On 7/2/2022 at 8:14 PM, Tizer said:

If all Connectivity settings are off then I'm not sure if your car can get the over the air updates to the TCU. ...

From the Australian FordPass terms:

Quote

• When [Connectivity is] ‘off’, Vehicle data and Location data are no longer transmitted, and OTA updates are disabled. The virtual pipeline to transmit data to and from the vehicle remains open, in order to be available to receive certain commands (eg a re-activation request or a reset request). It is important to note, in this mode, no Connected Services will work.

• Over the Air (OTA) updates: Enables Ford to conduct over-the-air updates to your vehicle’s FordPass Connect modem. Note: It does not update your in-vehicle SYNC system, nor any other vehicle system.

I wonder if the 'FordPass Connect Modem' is separate from, or only a part of, the Telematic Control Unit. I will play with the FordPass app and Connectivity at some point and let it update, but if I use Android Auto for navigation maybe it won't matter if the modem software is old (?)
 

I will understand more when I play with Forscan, including maybe getting an idea if there really is a permanent master log of error codes.

I read there are such a thing as 'Permanent DTCs' on cars from the last 10 years - but these are clearable using a 'Universal Trip Drive Pattern'. They are to stop people cheating on emissions tests...

https://www.autoserviceworld.com/carsmagazine/taking-a-first-look-at-permanent-dtcs/

Maybe if you clear the Permanent DTCs there are no other DTC records in the PCM, unless you have Connectivity turned on and Ford keeps a log. Or maybe there is a super-secret master log in the PCM that can only be accessed with a tool not available to the public.

(This could be used to assess warranty claims, eg to see if an engine had been remapped/tuned.)

16 hours ago, Zeeb said:

I wonder if the 'FordPass Connect Modem' is separate from, or only a part of, the Telematic Control Unit.

I'm not sure.

 

16 hours ago, Zeeb said:

if I use Android Auto for navigation maybe it won't matter if the modem software is old (?)

It shouldn't matter for navigation, not having the up to date maps on your Sync system might. I believe that one of the TCU updates was supposed to help the Battery drain problem that some cars were having. I think that was before your car was built so you should be OK.

 

16 hours ago, Zeeb said:

I read there are such a thing as 'Permanent DTCs' on cars from the last 10 years - but these are clearable using a 'Universal Trip Drive Pattern'. They are to stop people cheating on emissions tests...

I had heard about that too. Some DTC's may be cleared with a scan tool but will only be permanently be cleared from the PCM after a number of clear driving cycles with specific driving conditions, a bit like the American IM Readiness tests that we don't have in the UK.

I'm not sure if there is a master log or if Ford can store them if you have connectivity settings enabled. If there is FORScan can't find them if they have cleared themselves or have been cleared

On 7/5/2022 at 6:52 AM, Tizer said:

I'm not sure if there is a master log or if Ford can store them if you have connectivity settings enabled. If there is FORScan can't find them if they have cleared themselves or have been cleared

I have been playing with Forscan live PID reading. Some discoveries...

1) I was happily surprised to find that Sport mode disables cylinder deactivation on my car. I think it was you who said your cylinder still deactivates in Sport on your 1.5L. Maybe it's my software version:

Quote

[Australian 1.5L petrol automatic, Jan 2021 build]
PCM - Powertrain Control Module
Part number: JX6A-12A650-BKB
Calibration level: JX6A-12A650-BKB
Strategy : KX7A-14C204-AVH
Hardware type: JX6A-12B684-LA

I couldn't get the cylinder to deactivate in Sport and then I noticed there is a PID:

Quote

CYL_DEAC_PRVT06         Drive Mode is Not Suitable for Cylinder Deactivation Operation

Sure enough when I put it in Sport mode this changes from 'No' to 'Yes', so this pretty much confirms it.
(This test might not work until you're in gear.)

2) Unplugging the cylinder deactivation solenoid only changes the state of these 3 PIDs:

Quote

CYL_1_SOL_OP_F    Open Ckt     Cylinder 1 Deactivation Solenoid Output Fault Status

CYL_1_SYSTEM_F    Failure Mode: Cylinder 1 Reactivated Because System Has Detected Intake And Exhaust Valves Lifting When Commanded Not to Lift     Cylinder 1 Deactivation System Failure Status

CYL_DEAC_PRVT15    Yes Fault     Cylinder Deactivation Fault is Preventing Cylinder Deactivation

3) Unplugging the solenoid only brings up 2 DTCs (and turns on check engine light):

Quote

===PCM DTC P3401:00-28===
Code: P3401 - Cylinder 1 Deactivation/Intake Valve Control Circuit / Open
Status:
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC
Module: Powertrain Control Module
===END PCM DTC P3401:00-28===


===OBDII DTC P3401-C===
Code: P3401 - Cylinder 1 Deactivation/Intake Valve Control Circuit / Open
Status:
 - Confirmed - malfunction is confirmed
Module: On Board Diagnostic II
===END OBDII DTC P3401-C===

Note that these 2 DTCs do not report a Freeze Frame (another unrelated DTC did), so there is no record of the date the solenoid was unplugged, how many times, or for how long. The DTC will not erase itself but it is easy to clear with Forscan or similar.

