PCM  power control module?  Is that diff to the ECU??

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

As for regen, Forscan may be able to tell you when the last regen was attempted.  Not sure if it can on this engine or not.

 

If the Engine is the later Euro V one then FORScan will not be able to tell you when the last Regen was done. It can tell if one is being attempted though if you Live Monitor the correct parameters.

@ukmartian, the PCM and ECU are the same thing.

It's a 2010 1.6 tdci 110 hp

We are going to try forscan, we have the cables etc if anyone could suggest where and what we need to look for it would help my son is pretty good at this sort of thing..unfortunately I am a old time mech  all I ever needed  was a socket set screw drivers and a big hammer. With that you could change a engine in a day lol

Thank for all the help and advice

Yes, PCM is the engine ECU.  Technically every 'module' on the car is an ECU.  When fuel injection first came out there was only one module, so that could be called an ECU without confusion.  But even on a Mk2 Focus you're looking at about 8 modules on basic models, and up to 20 on top spec with every option ticked.  So we have to differentiate between them now.  Ford call them a PCM, other manufacturers use other acronyms.

First thing to try on Forscan is a global scan of all modules - very simple and intuitive.

Bit frustrating that previous regens don't show on your model.  If you can keep Forscan in the car, you could pull over when it smokes, don't switch the engine off, then plug in and see if it's attempting a regen at that point.  You can also monitor the DPF temperatures.  However, if the cat was also smashed out of yours then temps won't increase as much as we'd expect.  (DPF and cat are separate cores within the same canister but some people smash out both of them).

Edit - Just to confirm, yours is a Euro 5 engine in 2010.  Earlier Mk2's had a different DPF setup & mapping for the older emissions regulations.

Many thanks It's great that so many people are helping on the forum, I worry that I may be being a pest, but without the info I would be stuck...so far I can completely rule out  everything from the air filter to the throttle body it's all new. I have not as yet changed any sensors..I have identified several clues to date

Engine will smoke excessively with black smoke

Fan may come on

Turn off the car wait a few minutes and may then be ok

Rev counter will fluctuate between 500- 1200 before settling at idle after reving

Does not burn oil

Not sludge in water or oil

No leaks round injectors

No smoke on start up

Next thing is as suggested forscan and see what I can find from that.

Many thanks for all the help.given so far, it is very appreciated.

Ps I am not a mech just a diy'er who can use a spanner..lol

 

39 minutes ago, ukmartian said:

Next thing is as suggested forscan and see what I can find from that.

FORScan (for windows laptop version 2.3.55): https://forscan.org/download.html

Connecting cable - vLinker FS: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vgate-vLinker-Adapter-FORScan-MS-CAN/dp/B0952P4MLP

@ukmartian, it is very difficult to do meaningful diagnosis on a car when the DPF, EGR and PCM have been butchered but here are some pointers that you would normally do for an unaltered car.

Here is a link to the official FORScan page that tells you how to use it. It looks complicated but makes more sense when you have FORScan set up in front of you.   https://forscan.org/documentation.html

After connecting up and doing an initial scan, take screenshots of any faults, clear them and run the car to see if any come back.

After that or in between you can do a Key On Engine Off, and a Key On Engine Running test of the PCM.

If you want to know if the Fan is running and the car is smoking because the car is trying to do a Regeneration then go into Live Data and monitor the Throttle Valve, on that car it is called EGR_TV. It should be steady between 80 and 100% normally except for a second or two when taking your foot off the Accelerator, such as changing gear. 

If a Regeneration is being attempted the the Valve will close to about 25% and be steady there until Regeneration has been cancelled by the PCM. 

You can also monitor the Temperatures, I can't remember if that Engine has a Cylinder Head Temperature sensor as well.

The other important things to Live Monitor are the MAF, MAP and Fuel Rail Pressure. The figures are a bit meaningless unless they are done with the car being driven rather than just revving it stationary.     

