At this stage I think it is probably fair to say your battery is damaged and will never fully recover. To stand any chance of getting it back in to a serviceable condition you are going to need to charge it for a full 24 hours regardless of what the battery charger may indicate. [See battery SOC table]

For Ford vehicles built 2013 onwards, the use of the old style ELM327 lead is not recommended and can lead to either some Ford specific codes being missed or some modules not being read. You should be using the vLinker FS cable on your car.

Hi, also worth checking that 15 amp fuse hasn't blown again...🤔

If battery charge/voltage appears acceptable yet there still appears to be a problem then, as always said, over 4 years you are well into borrowed time and (personally) I suspect the capacity of the battery is poor (can be tested but would need to actually discharge it using a bulb and measuring current over time to give capacity (or just get it tested although that doesn't normally include capacity)

Need to be certain about battery integrity otherwise it will mask any future diagnosis efforts.
You have had some difficulty accessing PCM but it may yet be a wiring fault needing confirmation.

Plus as @nicam49 says, need to revisit any and all previous faults - you can't assume they are cured...yet?

2 hours ago, Shearers said:

Need to be certain about battery integrity

"It's dead, Jim !!" 🤣 If after charging it's still not getting 12.40V then it's gone to the big scrapyard in the sky.

2 hours ago, Shearers said:

You have had some difficulty accessing PCM but it may yet be a wiring fault

The OP is using the old ELM327 cable, this is probably causing the problem of reading the PCM.

There is no point in flogging a dead horse, your Battery badly needs replaced as others have said.

Your Body Control Module, BCM, (sometimes called GEM) is not showing up when you connect to the car, so either it has a serious fault or has completely died or the Lead you are using is not up to the Job.

There are no Tests of the Modules you can do other than the Self Tests of each Module and obviously you can't check the BCM. 

Thank you all again for your help with this.

 

Yes I figured the Battery to be gone but thought it may just have died due to the Car having been parking and tried to give it a good charge.

I just spent £90 on a Ctek charger which also has a recon mode as I needed to get a new charger anyway so tried my luck.

I will stick in on charge again and leave it for 24hrs as advised and if I can get the Car running again will I go to replace the Battery.

I bought the newer version of the lead from Amazon which should be here tomorrow, thank you.

I will now try to test the starter and check that 15a fuse again.

Thank you all for all the help and support 🙏🏽😁

I checked the fuse which is still fine, put battery on charge and leaving on charge.

Jacked the car up and managed to get a reading of power going to starter which showed power going to it.

Tried running a cable from the ignition solenoid and then touched the positive on the battery, got some tiny sparks but then nothing happends ?

I used a small crocodile lead to connect to the starter ignition connection and the other end to a jump lead and then touched the other side of the jump lead to the 12v on the battery with just a few small sparks at the battery connection then nothing happends.

There were 3 connections on the starter, 2 big 1 small. I used the multimeter on both big connections and got a 12v reading.

Connected the crocodile clip to the 3rd small connection and put 12v power to it with no response.

I pressed the start button (dash lights on) and gear in neutral before I touched the lead onto the Battery but still no response.

Is that the correct way of accessing the ignition connection the way I have or is my starter broken ?

 

Thanks again 🙏

12V on small connection (I'd have a 10 A fuse in that lead there somewhere in case of an accidental dead short) should trigger the solenoid with a decent click.

If you have headlights on during that test  and they dim at least it looks like starter MAY be trying BUT then we're back to the battery again (cos if the starter is working it takes a LOT of current)

If they don't dim then likely starter isn't working?
Unsure how you have "12V" on both heavy connections (from battery, yes as this should always be there) but the other should only have 12V if solenoid is triggered and then main motor should fire up - however we all suspect the battery is U/S and likely cannot provide the current to be sure about starter.
SO...New battery, test starter again to clear that one up, then go from there with your better EOBD lead and see what Forscan can detect (whilst keeping an eye on everything that has gone before)?

We all seem to be talking from the same song sheet (and, Guys,  I KNOW your views on batteries i.e. just change them but, being a tight wad I try to eke out the life of any part before changing it and only if I have information to back it up. You may, or not, be proud of me, I changed my own battery recently as it was down to 30% capacity whilst showing OK in other aspects such as voltage/CCA/internal resistance etc 🙂)

1 hour ago, wali110 said:

There were 3 connections on the starter, 2 big 1 small. I used the multimeter on both big connections and got a 12v reading.

You shouldn't be getting a reading from both the big Terminals un less the Starter has been triggered to start. Edit, I see that @Shearers has just said that.

 

31 minutes ago, Shearers said:

12V on small connection (I'd have a 10 A fuse in that lead there somewhere in case of an accidental dead short) should trigger the solenoid with a decent click.

