Ford Focus Ecoboost 2012

[flashluther]

Hi Everyone,

I've been driving this car just over a year or so with a very occasional tin/metallic sound coming from somewhere underneath the engine area. I had it looked at by two different garages that could never work out what was wrong.

I pulled up onto my driveway a few days ago and looked underneath the car after it once again made the mysterious noise. There was oil pouring out.

I've taken it to a local garage who had a quick look before the bank holiday and said it's the gear box. Been quoted £900 - £1000 to fix.

I have no idea if this is accurate or not. In fact I couldn't tell you where a gear box is. I really have no idea.

Does this look and sound about right? 

[RayC333]

The position identified in the photo is bottom dead centre of the flange joint between the engine and the gearbox bell housing. oil should not be leaking here and indicates that either the gearbox drive shaft seal or engine crankshaft rear seal is leaking.

Your garage will have already identified whether the oil is engine or gearbox oil and, taking into account the metallic noise, I suspect the gearbox drive shaft bearing is failing.

The gearbox will need to be removed, repaired and replaced. Bearing in mind this will require new parts and a few hours labour, the quote does not seem excessive.

Also suggest it may be a good opportunity to replace the clutch parts while the gearbox is removed. Nb. They may be contaminated with the oil anyway.

[isetta]

I don’t know what efforts have been made to identify the fluid but leaking clutch slave cylinder (inside the bell housing) could also show up in same place.  Lower brake fluid level might be a clue if it is that (I think these cars take fluid for clutch cylinder from the same reservoir as brake fluid but I’m not 100% certain)

[flashluther]

11 minutes ago, isetta said:

I don’t know what efforts have been made to identify the fluid but leaking clutch slave cylinder (inside the bell housing) could also show up in same place.  Lower brake fluid level might be a clue if it is that (I think these cars take fluid for clutch cylinder from the same reservoir as brake fluid but I’m not 100% certain)

Thanks. I did check the brake fluid level and it seemed alright. The oil in the engine was extremely low.

[isetta]

But if it’s the gearbox where the fault is, the low engine oil is something totally different. It might be gearbox oil leaking from the gearbox input shaft. But so far there is no way we can confirm or deny the gearbox being the problem.   If it was mine I would check the gearbox oil level.  Hard to be sure from picture but it does not look too bad. Might be very slight gradual weep over long period of time.  Might be possible to live with it rather than spend loads of money.  Nothing so far suggests to me this has anything to do with the noise you were investigating. I note you say oil pouring out.  How many seconds between each drip on to the ground? 

[flashluther]

5 minutes ago, isetta said:

But if it’s the gearbox where the fault is, the low engine oil is something totally different. It might be gearbox oil leaking from the gearbox input shaft. But so far there is no way we can confirm or deny the gearbox being the problem.   If it was mine I would check the gearbox oil level.  Hard to be sure from picture but it does not look too bad. Might be very slight gradual weep over long period of time.  Might be possible to live with it rather than spend loads of money.  Nothing so far suggests to me this has anything to do with the noise you were investigating. I note you say oil pouring out.  How many seconds between each drip on to the ground? 

The oil was literally pouring like a tap. Before all of this as I turned the corner I heard the same sound I've heard before but it seemed slightly more prolonged. I think it timed with the changing gear as I took a corner. Once I was in the drive the leak was pouring - enough to throw a towel down to try and stop it running everywhere.

[TomsFocus]

Might just be the lighting but that oil looks pretty dark and manky for gearbox oil.  Does look more like engine oil from here.

Honest answer is you need to do some more physical investigation for an accurate diagnosis.  Gear oil can't be easily drained on this gearbox but that's really the next step.  To measure how much is in there and see if it's full of metal swarf.  

Also, I've spent a couple of minutes on paint to show you the divide between the engine and gearbox, if that helps for future reference.  

[RayC333]

''The oil was literally pouring like a tap. Before all of this as I turned the corner I heard the same sound I've heard before but it seemed slightly more prolonged. I think it timed with the changing gear as I took a corner. Once I was in the drive the leak was pouring - enough to throw a towel down to try and stop it running everywhere''.

