I got a speeding ticket through the post yesterday (for doing 36mph in a 30 zone) which incensed me because I do not break speed limits unless it is by accident.
In fact I have only ever had two speeding tickets and both were when I was on holiday on unfamiliar roads where I obviously did not know (from memory) what the speed limit is. I am from Sheffield and this "offence" occurred in Bournemouth.

Once I'd calmed down I thought I'd look for where (on a dual carriageway with a central reservation.....) the speed limit dropped to 30 and why I did not see it. But despite retracing the route on Google Streetview multiple times I cannot see the big 30mph change of speed limit sign is. So I thought maybe I have missed it and wondered where I can find out where the speed limit is officially supposed to change. Does anyone know how to do this ?

For anyone in the area we were driving through Bournemouth / West Howe north east wards, A3049 > A348 (Ringwood Rd). It is defn 40mph on the A3049 where Belben joins it from the north (as there is a 40 sign from Belben Rd), but I got "caught" a bit further up (on the A348 where Littlemoor Ave joins it) and try as I might I cannot see any large "Change of speed limit" 30mph sign between those two points !
Incidentally that speed camera was only put in two years ago and was a cause of a little controversy at the time. I have checked up on CrashMap and there had only been 6 "Slight" accidents in six years over that stretch of very busy road so one wonders why they went  to all the expense of putting up a speed camera and lowering the speed limit !

I dont; want anyone to think I hate speed all cameras, I wish we had one in our village to catch the nutters, but this experience of mine has made me very cynical about some of them......

Two supplementary questions if I may.

1 - Assuming there is no "Change of speed limit sign" is that adequate grounds to challenge the "offence". Particularly considering I am not from the area and therefore I cannot know what the speed limit is supposed to be.

2 - If it is, how can I go about challenging the "offence" if I live in Sheffield and any court hearing will be in Bournemouth, a 5 hour drive away ? ! ?

Did the section of road have street lighting ?

 

2 minutes ago, unofix said:

Did the section of road have street lighting ?

From the linked newspaper article it looks like that may be the case?

I recall a long section of my speed awareness course being devoted to an exhaustive analysis of how to identify the applicable limit in the apparent absence of signs, and that one featured prominently. 

The instructors were very good and appreciated now difficult this is nowadays. Their advice was unless you can positively identify a higher limit, always assume it's the lowest.

6 minutes ago, unofix said:

Did the section of road have street lighting ?

I think I have found where it changes, but the fact it has taken me this long to find that out shows that the whole thing is ludicrous and the fact I accidentally got a speeding ticket (as a non local driver in particular) is basically really unfair.

The "Mountbatten roundabout" (in Bournemouth) is where the speed limit changes. The A3049 onto it and off it (a DC onto it and a SC off it) are both. But the A348 (a DC which is technically straight on !) is only 30mph, but it doesn't actually tell you that !  There is no "change of speed limit sign" I can see.
It's a con and has really angered me. I would love to know how many speeding tickets that camera has issued and what percentage of them are to non local drivers.....

A few years ago, I too got caught doing 36mph in a 30mph limit. It irritated me at the time as I thought I was on a 40mph road so was actually under the limit. Like you, I though I'd be the big man and show them they couldn't mess with me. However, this is the junction where I was caught (the speed van was parked outside the bank).

The road sure doesn't look like a 30mph stretch. There were no specific 30mph signage despite the road being 40mph a few hundred yards previous. BUT, look at the streetlamps, I was caught bang to rights LOL Those speed awareness courses aren't as bad as you think!

4 minutes ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

From the linked newspaper article it looks like that may be the case?

I recall a long section of my speed awareness course being devoted to an exhaustive analysis of how to identify the applicable limit in the apparent absence of signs, and that one featured prominently. 

The instructors were very good and appreciated now difficult this is nowadays. Their advice was unless you can positively identify a higher limit, always assume it's the lowest.

I agree with them in theory, rather more difficult when there;s a queue froing behind you !

Basically I think there should be some flexibility in the application of the law. It is obvious that a non local stands a high chance of accidentally speeding there, particularly in the apparent absence of a change of speed limit 30mph sign.