45 minutes ago, unofix said:

FORScan (for windows laptop version 2.3.55): https://forscan.org/download.html

Connecting cable - vLinker FS: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vgate-vLinker-Adapter-FORScan-MS-CAN/dp/B0952P4MLP

I have these already my son is not scared to use it but like me not experienced but has the applitude to work things out, you are correct about the dpf being butchered a cowboy done that and blew the ecu somehow, I blanked the egr fed up of constant emls every week and was so sluggish 0-60 with 2 weeks notice,

Now debating getting another pre 2009 car no DPF can't afford to throw much more at it .

More testing today with forescan only fault we found was bad earth on indicator repeater so not relevant to my probs...out of interest for attempted a static regen..forescan warmed the engine up and then increased the RPM to 1500 and reported it was doing the cat plenty of whitish grey smoke and a strong smell of hot fuel...after that it reported it could not do a regen and gave a list of reasons we didn't think we're a issue.  We then checked the injector codes for the injectors physically to what forescan reported, nothing matched up, see attached photo  whether this could have any influence I am not sure. Tomorrow I am going to remove the EGR and check the blanking plate is still secure along with the pipes...If we were to need to recode the injector numbers is it just a case off changing the values in the forescan boxes ?

Injector codes being different does make sense if you've had a replacement PCM.

Yes, coding them really is as simple as typing into the box. 

If the EGR was mapped out then a blanking plate shouldn't make any difference.

Very odd that you don't have any PCM fault codes.

My original ecu was apparently destroyed by the butcher, he replaced it with another one from a older and more basic car which didn't have cruise control.when I got it back everything worked keys etc mileage except cruise control and the fact he did not delete the DPF so it cost me to get it coded  by someone else...i had no issues except lower mpg .but I managed to source a correct virginised ecu which was fitted and the data cloned to that one ..we did notice when we removed the botched up ecu it had been opened in one corner and resealed with white mastic..i theorise that he could not properly transfer all data from my old one to his replacement so the donor ecu retained old codes which my other mech transferred to my new correct one...so we will change the codes from injectors onto forscan  and see what happens..perhaps there are other probs on there as well.....whether that is the smoke issue we will find out even though it was ok for 3-4 months .

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Very odd that you don't have any PCM fault codes.

Does that suggest a mech reason ??

Was going to check EGR  to.ensure no air leaks from hose and flange as been off more times than I can guess

11 hours ago, ukmartian said:

Does that suggest a mech reason ??

Was going to check EGR  to.ensure no air leaks from hose and flange as been off more times than I can guess

Potentially mechanical, but also potentially the PCM isn't programmed to pick up all the sensors we'd expect it to on this engine.  As Tizer said, it's a difficult one to diagnose with so much alteration from standard.  

I'd still recommend a visual check of the PCM plugs if you haven't done that lately.  They may have got damp and corroded over the past few months since the PCM was fitted.  (Though I would expect to see some codes for that).

Yes, you're right, a leaking pipe on the intake side of an EGR blank would cause a loss of boost, so that is worth checking.

 

Not only did I fit a new pcm/ecu but replaced the who enclosure and sealed it with silicone  but the car is due a mot so the garage is going to check the map he also said not to touch the injector coding it should only be done with new injectors but he is going to do a leak through test on them first.. We will get there eventually...

Thanks

 

Hi, no update as had a mishap.so not been doing much, I removed EGR and checked its fixing etc, I found the engine side gasket had split so replaced it also replaced the bolts as rounded off so can now tell if properly tightened every put back together with a near of sealant and tightened, was told a bad injector may sound different so started it very little smoke on start up or when reved sounded injectors now miserable difference in noise between them, is it possible that a sensor could be playing up even though no codes there are 2 on the throttle body , 1on the air filter box , and I believe there could be a temp sensor somewhere, perhaps next job....but MOT is booked for next week as well....this car is now a vendetta lol, can't give up now. Thanks  

It's possible a sensor could be giving the wrong readings but still within an acceptable range for the PCM.

If you want to test sensors, use live data on Forscan.  Watching a graph of MAF and MAP would be a good start.  Not too bothered about the actual figures but you want to see that the MAF & MAP rise and fall pretty close to together over a short drive.

However, I don't think a sensor fault would cause the intermittent issues that you're getting.

Running out off options, only thing left is the injectors I think don't think it's a engine component due to the intermittent nature plus if you turn off and start again it stops...garage is going to do a leak through test and also recheck the map...