John, wherever the oil is leaking I think it would unwise to drive the car any further. Even if the noise is unrelated to the gearbox, the gearbox assembly will still need to be removed to replace the affected part(s).

I'm assuming you won't be removing the gearbox yourself; the garage quote seems reasonable to me but you could always get another if not confident with it. 

[flashluther]

Hi everyone.

Thank you so much for your help and support here. It is extremely helpful.

The garage have got back to me with their findings so far. Apparently the gear box has a crack and the clutch will also need replacing. 

They've sent over some photos for me.

Would the clutch need replacing and a new gear box?

Edited April 20, 2022 by flashluther
Gear box has crack not the clutch

[TomsFocus]

Well that clutch definitely needs replacing!  That'll be the metallic rattle you were hearing.  Did it feel odd at all through the clutch pedal?

Can't really see the crack in the gearbox but it sounds like one of the missing clutch fingers got wedged in there and damaged it.  So yes, replacement gearbox needed too.

 

[flashluther]

3 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Well that clutch definitely needs replacing!  That'll be the metallic rattle you were hearing.  Did it feel odd at all through the clutch pedal?

Can't really see the crack in the gearbox but it sounds like one of the missing clutch fingers got wedged in there and damaged it.  So yes, replacement gearbox needed too.

 

The clutch never gave me any bother at all. I've managed to drive the vehicle over a year with the very ocassional rattle metallic sound that eventually went away until just recently. 

So the overall concensus is this isn't good but not the end of the world.

 

Is it likely they would weld the crack?

[TomsFocus]

4 minutes ago, flashluther said:

The clutch never gave me any bother at all. I've managed to drive the vehicle over a year with the very ocassional rattle metallic sound that eventually went away until just recently. 

So the overall concensus is this isn't good but not the end of the world.

 

Is it likely they would weld the crack?

The gearbox casing is aluminium so it's not easy to weld.  Replacement used gearbox will be the quickest and easiest way to go.  (Cheapest labour).

Technically they could replace the casing but it's not worth the hassle and cost to do that.

[flashluther]

It's gone from bad to worse.

Spoke to the garage today and I've been told the following needs doing..

Gearbox repair

New clutch

New flywheel

Total £1700

[TomsFocus]

52 minutes ago, flashluther said:

It's gone from bad to worse.

Spoke to the garage today and I've been told the following needs doing..

Gearbox repair

New clutch

New flywheel

Total £1700

Are they sending the gearbox away for repair then?  That quote is around what I'd I'd expect though.

Clutch kit - £300

DMF - £350

Used gearbox - £300

6 hours labour - £600

 

Have the wetbelts been replaced on your car yet?  If not, I'd carefully consider whether it's worth the cost to repair the clutch & gearbox or whether it's better to cut your losses and change car.

[flashluther]

48 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Are they sending the gearbox away for repair then?  That quote is around what I'd I'd expect though.

Clutch kit - £300

DMF - £350

Used gearbox - £300

6 hours labour - £600

 

Have the wetbelts been replaced on your car yet?  If not, I'd carefully consider whether it's worth the cost to repair the clutch & gearbox or whether it's better to cut your losses and change car.

From what I understand the gearbox is going to someone else for repair. I asked if it would be a new gearbox and he said no it will be repaired.

As far as I know the wetbelts haven't been replaced. I think I'll just go with it and hopefully it lasts a few more years. 

[TomsFocus]

Sounds like it's going to a transmission refurbishers then.  Bit more expensive than a used box but should come with a warranty.  Brand new gearbox would have been in the thousands!

The wetbelt on the 1.0EB is recommended at 10 years and we do see plenty snap on here!  If that fails you'll have another big bill to replace the engine.  But it also costs near £1000 to replace the belt now, hence considering whether repair is really worth it on this car.

[flashluther]

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Sounds like it's going to a transmission refurbishers then.  Bit more expensive than a used box but should come with a warranty.  Brand new gearbox would have been in the thousands!

The wetbelt on the 1.0EB is recommended at 10 years and we do see plenty snap on here!  If that fails you'll have another big bill to replace the engine.  But it also costs near £1000 to replace the belt now, hence considering whether repair is really worth it on this car.