1 minute ago, Justin Smith said:

Basically I think there should be some flexibility in the application of the law...

🤣 Exactly how long have you lived in our country? A woman gets sent to prison for 31 months for saying some hurty words, yet the likes of Hew Edwards walk free for child abuse!

2 minutes ago, StephenFord said:

A few years ago, I too got caught doing 36mph in a 30mph limit. It irritated me at the time as I thought I was on a 40mph road so was actually under the limit. Like you, I though I'd be the big man and show them they couldn't mess with me. However, this is the junction where I was caught (the speed van was parked outside the bank).

The road sure doesn't look like a 30mph stretch. There were no specific 30mph signage despite the road being 40mph a few hundred yards previous. BUT, look at the streetlamps, I was caught bang to rights LOL Those speed awareness courses aren't as bad as you think!

Was the road 40mph earlier and with no change of speed limit sign though ?

I learnt a lot from the speed awareness course I did 6 years ago, I thought I was pretty good at working out speed limits, but the fact is this was a buggar of an example. One should not have to use up 80% of ones concentration trying to work out what the speed limit is ! That's just dangerous.

2 minutes ago, Justin Smith said:

...One should not have to use up 80% of ones concentration trying to work out what the speed limit is ! That's just dangerous.

That is why I now have programmed my SatNav with audible alerts to warn me if I creep over...

7 minutes ago, Justin Smith said:

Basically I think there should be some flexibility in the application of the law.

I think we'd all agree with that - and that's how it used to be when our roads were policed by real people with years of experience, rather than computers/cameras. 

4 minutes ago, StephenFord said:

That is why I now have programmed my SatNav with audible alerts to warn me if I creep over...

Similar principle to the Intelligent Speed Assist you get in current models. ISA is by no means perfect as I've posted elsewhere, but it is a useful aid.

The converse is also true.

There are a few Twin Carriageways in the busy City that I live in that are 40 mph. They are signposted and have repeaters every few lampposts yet there is usually some sanctimonious twit doing 28 mph in the outside lane, which is fine if the inside one is free because I undertake them but often there is another sanctimonious twit in the inside lane as well.

It's much the same in the 20 and 30mph zones, the 20 ones have the repeaters as well but the same sanctimonious twits treat the 30mph zones as 20mph.

What I don't get is that on some roundabouts, where a minor road with perhaps a 30 limit crosses a road with national speed limit, the whole roundabout is de-restricted ? So when you continue on the minor road where the limit returns to 30, you can easily get caught out.

Surely the limit on a roundabout should be the slowest of the limits on any joining road ?

1 hour ago, Paulkp said:

What I don't get is that on some roundabouts, where a minor road with perhaps a 30 limit crosses a road with national speed limit, the whole roundabout is de-restricted ?

I encounter several of these regularly. Another issue is that when the speed limiter is set to intelligent mode, the camera often picks up the limit signs on the joining road(s).  When you try to accelerate off the roundabout, you can't, unless you floor the pedal to override the system.

9 minutes ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

... When you try to accelerate off the roundabout, you can't, unless you floor the pedal to override the system.

That's what you get when you buy a new car full of electronic AI and other electronic cr*p. 🤣 In my old jalopy, the driver is actually in control of driving, I know, a novel idea 😁

2 hours ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Another issue is that when the speed limiter is set to intelligent mode, the camera often picks up the limit signs on the joining road(s).

Yes it certainly does. I've had some serious issues with mine when I tried using it. There are two factories that I pass, one has a 15mph sign on the gate and the other a 5mph sign on the fence and my car picks up on both of them.

The very worst is the 60mph stretch of dual carriageway going past Newcastle airport. The speed limit inside of the airport is 20mph but despite there being no visible speed signs, the car drops to 20mph on the roundabout outside of the airport and then refuses to go back to 60 after continuing along the dual carriageway. I assume that the speed limiter must also be using information from the maps and/or GPS data, which in this case is clearly wrong.  

Another problem area is the '20 when lights are flashing' zones IE around schools etc 

Here’s a quiz for you..What would you think the speed limit is on this roundabout approach road?  Note the two 50mph signs…Clue.. there are NO another signs in the mile up to this point.

