2004/5 car. Brakes work perfectly well and have had pads replaced a few times over the years. Brake pedal is firm all the time.

The thing that is puzzling me is that whenever I have had to brake very hard in an emergency situation the pedal goes loose and to the floor. However, the braking is not effected and the pedal returns to normal after.

Is this a feature of the ABS system? I've never known it on any other car.

I am imagining that, if you have EBD (edit: its EBA Emergency Brake Assist?) which I understand applies full braking if it detects a high pedal rate, that could be included BUT I don't understand why you say "soft"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_brake_assist

However I've never experienced anything like that so I'll wait for others...?

Once had an issue with a past car, brakes all worked fine but under really heavy braking the pedal would go to the floor, then came back up slowly, turns out it was a failed seal on the brake master cylinder.

 

1 hour ago, Shearers said:

I am imagining that, if you have EBD (edit: its EBA Emergency Brake Assist?) which I understand applies full braking if it detects a high pedal rate, that could be included BUT I don't understand why you say "soft"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_brake_assist

However I've never experienced anything like that so I'll wait for others...?

That sounds feasible, but I doubt Ford fitted it way back then (2004 built car).

When I say "soft" I mean the pedal feels like it is disengaged from the system and is just a bit of metal on a swivel. Imagine you were to fit a brake pedal but not connect it to anything.

something is seriously wrong - most likely the point in post 3

EBA was an optional extra on the Mk2 Focus from launch in 2004.

It was only available with ESP though.  And I believe that was only available with rear discs at the time, so most won't have it.

ESP & EBA became standard on all trim levels at facelift in 2008.

 

Can't say I've ever felt a brake pedal disconnect under heavy braking though, so this does sound like a fault.  Think I'd try a fluid flush with an ABS bleed before replacing any parts.

Thanks guys. Did have fluid replaced at Kwik Fit last brake pad change. Issue was there before that so not something they did!

you can't use that methodology reliably - your worn out vehicle is your problem not there's

its possible the sacked McDonald’s burger flipper, on bail from one of his cases, did the job the same as he does all of them and added air rather than removed it...

but more likely, a 21 year old reservoir that is all rusty and disgusting inside where the seal has not been before, and thus on its last legs anyway, meant the seal got ripped to bits as the tech carefully did the task exactly as he was meant to...

 

 

39 minutes ago, Botus said:

you can't use that methodology reliably - your worn out vehicle is your problem not there's

its possible the sacked McDonald’s burger flipper, on bail from one of his cases, did the job the same as he does all of them and added air rather than removed it...

but more likely, a 21 year old reservoir that is all rusty and disgusting inside where the seal has not been before, and thus on its last legs anyway, meant the seal got ripped to bits as the tech carefully did the task exactly as he was meant to...

 

 

You missed the point I was making: the problem has been there for several years. I was merely saying that I had the brake fluid replaced by Kwik Fit recently.

23 minutes ago, tim091 said:

You missed the point I was making: the problem has been there for several years. I was merely saying that I had the brake fluid replaced by Kwik Fit recently.

The point that @Botus was making was why would you let any of those plooky youff's at that place even touch your car ? Id rather hang a couple of 56ers from my ***** with crocodile clips than let any of those idiots even look at my car. Why would you drive around with a vehicle in that condition for years ? Sorry but thats just stupid, you dont mess around when it comes to brakes !! Replace the Master cylinder !

a damaged main seal in the master cyl - is common on lots of old cars...  rust and the fact it doesn't usually go that far is the usual driver

as you are finding the pedal can go to the floor its highly dangerous as you can land with zero brakes -

if its only a bit of air you just pump the pedal and stop...
if its the seals you have no brake and nothing is going to work other than the headlamps and the front bumper

 

..and as its written here and you now say been like that for a while - dangerous driving fits the bill too ! - these days a master cyl is cheap and a good idea at this age - so the next trip should be a careful slow drive to fit a new one

10 hours ago, tim091 said:

 Did have fluid replaced at Kwik Fit last brake pad change. 

If I was you I'd stay well clear of going to Kwik Fit ☠️ Hear no end of horror stories by customers going to them! Even I had one horror story from around 2000, had two new front tyres fitted, just looked at them and thought all is well and went home, gave the car a good wash and went to apply some tyre shine I noticed the sizes didn't match my rear tyres, so took the car back, kwif fit telling me the tyres will be fine despite the size difference, wasn't having none of that and told them I want the correct size, car goes back in and oddly there was two tyres close by the fitting bay, I asked about and one bloke wondered where the tyres went, some idiot had grabbed the wrong tyres and fitted them 😡

A mate of mine took his Fiesta into our local Kwikfit as they were doing a special offer on MOT's. 

They failed it on a binding rear brake and told him that it needed 2 new hand brake cables, new brake shoes, wheel cylinders and brake drums and quoted him £350 to do it all. 

He then asked me to have a look. I jacked it up and spun the wheel and after about 4 revolutions it stopped so I removed the drum and found that the handbrake cable wasn't releasing fully. I gave it a couple of squirts of WD40 and manipulated the cable a few times. I then re-fitted the drum and hey-presto no more binding. He then took it elsewhere for the MOT where it passed with flying colours !!

 

1 hour ago, Phil3747 said:

A mate of mine took his Fiesta into our local Kwikfit as they were doing a special offer on MOT's. They failed it on a binding rear brake and told him that it needed 2 new hand brake cables, new brake shoes, wheel cylinders and brake drums and quoted him £350 to do it all. 

Horror stories wherever you go eh 

At the time my mam had an Escort MKII ghia, be about 1992 and she'd had a new exhaust fitted at Kwik Fit, At the same time my missus had just had a full exhaust on her car but elsewhere, my mam asked the missus how much it cost, ''was £75 all in'' my missus replied, my mam went in the house and sat down, going silent on us so I asked ''what's up mam''....She replied ''I've been charged £600 for a full exhaust at Kwik Fit'', I wanted to go back to Kwik Fit and ask why so expensive but my mam didn't want to go back as it would be very stressful for her........Lousy garage praying on the elderly and gullible.

Thanks for all the "advice." I got the answer I needed, that the behaviour is not normal.