I doubt the PCM keeps a hidden permanent record of this, but as discussed, if the FordPass modem 'Connectivity' is switched on, it might upload these DTCs to Ford. I guess there is also a small possibility the modem/telematics module stores all DTCs from all modules even if you've cleared them and even if Connectivity is turned off...

but it doesn't matter to me because I will leave my CD solenoid plugged in now that I know Sport turns it off.

Was interesting to learn to use Forscan. For reference here are all the cylinder deactivation-related PIDs under PCM:

Thanks for posting your results, very interesting. FORScan is a great tool for playing around with and learning more about just how sophisticated modern cars are. 

13 hours ago, Zeeb said:

) I was happily surprised to find that Sport mode disables cylinder deactivation on my car. I think it was you who said your cylinder still deactivates in Sport on your 1.5L. Maybe it's my software version:

It was me and I think I may have made the mistake of monitoring the wrong PID, there are so many🤔, it may have been the commanded one rather than the commanded verses actual or one of the other ones and I double checked recently and you are correct, there is no actual Deactivation on my car in Sports Mode. My PCM was recently updated when I was having some unrelated warranty work done so possibly things have changed and I didn't make a mistake, I don't know.

My PCM does have different Hardware and Software numbers from your one and there could be lots of reasons for that as well as the build date.

13 hours ago, Zeeb said:

Unplugging the solenoid only brings up 2 DTCs (and turns on check engine light):

I think that most components are monitored for open and short circuits so that is probably why the check engine light came on. That can happen for lots of reasons so no one can with certainly accuse you of disconnecting the connector. It is obviously just an emission related one and it looks like it does not make the Engine go into Limp Mode.

I'm sure someone with enough knowledge like @unofix could fool the PCM not to recognise the Solenoid being unplugged, but I'm not sure if that would make the car hiccup before one of the other parameters disabled Deactivation or not. Its not worth the effort of trying unless someone is desperate. 

If you plan to keep your car post warranty then it is a good Idea to do some Live Monitoring of some of the engine parameters for reference in case something starts playing up in the future.  

You have great faith in my alleged abilities  @Tizer 🤣

One simple way to fool the PCM not to recognise that the solenoid has been unplugged is get a duplicate/spare solenoid and unplug the lead on the engine and plug it in to the spare. The PCM should be happy, it is still controlling a solenoid - just not the one fitted to the engine.

An alternative would be to accurately measure the resistance of the solenoid coil and then replace that with a fixed resistor of the same value. Care would need to be taken to ensure that the power rating of the resistor was high enough (perhaps 10W would do).

12 hours ago, Tizer said:

Thanks for posting your results, very interesting. FORScan is a great tool for playing around with and learning more about just how sophisticated modern cars are. 

It was me and I think I may have made the mistake of monitoring the wrong PID, there are so many🤔, it may have been the commanded one rather than the commanded verses actual or one of the other ones and I double checked recently and you are correct, there is no actual Deactivation on my car in Sports Mode. My PCM was recently updated when I was having some unrelated warranty work done so possibly things have changed and I didn't make a mistake, I don't know.

My PCM does have different Hardware and Software numbers from your one and there could be lots of reasons for that as well as the build date.

I think that most components are monitored for open and short circuits so that is probably why the check engine light came on. That can happen for lots of reasons so no one can with certainly accuse you of disconnecting the connector. It is obviously just an emission related one and it looks like it does not make the Engine go into Limp Mode.

...

If you plan to keep your car post warranty then it is a good Idea to do some Live Monitoring of some of the engine parameters for reference in case something starts playing up in the future.  

Yes it has been interesting and worthwhile. I also did some temperature logging which I might start a separate thread on.
 

I think maybe your PCM software update stopped deactivation in Sport mode, rather than you looking at the wrong PID...

