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2010 Focus - Both side lamps not working!


AlexMack86
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Hi folks,

I'm banging my head against a brick wall on this one. The fact that both side lamps are out of commission suggests its a fault with something common to both circuits as I know the focus side lamp fuse systems are separated into left and right side. Bit of background info:

  • Both side lamps not working - timing of fault unkown
  • New bulbs installed - no fix
  • Checked fuses 124 & 125 - continuity good
  • Power cycled battery (disconnect neg pol, leave 15 mins) - no fix

Any ideas as to what else it could be? I've heard iterations of a faulty switch, and to test if there is 12VDC at the light fitting. Still to try the latter 

Any help / ideas appreciated. I'd like to explore all avenues before spending £££s at a garage.

Cheers,

Alex

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I was convinced I wrote on this earlier, is there another thread somewhere? I was wondering if you had checked the fuses with a multimeter or by looking? I'm guessing the former as you said you checked the continuity. If the bulbs are LED then remember they are polarity sensitive and may need flipping round. Do the tail lights come on when the side lights are meant to be on? Do the sidelights come on when dipped beam is on? I'm only mentioning basics in case you are looking too deeply and missed something, I don't mean to cause any offence


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Thank for reply Jonro,

...no offence taken whatsoever. I understand how common it is for these issues to be something distinctly obvious!

Yes I did post the same Q in another thread but thought better to start one independently based on my issue.

  • Fuses tested good with digital MM
  • The bulbs are halogen
  • I believe the tail lights are functioning but need to double check this (I know side lights and tails are all connected to the same fuse for left and right sides)
  • Side lights do not come on during dipped nor full beam 

Any more ideas?

Cheers,

Alex

 

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If the tail lights come on when side lights are selected that would rule out a switch problem, if they don't then it would more than likely be a switch problem. Did you manage to check if there was a current at the fitting? Another way to diagnose a switch fault would be to see if the instrument lights come on when side lights switched on. I would expect the side lights to come on with dipped beam though if it was switch problem. It's more likely to be a wiring issue I think.


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Stupid question I know but here goes .When you have the lights switched on have you actually measured with a multimeter to see if there is 12v at the bulb holder sockets/plugs seams very strange that the tail lights are on but not the front and both sides too. Tail lights on suggest that its not fuses as far as I know front and back (ether side)run of the same circuit could be wiring but both sides are separate. Is there a bit of loom where both front lights are in the loom that is common to both and perhaps a connecting plug  in the loom is loose .interesting problem let us know if you find the fault.

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The OP has not said if the tail lights do come on for sure but did say he will check. Also says he will check for a current at the bulb holder. It is an odd one isn't it? I'm running out of ideas as to the cause too. You're right left NS/OS and right NS/OS on separate circuits, could be a common point I'm not sure, I've not seen a wiring diagram, sounds very possible though.


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13 hours ago, AlexMack86 said:

Side lights do not come on during dipped nor full beam 

F103 supplies power to the light switch contact used for the side lights.

See if they work in the park position, as that uses a different contact on the light switch.

If the tail lights do work, the only common thing to the front lights that I can see is C96 on the passenger fusebox. (Tail lights go via C100).

The wiring diagram (I am assuming it is Mk2.5 Focus) is on this site:

In the extract below, the box in the bottom left is part of the passenger fusebox.

lights1.png

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Sorry folks!!! ...I'm an idiot

It's not the side lamps, but in fact both headlamps (dipped beam) ...Issue obviously remains .

Fuses are testing fine. Will check voltage supply at the fittings tonight. 

Does this throw up any immediate resolve to anyone?

Sorry again for ridiculous mistake ...you know when you're looking far too closely at something...

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Oh dear God lol [emoji23]

So same symptoms but it's the dipped beam. Both bulbs do not light up, do the side lights illuminate?


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So is it the side light bulbs you changed or the dipped?


