 10 hours overnight on level ground.

do you know what the capacity is?

 

According to the Haynes book of lies for the Focus MK2, a 2.0 takes 4.3 litres from empty including the filter.

I owned a 1.8 Duratec that burned oil (luckily managed to return it to the dealer) but that one was very obvious (blue smoke when revved hard, tail pipe full of black oily sludge). It might be worth waiting for someone who's more knowledgeable than me to give some more advice but I'd suggest monitoring the situation before you start worrying too much. 

2 hours ago, rhyds said:

The Duratec-HE engine is an absolute pain to check the oil on in my experience. The engine takes an absolute age to drain back (hours, not minutes!) and the dipstick always shows zero on the first check before you put it back and try again. My advice is to do the following:

1: Always check the oil level in exactly the same place (somewhere level), preferably after letting the car stand overnight. If this isn't possible (e.g. its parked on a hill overnight) leave the car somewhere level for as long as possible before you check the level. 

2: If you do an oil change yourself, use a measuring jug to fill the engine to the stated capacity in the manual. Using the dipstick will mean you end up over or under-filling it. 

 

+1 My experience exactly - it's always zero on the first dip, really strange!  FYI my 2.0 used about .5L in 8,000 miles.

My old man's theory is that the dipstick tube actually sits in the oil, and that the oil slowly drains out of the tube when the engine runs and it doesn't flow back in until you take the dipstick out the first time (so that the tube is unsealed). Either way its seriously confusing!

The oil level on the Duratec is quite a confusing issue, I get the same issue as you, plus it also has a common fault of oil control rings sticking allowing a small amount of oil to bypass the rings into the combination chamber. As the guy's have said, pull the dipstick out give it a wipe, give it a minute or so then I put the dipstick back in and turn it 360° and check it again, that's the method that works for me. Obviously check your oil level on a weekly basis the same you would any car.

10 hours ago, rhyds said:

My old man's theory is that the dipstick tube actually sits in the oil, and that the oil slowly drains out of the tube when the engine runs and it doesn't flow back in until you take the dipstick out the first time (so that the tube is unsealed). Either way its seriously confusing!

That's my theory too. An airlock builds up in the dipstick tube because it's sealed at the top by the O-ring on the dipstick. When you take the dipstick out it breaks the seal and allows the oil to rise up the tube. Always dip twice.

small update.....

 

checked it just now after the car has stood for 30 hours and still the dip stick was bone dry so I shot down Halfords in a rage and bought a 5l tub of oil and dumped 3L straight in it..............still nothing on the dipstick but now I have oil coming from exhaust when revving it so I'm guessing I have now over-filled it.

the saga continues............

57 minutes ago, shreksfocus said:

still nothing on the dipstick but now I have oil coming from exhaust when revving it so I'm guessing I have now over-filled it.

Or you're instantly burning all the oil you're putting in due to worn piston rings etc.

Just now, Luke4efc said:

Or you're instantly burning all the oil you're putting in due to worn piston rings etc.

but 3 litres should still show on the dip-stick should it not?

2 minutes ago, shreksfocus said:

but 3 litres should still show on the dip-stick should it not?

Ah maybe I misread your first post actually. I was thinking when your mechanic said the sump and oil filter he meant there was no oil in them, not that the seals were fine lol.

If your sump really did have no oil in then 3 litres may not show up. I take it you've tried the technique above for checking the oil?

2 minutes ago, Luke4efc said:

Ah maybe I misread your first post actually. I was thinking when your mechanic said the sump and oil filter he meant there was no oil in them, not that the seals were fine lol.