PS could a drained battery cause a issues with the ECU poss corrupted something?? when I started it just before the issue started I pressed button and all went dead had to use my jump starter. .

2 hours ago, ukmartian said:

Running out off options, only thing left is the injectors I think don't think it's a engine component due to the intermittent nature plus if you turn off and start again it stops...garage is going to do a leak through test and also recheck the map...

PS could a drained battery cause a issues with the ECU poss corrupted something?? when I started it just before the issue started I pressed button and all went dead had to use my jump starter. .

Low battery won't damage the PCM.  Jump starting could spike the PCM but it's very rare and would usually blow the PCM fuse if so.  (Welding can also spike a PCM)

I still think it's a map issue personally.  Although we talk about a remap as a singular thing, there are many maps on the PCM, it only takes one to have been written slightly wrong to cause an intermittent fault.

4 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Low battery won't damage the PCM.  Jump starting could spike the PCM but it's very rare and would usually blow the PCM fuse if so.  (Welding can also spike a PCM)

I still think it's a map issue personally.  Although we talk about a remap as a singular thing, there are many maps on the PCM, it only takes one to have been written slightly wrong to cause an intermittent fault.

Thanks, Tom it's in. On Tuesday checkover and MOT...finished putting it back together today, started it, not a puff of smoke let it tick over for 10mins then hard rev again not a puff of smoke, checked the oil and found slightly overfilled by just over ¼ lt so drained it out will check it again tomorrow after been sitting, just gotta clean it and get engine tray on now and that's about all I can do..Thanks for all the help and advice

 

2 hours ago, ukmartian said:

it's in. On Tuesday checkover and MOT.

In case you don't know the Emissions Test of Diesels is now the Plate Value and for your car it is a quite onerous 0.54 from memory instead of the default 1.50. The Plate Value is on the bottom of the VIN Plate.

The legislation may have changed since the last time I checked but if the Plate Value is not visible to the Tester then they must Test as Presented, i.e. use the default value instead.

I have heard that some people have removed the Plate Value before testing.

It is worth noting that if the car fails on the Plate Value and is subsequently presented for a retest with the Plate Value removed then it is retested to the Plate Value that it failed on, not the default.

This all assumes that the rules are still the same as they were the last time I checked.

I am afraid that us something I don't understand lol

13 hours ago, Tizer said:

In case you don't know the Emissions Test of Diesels is now the Plate Value and for your car it is a quite onerous 0.54 from memory instead of the default 1.50. The Plate Value is on the bottom of the VIN Plate.

The legislation may have changed since the last time I checked but if the Plate Value is not visible to the Tester then they must Test as Presented, i.e. use the default value instead.

I have heard that some people have removed the Plate Value before testing.

It is worth noting that if the car fails on the Plate Value and is subsequently presented for a retest with the Plate Value removed then it is retested to the Plate Value that it failed on, not the default.

This all assumes that the rules are still the same as they were the last time I checked.

As far as I understand, the tester in this case is also the person who remapped the car and deleted the DPF...so I would assume he's not going to fail it on smoke test!  

Edited August 26, 20232 yr by TomsFocus

11 hours ago, ukmartian said:

I am afraid that us something I don't understand lol

Basically, a DPF delete or any sort of emissions device tampering has been an MOT fail since 2018.

As well as a visual look for any signs of cut & weld around the DPF and checks for EGR blanked or removed, the smoke test became much more strict that year.  Without a DPF fitted on a Euro5 model, it's unlikely to pass that smoke test.

I assume your tester is choosing to pass cars like this, otherwise he wouldn't be removing DPF's for customers.

He didn't, besides unless you dismantle the car it will be extremely hard to use anything...all he done is correct the other persons errors...beside if it fails I will stick a cheap DPF on it and flog it  .

13 minutes ago, ukmartian said:

He didn't, besides unless you dismantle the car it will be extremely hard to use anything...all he done is correct the other persons errors...beside if it fails I will stick a cheap DPF on it and flog it  .

Correct their errors?  He must know the DPF was mapped out?

You are right that on the 1.6TDCI it's difficult to see any tampering.  My old one eventually failed on smoke levels above specified limits.  (Long after I'd sold it!)