If you have headlights on during that test  and they dim at least it looks like starter MAY be trying BUT then we're back to the battery again (cos if the starter is working it takes a LOT of current)

If they don't dim then likely starter isn't working?
Unsure how you have "12V" on both heavy connections (from battery, yes as this should always be there) but the other should only have 12V if solenoid is triggered and then main motor should fire up - however we all suspect the battery is U/S and likely cannot provide the current to be sure about starter.
SO...New battery, test starter again to clear that one up, then go from there with your better EOBD lead and see what Forscan can detect (whilst keeping an eye on everything that has gone before)?

We all seem to be talking from the same song sheet (and, Guys,  I KNOW your views on batteries i.e. just change them but, being a tight wad I try to eke out the life of any part before changing it and only if I have information to back it up. You may, or not, be proud of me, I changed my own battery recently as it was down to 30% capacity whilst showing OK in other aspects such as voltage/CCA/internal resistance etc 🙂)

Thanks for the advise guys.

I did have a wired fuse to hand which I should have used.

The Headlights did not dim when I tried to ignite the starter and ensured the Battery had sufficient 12v power with the charger connected.

I connected both pins of the Multimeter to the two big connections of the starter and got a 12v reading and then swapped the connections over and got the same reading. I believe that only the one side is giving out the 12v.

And if the starter is connected straight to the battery without any fuses in between then I would not be surprised if the reverse polarity jump start did destroy the starter.

I am the same when it comes to broken parts, I also always seek to repair to the last part before replacing lol.

I did even consider using some epson salt and battery fluid to revive the Battery which I have sitting in the Garage but won't be doing now.

I am pretty certain that the starter got damaged and just needs replacing but not 100% sure.

I will let the Battery charge overnight and then test it again tomorrow and also then try the new obd lead.

Thanks again for your help and support 🙏

 

9 minutes ago, wali110 said:

I connected both pins of the Multimeter to the two big connections of the starter and got a 12v reading and then swapped the connections over and got the same reading. I believe that only the one side is giving out the 12v.

We were confused by your original description, hence our comments.

We thought that you connected the Negative Lead to Earth, kept it there and got a 12V reading from both the large Terminals in turn. 

13 minutes ago, Tizer said:

We were confused by your original description, hence our comments.

We thought that you connected the Negative Lead to Earth, kept it there and got a 12V reading from both the large Terminals in turn. 

Yes I thought so hence cleared the misunderstanding.

Trying to source a new starter motor and hoping it will do the trick for me fingers crossed.

When you gave 12 Volts to the Small Terminal the Solenoid in the Starter should have engaged, the Pre Engage Mechanism should have moved to connect with the Flywheel and when that was there full Battery power should have been provided to the Motor and it should have turned. 

10 minutes ago, Tizer said:

When you gave 12 Volts to the Small Terminal the Solenoid in the Starter should have engaged, the Pre Engage Mechanism should have moved to connect with the Flywheel and when that was there full Battery power should have been provided to the Motor and it should have turned. 

Ah right okay yes makes sense but it did not because either the battery did not have enough power or the starter is damaged. 

I will try to test is again tomorrow once the Battery has had it's 12v charge and keep you updated.

Thanks for your help again.

3 hours ago, wali110 said:

I connected both pins of the Multimeter to the two big connections of the starter and got a 12v reading and then swapped the connections over and got the same reading. I believe that only the one side is giving out the 12v.

If I have that right you WOULD get 12V across the solenoid because one end is connected to the battery and the other to the heavy starter windings to Earth therefore 12V would be registered across it because you are effectively connecting from battery positive to negative ((Earth)

As you say the lights didn't dim, there's no big current flowing to the starter so it's either battery or starter (you still are unable to confirm the solenoid is activating?) or both at present.

Battery: cheapest, easiest and most likely needed anyway based on past postings  - can't remember if you said how old it is but You Know Our Views!

As you have no real way of testing, my last pathetic suggestion would be to carry out your proposed starter test and if lights don't dim, actually leave them on and see how long they last (2 x headlight + 4x sidelights plus rest of vehicle power would perhaps be 15 or 20 Amp (guess - unless you had a versatile clamp meter to measure it)

Obviously with perhaps a 70Ah battery it should be able to last over 3 hours - if you get  say 15 min it's definitely cream crackered that's only a back of an envelope estimate of course and doesn't account for any rapid voltage drop which should also be measured as another vital parameter (down to 10.5V is fully discharged as above?)

I think the consensus is that you are wasting your time with the battery.

51 minutes ago, Shearers said:

If I have that right you WOULD get 12V across the solenoid because one end is connected to the battery and the other to the heavy starter windings to Earth therefore 12V would be registered across it because you are effectively connecting from battery positive to negative ((Earth)

As you say the lights didn't dim, there's no big current flowing to the starter so it's either battery or starter (you still are unable to confirm the solenoid is activating?) or both at present.

Battery: cheapest, easiest and most likely needed anyway based on past postings  - can't remember if you said how old it is but You Know Our Views!