If your sump really did have no oil in then 3 litres may not show up. I take it you've tried the technique above for checking the oil?

yes mate, I have taken the dip-stick out (when engine is stone cold) wiped it and re-inserted it to pull it out again and still it showed nothing, I did this several times. I then let her run for a short while and did the same steps once warm.

both times showed nothing on the dip-stick

21 hours ago, shreksfocus said:

yes mate, I have taken the dip-stick out (when engine is stone cold) wiped it and re-inserted it to pull it out again and still it showed nothing, I did this several times. I then let her run for a short while and did the same steps once warm.

both times showed nothing on the dip-stick

Could the bottom of the dipstick pipe/tube be blocked?  (I don't know if the bottom of the dipstick extends past the end of the tube and actually into the sump when fully inserted, or whether it is still fully enclosed within the dipstick tube and the oil from the sump "usually" flows up the tube to meet the dipstick.)

small update

ordered a new dipstick from ford just incase some numpty has put the wrong one in- turns out they are identical so that was £11 quid wasted.

dropped the oil out today, just over 3 litres came out and it was jet black, considering it was changed 500 miles ago I was surprised at how bad it looked. 

pulled out the plugs (from left to right) and the 1st 2 were soaked in oil,the next 2 were a little oily,had no choice but to try and clean them up and re-use them for the time being.

new oil put in (4.3 litres) and a new filter and I can now see the oil on the dipstick.

will keep an eye on it for the next few weeks. 

still confused as to why black oil deposits were coming from the exhaust. there is no oil smell in the exhaust fumes.

I'm guessing its an internal problem maybe valve stem seals or piston rings but they usually leave a blue tint in the exhaust smoke which there is no sign of.

 

If some of the plugs were soaked in oil then it prob getting past the piston rings, valve stem seals. Don't wanna sound all doom and gloom but if your using that much oil, and by the sound of it what's come out after 500 miles your are, and the plugs were that badly soaked in oil, leaving it for a few wks to keep an eye on it isnt the best idea as your running the risk of causing more damage to the engine. 

When you say plugs were covered do you mean the electrode part of the threads of the plugs? 

Definitely check it at least twice a week if I were you, just to monitor how much oil it's using, as a rough guide it takes about 1litre of oil to move the level from min to max on the dipstick. Get a 5 litre can of reasonably cheap oil and share it out into 5 empty plastic one litre water bottles and keep them handy in the boot.

26 minutes ago, Dave1981 said:

If some of the plugs were soaked in oil then it prob getting past the piston rings, valve stem seals. Don't wanna sound all doom and gloom but if your using that much oil, and by the sound of it what's come out after 500 miles your are, and the plugs were that badly soaked in oil, leaving it for a few wks to keep an eye on it isnt the best idea as your running the risk of causing more damage to the engine. 

When you say plugs were covered do you mean the electrode part of the threads of the plugs? 

The threads were oily

Just buy a longer dipstick :)

 

If the threads were oily, it is not what you should be looking at for oil burnt in the combustion chamber.

Check the ceramic electrode in the centre of the plug as here.

http://www.dummies.com/home-garden/car-repair/how-to-assess-trouble-by-checking-your-spark-plugs/

ScaniaPBman.

Have you checked the crank case breather and done a compression test on the engine? Will give you a gd idea if you have a issue with the pistons an where the oil is going.

On 11/04/2018 at 4:52 PM, Dave1981 said:

Have you checked the crank case breather and done a compression test on the engine? Will give you a gd idea if you have a issue with the pistons an where the oil is going.

Will get the garage to check on thursday

So on our way to London we were driving along around 20 mph on the clogged motorway, I looked in my mirror and there was a fair bit of smoke, this was 100 miles into our journey. 

I looked again a little later and there was none. I'm guessing either rings or stem oil seals, if it's the latter then I would probably get them done as it won't be mega expensive. If it's the rings I will just keep topping it up until it gets so bad that I have to scrap it.

Disappointed as the car is mint and only covered 99.5k

anybody got a rough guide price to get the valve stem oil seals done?

I've seen reconditioned heads on eBay for  about £250, plus obviously you got the labour costs as well.

i doubt it will be stem seals, more like piston rings. as for the oily plugs, if it was on the threads then probably its the cam cover seal leaking and a pool of oil builds up on top the plug. removing plugs allows oil to drip over the threads.