 

 

3 hours ago, Kenny321 said:

Here’s a quiz for you..What would you think the speed limit is on this roundabout approach road?  Note the two 50mph signs…Clue.. there are NO another signs in the mile up to this point.

 

 

One would think it'd have been 70 (or poss 60), but the way you have asked the question I'd guess less than 50 ?

It is actually only 30mph, as i found out when I got zapped by a mobile gun standing on the central reservation you can see.

 

I am so angry about this ticket I got that I am thinking of opening a Parliamentary petition asking that all speed cameras must have the speed limit prominently just in front of the camera. This evens up the application of the law so non locals are no more likely to get prosecuted than locals, the latter inconsistency being patently unjust.

Has anyone on here got any ideas for the wording of said petition ?
Personally I think the best solution (and the cheapest ! ) is to require the speed limit to be painted on the road just in front of the camera "lines", which also means it would appear on the photo and there would be no argument if the speed limit was unclear., But how to succinctly put that into words ?

Ahh.......

Drivers Still Getting Caught Out by Ringwood Road Speed Limit Change

https://bournemouthdaily.co.uk/drivers- ... it-change/

What is particularly interesting about that article is this bit :

Why Was the Change Made?

Authorities are yet to provide full clarity on the reasons behind the reduction, but it’s likely aimed at improving road safety in an area with significant pedestrian and retail activity. Dual carriageways, while designed for faster-flowing traffic, can pose risks in busy urban environments, particularly near shopping centres like Turbary Retail Park.

13 minutes ago, Justin Smith said:

I am so angry about this ticket I got that I am thinking of opening a Parliamentary petition

 

when a NEW speed limit zone starts it MUST have a FULL SIZE red bordered white circle limit sign, clearly indicating the change in Speed limit.

for std car derived cars - when NOT in: 

a street lit 30mph area zone (as per posts above) limits do not need to be reminded as its a constant 30mph
or
national speed limit single carriageway - aka 60mph zone, non street lit, country lanes
nor
a dual carriageway with central reservation or a motorway - where the national speed limit applies - aka 70mph

ALL OTHER SPEED LIMITS - are meant to have SMALL reminder / repeater signs posted at a certain interval... 

 

However - as the country has been infected with crooks, morons and people who know nothing - all these steadfast rules are now subject to deliberate abuse, misuse, missing signage, or collusion with local and governmental bodies to help your fines fund death in other countries

for van derived cars, such as the sh1troen berlingo (note some are some aren't you have to study your V5C) - if it started as a van take 10 off the 60 limits

22 hours ago, Kenny321 said:

Here’s a quiz for you..What would you think the speed limit is on this roundabout approach road?  Note the two 50mph signs…Clue.. there are NO another signs in the mile up to this point.

 

 

We have no ability to answer your question... it could be ANYTHING from 20 to 70 (for a car derived car) we need to see either a repeater sign or the limit shown in a FULL SIZE sign further back up the road and not shown in your photo....

the 50mph sign (shown) is a FULL SIZE sign, indicating its a NEW speed limit zone, starting as you enter the roundabout.... this pathetic lunacy is now allowing traffic to screech around out of control at 50 on a roundabout where 30 is sensible and 40 is pushing it 

BUT FAR - WORSE THEY ARE COMPLETE CRIMINALS - its a deliberate attempt to cash in on speeding fines whilst making road use less safe ! - entering this part of the road, your focus should be on road conditions within the braking zone and on good observation for other road users.  When doing what's needed for all road users safety, it is very unwise to attempt to overload a driver with a NEW speed limit notification.  The real idea is you were in a 70 you are now entering a 50, so coming off the other side of the roundabout carrying on on the main route, we can now place a forward facing camera taking a nice little picture - so we can afford to kill another Ukrainian youth !!!!

this perfect insanity is in play on the A413 at the Chalfonts Bucks - where a 70mph dual carriageway has a New 30 zone posted at the roundabout, and the camera taking a photo in what was (and still should be) a 60 mph zone - till they popped in the full size 30mph sign last year.  Where you don't notice it