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29 minutes ago, AlexMack86 said:

Sorry folks!!! ...I'm an idiot

laugh.png. Not necessarily, even the best do make idiotic mistakes sometimes, but ....unsure.pngbiggrin.png

In addition to Jon's query above, does the car have DTRLs, Autolamps, HIDs or just basic halogens? It makes quite a difference to the wiring details.

 

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I know it's an absolute SCHOOL BOY ERROR!!! ..let's just say my vision was clouded by external factors :blush:...

  • Lamps are standard Halogen H1 12V 55W
  • Side lamps are fine
  • Main beam are fine
  • Tails are fine
  • Fuses 142 and 143 testing fine (continuity tested using MM)

Am I right in thinking the next logical troubleshooting step would be to swap the dipped beam and main beam relays?

P.S. Thanks for all the help guys! ...and for bearing with me 

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Have you checked both bulbs are working? It is possible that a surge from one bulb blowing can in theory cause the other to do the same. Also, if the bulbs were fitted at the same time, as they should be then it is not impossible that they have both blown together. After ruling out blown bulbs then the sensible thing would be to check the relays.

One more question, you say the main beam work. Does that mean they flash when you pull he stalk or they come on and stay on when you push the stalk with the switch on dipped beam?


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They work to flash and on continuous.

 

Regards the bulb change, these are both brand new bulbs which I installed simultaneously myself just the other day thinking both bulbs had just blown together. 

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Ok, so that's a number of things ruled out. The next thing I would do is check/replace the relay. With the lights turned on try tapping the relay with the handle of a screwdriver, if the lights flicker at all then that would confirm it was the relay. Also, check the earthing point as it could be corroded


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1 hour ago, AlexMack86 said:

Am I right in thinking the next logical troubleshooting step would be to swap the dipped beam and main beam relays?

Yes, easy test.

If the relay is ok, then F115 supplies power, via the light switch to the headlamp relay.

Also there is a GEM test that can be used to test the light switch:

"Press and hold in the rear demister button while turning ignition to the run position, and you will get a tone.

Once activated the test mode will sound a tone when any switch or lever is triggered.

Open each door in turn, bonnet, boot, wiper, indicators etc and a tone will sound/hazard lights will flash which will make it easier to pin down any faults."

The GEM (aka BCM) actually turns the relay on. The light switch is an input into the GEM, not directly connected to the relay.

 

 

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Didn't know about that little trick Peter, I've done that via forscan but didn't know you could do it without


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Wow, great fault finding tips guys.

ill try all the above and revert with findings tomorrow. 

Again thanks so much, I really do appreciate the efforts / input! 

Alex

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I think we all have a vested interest now, it's almost 'our' problem lol


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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi guys,

Apologies for the silence, I've been offshore for the past month.

So looks like both my main and dipped beam lights are working OK now (I think - see 1st Q below), only side lights which aren't. However my issue remains in that the lighting on the road when driving at night is totally insufficient (I mean I literally have to slow to 20mph when another vehicle is oncoming and I'm on dipped beam and I have 20/20 vision). Surely the side lights don't provide that much extra light!? Anyway I tried the screwdriver tapping on the relays in the engine fuse box and hitting one of them turned one of the side lights on, needless to say I'll be replacing said relay ..just need to figure out which one it was. So a couple of questions:

  • When using dipped beam lights, should both (main and dipped) lamps be illuminated? ...or just the dipped lamps closes to the badge/grill?
  • Is there a list of relays for 2010 ford focus anywhere? My manual doesn't disclose relay details and the underside of the box lid is no use either
  • Could it be that I need to replace the battery? I've noticed the lights dim when I turn on the windscreen heater. Is this a sign that there's insufficient current available due to battery depletion? (it is 7 years old!)

Thanks again for any input folks, and apologies in advance for my ignorance (I'm an engineer but just not car savvy!). Can't believe how difficult this is to resolve!

