Ford S Max won't start - advice needed please before I have to drag it off to a garage.

 

Ford S Max 2011, 2.0 tdci, titanium with keyless start. 130k on the clock, solid and reliable so far 

 

Except it won't start now. Overnight it's gone from a runner to a non runner.

 

Tested and results so far:

 

- all fuses manually checked with multimeter, Ok

- starter fuse and relay tested and OK. I can hear the relay click when the ignition is pressed 

- clutch switch tested and OK

- battery checked and is holding a charge

- RAC have been out and confirmed no power to the starter, their diagnostic tool could also not read the system 

 

Went out for a normal trip, maybe 25 miles round. Parked overnight, attempted start the following day and it doesn't turn over at all.

 

I can hear a relay in the rear click, but nothing after that.

 

Any advice appreciated.

You need to use FORScan and check for DTC's.

It sounds like the PATS immobiliser is active.

7 minutes ago, unofix said:

FORScan : https://forscan.org/download.html

It's what many Ford owners use including some Ford technicians.

vLinker FS, cable for laptop: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vgate-vLinker-Adapter-FORScan-MS-CAN/dp/B0952P4MLP

vLinker FD, for android phone: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vgate-Bluetooth-vLinker-Scanner-Diagnostic/dp/B08H82WC8L

vLinker FD+, for iPhone: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vgate-Bluetooth-vLinker-Scanner-Diagnostic/dp/B08H8JHWP2

 

Thanks unofix. I would have thought the RAC dude would have found that with his snooper but he didn't seem to be able to read anything

Had a scanner delivered today so will have a crack at it.

If it’s pats the light will be on or warning message displayed. It could also be a communication problem stopping signals being sent. One clue being that the scan tool couldn’t communicate with the car at all. Though that could be a scan tool issue.

OBD2 fuse was blown. Shared with the battery backup sounder. Amazed I didn't find it before but there we go.

No DTC codes present. I have tested some of the parameters and can see the following:

- vehicle security access status is always DENIED

- clutch position only ever goes to 25%

- there are 2 clutch pedal position switch PIDs - one is always inactive, the other changes to active when I'm pressing the clutch 

- PATS is disabled

- starter motor relay status never changes from "off"

Any clues there?

 

Thanks again 

Try starting the car with both the clutch and brake pedals pressed and held down at the same time.

1 hour ago, unofix said:

Try starting the car with both the clutch and brake pedals pressed and held down at the same time.

Nope no change there, thanks for the suggestion though.

Wondering if it's the clutch switch, I understand there are 2 - 1 for the cruise control which is the 25% switch I saw on FORscan. The other is to prevent it being started in gear, during the testing I saw one of the PIDs didn't change when I pressed the clutch.

Any advice on how to check that? 

Cheers 

Difficult though it is to reach the switches on the clutch pedal, I think you need to be testing them with a multi-meter.

One of the clutch switches is used to detect when the pedal starts to get depressed and cuts the revs, ready for gear change. The other changes state when the clutch pedal is fully depressed and is used to allow the vehicle start relay to be come ready. The system uses the signals from both switches to confirm that the clutch is pressed before allowing the vehicles starter to operate.

Managed to get both switches out and test them, they're fine. The upper switch can be reached by disconnecting the lower clutch spring, it's tight but possible.

 

Had a couple of mechanics come and look at it yesterday. 4 hrs later and it was fixed, signal wire to the stop start box had come loose, it looks like it was twisted with 2 other wires, soldered and taped - from factory. The join is under the driver's side rear passenger footwell, blue wire.

Hi Duffmamj. I'm having this very same issue, and I've replaced both the clutch switches. The blue wire you talk about would that under the driver seat please ?

Thanks. 

On 1/19/2025 at 11:33 AM, Johno7153 said:

Hi Duffmamj. I'm having this very same issue, and I've replaced both the clutch switches. The blue wire you talk about would that under the driver seat please ?

Thanks. 

I'm having these symptoms. Where exactly is this blue wire.