As you have no real way of testing, my last pathetic suggestion would be to carry out your proposed starter test and if lights don't dim, actually leave them on and see how long they last (2 x headlight + 4x sidelights plus rest of vehicle power would perhaps be 15 or 20 Amp (guess - unless you had a versatile clamp meter to measure it)

Obviously with perhaps a 70Ah battery it should be able to last over 3 hours - if you get  say 15 min it's definitely cream crackered that's only a back of an envelope estimate of course and doesn't account for any rapid voltage drop which should also be measured as another vital parameter (down to 10.5V is fully discharged as above?)

I think the consensus is that you are wasting your time with the battery.

Thank you for your helpful information.

That all really makes sense.

Yes I will hopefully be testing the starter tomorrow again with the charged Battery.

I understand that I will most likely need a new Battery but am pretty certain that once charged should it have enough power to at least start the Car once.

I can always leave the charger connected or use my jumper pack again.

The Battery did manage to start the Car once charged before the Car broke down and I am sure it will be good enough to get it started again.

I could easily replace the Battery straight away but don't wish to throw anymore money into it and would rather sell it for spares if it turns out that the ecu is damaged.

I am hoping that it is just the starter motor fingers crossed and should hopefully find out tomorrow as I am planning on testing it while it is on the Car and then removing it to then test it again being off the Car.

Thank you again my friend for your time and and support with this.

11 hours ago, wali110 said:

I can always leave the charger connected

Don't do that.  As well as potentially damaging something, the charger only provides 5 amps maximum.  The starter takes 100+ amps so it won't help at all.

The better option is to get a proper jump start using cables from another car with that engine running.

45 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Don't do that.  As well as potentially damaging something, the charger only provides 5 amps maximum.  The starter takes 100+ amps so it won't help at all.

The better option is to get a proper jump start using cables from another car with that engine running.

okay great advice, I also have a jump starter pack which I will.

Thanks for your help

Just want to point out that the starter takes a lot of amps, so only the thickest of cables will deliver the current without it's resistance dropping the voltage. So if you only attempted to test the starter using thin cable, the voltage drop would have been too great to provide the power to operate the motor..... am I making any sense? 🤔

2 hours ago, nicam49 said:

Just want to point out that the starter takes a lot of amps, so only the thickest of cables will deliver the current without it's resistance dropping the voltage. So if you only attempted to test the starter using thin cable, the voltage drop would have been too great to provide the power to operate the motor..... am I making any sense? 🤔

Yes I agree and did consider this so will test using a thicker Cable, thank you my friend.

Also, he makes, I think a good explanation of how starter and solenoid work together plus explains the function of the Pull In and Holding coils plus how to test them?:

 

2 hours ago, Shearers said:

Also, he makes, I think a good explanation of how starter and solenoid work together plus explains the function of the Pull In and Holding coils plus how to test them?:

 

 

Interesting Video thanks for sharing and also nice Farsi Iranian accent 😄

 

I have managed to get another Fiesta which I used its Battery to connect onto my Battery using Jump Leads and then tested the Starter Motor again with no luck.

 

I also got the new FORScan Lead and it came back with the same two codes, Throttle/Pedal Position/Sensor as well as the System Voltage low one.

Definitely will be needing a new Battery once I get it started again with a new starter hopefully.

 

I may make a start tomorrow in attempting to remove the Starter Motor and will then try to Bench test it.

 

Thanks for all of your help again.

 

10 minutes ago, wali110 said:

 

Interesting Video thanks for sharing and also nice Farsi Iranian accent 😄

 

I have managed to get another Fiesta which I used its Battery to connect onto my Battery using Jump Leads and then tested the Starter Motor again with no luck.

 

I also got the new FORScan Lead and it came back with the same two codes, Throttle/Pedal Position/Sensor as well as the System Voltage low one.

Definitely will be needing a new Battery once I get it started again with a new starter hopefully.

 

I may make a start tomorrow in attempting to remove the Starter Motor and will then try to Bench test it.

 

Thanks for all of your help again.

 

Hopefully your bench testing will throw some light on things.

I see that the proper Lead has found 6 more Modules compared to your old one, including the  Body Control Module, which is one of the important ones.

If FORScan has a Self Test for that one it would be worth doing if you can power up the car again with a jump from another car.

33 minutes ago, Tizer said:

If FORScan has a Self Test for that one it would be worth doing i

Yes FORScan can run a full self test on the BCM. 👍

40 minutes ago, Tizer said:

Hopefully your bench testing will throw some light on things.

I see that the proper Lead has found 6 more Modules compared to your old one, including the  Body Control Module, which is one of the important ones.

If FORScan has a Self Test for that one it would be worth doing if you can power up the car again with a jump from another car.

Yes hopefully, okay will try and do a BCM self test tomorrow by getting a jump again from the other Fiesta.

Thanks a a lot for all your help guys.