I found that the 5 main cylinder deactivation PIDs on the graph were very correlated:

These are:
CYL_1_DEACT_CMD     Cylinder 1 is Commanded to Deactivate
CYL_1_DEACT_DC        Cylinder 1 Deactivation Solenoid Duty Cycle - Commanded
CYL_1_DSD_ACT          Cylinder 1 Deactivation - Desired And Actual States
CYL_1_OP_MODE         Cylinder 1 Deactivation System - Operational Mode
CYL_1_OP_STATE         Cylinder 1 Deactivation System - Operation State

The red line - Desired and Actual - has 4 states/levels from top to bottom:
- actually deactivated and desired
- actually deactivated - but not desired (transitioning)
- actually activated - but not desired (transitioning)
- actually activated and desired

The yellow line has lots of levels/states where it verifies things.

The purple line I don't quite understand - it has 3 levels from top to bottom:
- error (maybe transitioning or unknown)
- no fault - deactivation desired and 'detected'
- no fault - activation desired and 'detected'

... so 'detected' in the purple line is different from 'actual' in the other line. Not sure what 'detected' means but it happens a bit after 'actual'. Maybe it has to do with the difference between the solenoid state and the valve state.
 

But anyway, these 5 are all quite correlated, so if you saw one of them change in Sport then you likely didn't make a mistake. But I guess it's also possible you saw one of the other cylinder deactivation PIDs (CYL_DEAC_PRVT00  to  CYL_DEAC_PRVT17) which 'veto' cylinder deactivation, like RPM not suitable, voltage not suitable etc.

 

12 hours ago, Tizer said:

I'm sure someone with enough knowledge like @unofix could fool the PCM not to recognise the Solenoid being unplugged, but I'm not sure if that would make the car hiccup before one of the other parameters disabled Deactivation or not.

12 hours ago, unofix said:

One simple way to fool the PCM not to recognise that the solenoid...

Yes if you MacGyvered the solenoid plug like this somehow it might 'hiccup' 🙂 (spark or inject with a valve in the wrong position?) or maybe some other verification would stop that. After warranty I might look into this.

8 hours ago, Zeeb said:

Yes if you MacGyvered the solenoid plug like this somehow it might 'hiccup' 🙂 (spark or inject with a valve in the wrong position?) or maybe some other verification would stop that. After warranty I might look into this

I not suggesting that you actually do it, merely pointing out that it would fool the PCM. I don't believe that it would cause any physical damage to the engine, otherwise if a solenoid valve was to genuinely fail it would have similar results. I do think it very likely that the fuel injection to the 'deactivated' will remain off and so the engine will still not be running the same as when sports mode is selected.

24 minutes ago, unofix said:

I not suggesting that you actually do it, merely pointing out that it would fool the PCM. I don't believe that it would cause any physical damage to the engine, otherwise if a solenoid valve was to genuinely fail it would have similar results. I do think it very likely that the fuel injection to the 'deactivated' will remain off and so the engine will still not be running the same as when sports mode is selected.

I'm not sure in what order things happen in the transition phase but it I would worry that it may take a few cycles before the PCM realised that the Valves were not actually closed.

If it did cut the Fuel and/or Spark without the Valves bring closed  it would run very rough because you would not get the bounce effect from having the Valves closed all the time. 

4 hours ago, unofix said:

I not suggesting that you actually do it, merely pointing out that it would fool the PCM. I don't believe that it would cause any physical damage to the engine, otherwise if a solenoid valve was to genuinely fail it would have similar results. I do think it very likely that the fuel injection to the 'deactivated' will remain off and so the engine will still not be running the same as when sports mode is selected.

4 hours ago, Tizer said:

I'm not sure in what order things happen in the transition phase but it I would worry that it may take a few cycles before the PCM realised that the Valves were not actually closed.

If it did cut the Fuel and/or Spark without the Valves bring closed  it would run very rough because you would not get the bounce effect from having the Valves closed all the time. 

That makes sense, it might fail elegantly but I won't try it - it was exciting enough starting the engine without the solenoid plugged in 🙂

Yes the bounce/spring effect. I got a bit obsessed with cylinder deactivation after reading about problems with it with all the major manufacturers. I saw a youtube on a GM (I think) version where the guy said the vacuum spring effect tends to draw oil around the rings. But a mechanic on this forum said he's seen no evidence of this in Ecoboost engines. However there is a vibration issue confirmed on some of the 1.0L versions if I remember.

Mazda had a critical recall over it as well. But Mazda and VW are still developing it so they might have finally sorted it out. I think Ford has dropped it.

Hopefully it won't effect reliability on Fords, but there's prob an easy, elegant way of disabling it (which the rica.nl tuning company might utilise).