Thanks Tom. I'll ask about the warranty. I did ask whether it would be a new gearbox and he said no that would be 2k plus. 

Difficult to say but do you think I could end up with a similar problem in the future because it's refurbished and not new?

[TomsFocus]

4 hours ago, flashluther said:

Thanks Tom. I'll ask about the warranty. I did ask whether it would be a new gearbox and he said no that would be 2k plus. 

Difficult to say but do you think I could end up with a similar problem in the future because it's refurbished and not new?

Your gearbox was only damaged by the broken clutch as far as we can tell.*  I'm fairly certain you won't have the same issue again.  In fact, I've never seen a clutch fall apart like that on an EcoBoost before, so can only assume you were very unlucky with that.  (Have seen it once or twice on other cars, but it's really not common.)

I can only really guess at the work the refurbishers will carry out.  But they should be checking all parts for damage or excess wear, and replacing anything suspect.  So you shouldn't have any problems with it, but hopefully it'll be covered under warranty anyway.

 

*Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but if the clutch rattle had been diagnosed sooner, the gearbox may not have been damaged at all.

[JW1982]

This is a well known issue on vehicles with the Ford/Getrag B6 gearbox. Was this car affected by the 18S07 recall ?

18S07 - CLUTCH PRESSURE PLATE CRACKS

This recall was introduced for safety reasons. Parts of the cracked pressure plate can damage the gearbox housing which causes an oil leak. The oil can be ignited by the hot exhaust and set the vehicle on fire.

The recall consists of installing torque limiting software on vehicles with start/stop and clutch replacement on vehicles without start/stop. 

If the recall is still open or performed in the past there is a chance that a warranty repair is applicable. I recommend to have this investigated at a Ford dealer before paying for the repair yourself.

 

 

[flashluther]

3 hours ago, JW1982 said:

This is a well known issue on vehicles with the Ford/Getrag B6 gearbox. Was this car affected by the 18S07 recall ?

18S07 - CLUTCH PRESSURE PLATE CRACKS

This recall was introduced for safety reasons. Parts of the cracked pressure plate can damage the gearbox housing which causes an oil leak. The oil can be ignited by the hot exhaust and set the vehicle on fire.

The recall consists of installing torque limiting software on vehicles with start/stop and clutch replacement on vehicles without start/stop. 

If the recall is still open or performed in the past there is a chance that a warranty repair is applicable. I recommend to have this investigated at a Ford dealer before paying for the repair yourself.

 

 

I didn't even think of this. The vehicle was recalled after I brought it from the garage. I had to return it because of the recall then it was given back to me.

The car is a start/stop.

[flashluther]

Just collect the car from the garage.

£1700 out of pocket now but pleased to have my car back.

The clutch seems a lot lower than it was previously.

They kept the clutch to the side so I could see the damage and it looks in a bad way. I'm kind of amazed I managed to drive it for so long.

[unofix]

First picture I've seen of an Ecoboom clutch, it looks in a bad way

[StephenFord]

1 hour ago, unofix said:

.. it looks in a bad way

Always the master of the understatement 🤣

[TomsFocus]

2 hours ago, flashluther said:

Just collect the car from the garage.

£1700 out of pocket now but pleased to have my car back.

The clutch seems a lot lower than it was previously.

They kept the clutch to the side so I could see the damage and it looks in a bad way. I'm kind of amazed I managed to drive it for so long.

Thanks for letting us know the outcome.

I'd completely forgotten about the clutch recall as it was a while ago now.  

I wonder if it's worth contacting Ford, explaining your situation, and they may offer sone goodwill towards it.  They don't have to, bit you don't know if you don't ask.

[flashluther]

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Thanks for letting us know the outcome.

I'd completely forgotten about the clutch recall as it was a while ago now.  

I wonder if it's worth contacting Ford, explaining your situation, and they may offer sone goodwill towards it.  They don't have to, bit you don't know if you don't ask.

Thanks Tom. I've just emailed Ford. It is a long shot but I'll let you know if they do offer a goodwill gesture.

Thanks everyone. You're all amazing here.