Alex

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When you turn your heater on and the lights dim do they return to their previous light output or remain dimmer? If it's the latter then the battery could be at fault or possibly the alternator. If you have your lights on and park facing a wall is the cut off at a good level or to low? While it's facing the wall with the lights on, after dark, try revving the engine and see if the light output increases fractionally then drops again. That should indicate if the alternator is good or not.

When dipped beam is turned on then the main beam should not be illuminated at all. With dipped beam you should have sidelights and dipped beam illuminated. Main beam only illuminates when they are selected.


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4 hours ago, AlexMack86 said:

When using dipped beam lights, should both (main and dipped) lamps be illuminated?

That sounds like an earth problem. It could be a bad earth, either in one headlight from the dipped beam bulb case, or between headlight and the body. In that case there is a path, via the main beam bulb in the defective lamp, through the wiring, through the main beam bulb in the other lamp, and to earth there. So one dipped beam bulb would be poor, and both main beam bulbs would light rather dimly.

As Jon says, main beam bulbs should not be on with dipped.

There will always be some voltage drop with a heavy load like the screen heater, just in the wiring. A voltmeter on the battery would assist. Normal charge voltage is about 14.2 to 14.4v. I think the alternator should be able to maintain over 13.5v at the battery with normal driving rpm and the heater & headlights on. And over 14v with just headlights on.

The real test on the battery is with engine not running. If bad, it will fade away quickly with that load. If good, it will still drop, but not much below 11v, at least for a minute or so.

I have not found a decent list of relay locations yet, at least not for the Passenger fusebox. My engine fusebox has a diagram in the lid, that I can tie up with the wiring diagram. (Photos below, I had trouble lighting the faint lines on shiny plastic.)

I do not think there is any relay in the sidelight circuit. They all seem to be powered directly from the light switch, according to the drawing.

EJB-ID0.JPG

EJB-ID1.JPG

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On 20/03/2017 at 1:49 PM, Jonro2009 said:

When you turn your heater on and the lights dim do they return to their previous light output or remain dimmer? If it's the latter then the battery could be at fault or possibly the alternator. If you have your lights on and park facing a wall is the cut off at a good level or to low? While it's facing the wall with the lights on, after dark, try revving the engine and see if the light output increases fractionally then drops again. That should indicate if the alternator is good or not.

When dipped beam is turned on then the main beam should not be illuminated at all. With dipped beam you should have sidelights and dipped beam illuminated. Main beam only illuminates when they are selected.


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Both of these are true in my case.

When I turn the windscreen heater on, lights dim, and when the heater turns off automatically they return to the previous brightness (which is still dim).

I've noticed when in traffic (in the reflection of the car in front's paintwork) the lights brightness increases when revving / accelerating to move froward, then return to previous dimness.

Is this likely to be the alternator then?...

Appreciate the photos Peter, I'll do some battery voltage tests under the scenarios you mentioned. 

Cheers

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  • 8 months later...

Hi guys.

Need to re-visit this as I'm still in the same situation! ...any tech support greatly appreciated.

Just to summarise the issue:

  • All my lights are operational
  • Main beam and side lights are sufficiently bright
  • Dipped headlights are DANGEROUSLY dim - i.e. can't see

Since previous correspondence I have replaced the battery, problem still persists. Also tried tapping the relay block but this didn't appear to affect the lights (no flicker). I tested the voltage at the bulb fixing and reading 12.4VDC so all good right? 

Does anyone know where in the chassis the earth points are for the dipped headlights?

Do the dipped headlights share a common earth?

Thanks in advance for input.

Alex

 

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...I've just checked the wiring / loop diagrams and found the headlamps DO NOT share a common earth - ruling out a dirty / corroded earth or earth "leak" as the issue.

The fault is common to both lamps so it must be a common component further up the supply channel. Perhaps it's time to accept defeat and hand the car over to the professionals. My only issue with that is they'll likely charge me for hours of diagnostics as well as the hefty repair cost...regardless of how simple a repair it is  :wallbash: ...the classic "old man and his hammer" fable where he charges 10p for the hammer tapping service, and £99999 for "knowing where to tap"

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