Shepster48

new st-line, worried about security.

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Any car will be targeted and stolen if they want it and it is an easy target,whether it is an St or any other model or make.

 

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Try not to worry to much mate,anything at all you try to stop them they will find some way to get to you or if they are jealous.

Been there a few times myself,do the bits you want to do to help and take them more time to do it.

Never knew how they did it but seen this on YouTube firm selling a device,opened my eyes but i don't have Key-less Start.

 

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Is there something different about the mk8 obd? All dummy obd’s on eBay state to be mk7 up to 2017.

mine is leased so I would assume I can’t go adding alarms where ever I want. 

Hopefully obd relocation and obd fuse removal, plus the physical deterrent of disklok and a sticker stating obd has been disabled will mean they move on to the next. Then if the worst happens car insurance and gap insurance will not leave me out of pocket. 

Does anyone know if ford fit any kind of obd protector?

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Just been to have a look at the obd on the fiesta at my local ford garage. 

The obd port can now actually be seen (it not behind a panel) and it looks like It’s attached to a large lump of plastic with no spare wire to relocate. I don’t think there is anyway the obd can now be moved. As it’s now part of a large chunk of plastic I’ve no idea how you could even strap it back anywhere.

at least with my current st line it could be moved behind the dash. What are ford thinking.

So plan b. What aftermarket alarms will I be allowed to have in a lease car?

 

 

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It takes longer to overcome the Disklok than it does to overcome the bar type steering wheel locks. I have had mine since 2004 they are a great visual deterrent Decent security comes at a price. With the bar type you can hacksaw the steering wheel to remove them.

https://www.carbuyer.co.uk/tips-and-advice/158469/best-steering-wheel-locks-to-buy-2018

Best steering wheel locks to buy 2018

 

Edited by eddie eastwood
More info

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29 minutes ago, Shepster48 said:

Just been to have a look at the obd on the fiesta at my local ford garage. 

The obd port can now actually be seen (it not behind a panel) and it looks like It’s attached to a large lump of plastic with no spare wire to relocate. I don’t think there is anyway the obd can now be moved. As it’s now part of a large chunk of plastic I’ve no idea how you could even strap it back anywhere.

at least with my current st line it could be moved behind the dash. What are ford thinking.

So plan b. What aftermarket alarms will I be allowed to have in a lease car?

 

What about something like this?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/OBD-Lock-Protector-x/dp/B074ZHBB1F/ref=sr_1_2?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1549720085&sr=1-2&keywords=OBD+LOCK

Quote

 

 

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That actually looks like something I may have to use. Thanks. I guess It’s quite expensive for what it is but cheaper than losing £16k. 

I just want the obd to be safe or out of the way enough so the thieves have to set the perimeter alarm off inside to get to the obd. I can be down stairs in 30 seconds and the car is only ever on my drive or work and as my work is a fortress I only really need to worry about when on my drive. With the disklok fitted 30 seconds is plenty to be out with my bat.

ive sent for the disklok and alert stickers, I’m going to remove the obd fuse but apparently I’ve heard they use self powered gadgets now so pulling the fuse won’t help. 

Has anyone with a mk8 managed to extend their obdurate a safer place. There must be a way.

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There is being security conscious and downright paranoid and obsessed.

May as well go the whole hog, and remove the battery or use an axle stand and remove a wheel when the car is parked up.

I cannot say I have ever known anyone in the position where their cars are only on their drive and at their place of work. 

Unfortunately we have to use our cars to do regular things like do the shopping, go into town, go to the doctors, dentist, go into town, go for lunch, go to the coast blah blah blah. 

Ours haven't been nicked over the years, neither has the lads AMG and they are parked during the day in areas that aren't the best, not that that matters.

If I only used a car to go back and forth to work, I certainly wouldn't buy, lease or PCP a brand new car just for that.

 

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1 hour ago, Mavroz said:

There is being security conscious and downright paranoid and obsessed.

May as well go the whole hog, and remove the battery or use an axle stand and remove a wheel when the car is parked up.

I cannot say I have ever known anyone in the position where their cars are only on their drive and at their place of work. 

Unfortunately we have to use our cars to do regular things like do the shopping, go into town, go to the doctors, dentist, go into town, go for lunch, go to the coast blah blah blah. 

Ours haven't been nicked over the years, neither has the lads AMG and they are parked during the day in areas that aren't the best, not that that matters.

If I only used a car to go back and forth to work, I certainly wouldn't buy, lease or PCP a brand new car just for that.

 

Exactly, there's so many places it can happen, I wouldnt really want to be carrying a disklok or anything like that around with me and take the time to fit it and remove it each time I get in and out of the car. It may take a thief a bit more time to steal the car but I am fairly sure that if its a car they want to take, they'll find a way to take it. Sure there's as everyone has mentioned things you can do, some more reasonable than others but without converting your car into a portable fort knox, there'll always be some vulnerability a thief can exploit. Obviously I'm not saying to do nothing but to be going into so much effort when ultimately it's a Fiesta and not anything highly premium I'm just not sure its worth the stress. If they steal it, insurance and GAP insurance should be there to cover it. Moving OBD ports etc isnt a bad idea, but a thief can still smash the window into your car, cause some damage before fleeing if he cant find the OBD at which point you have your car, but it's damaged so in all honesty, I'd rather they just took it and I got paid out if they never recovered it

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According to today's papers theft of Fords increased 399% from 2015 to 2018 so obviously there is a problem, though I suspect the bulk of that will be keyless entry. One thing about the Mk 8 is there is no flashing indicator to show the alarm is set. I think in practical terms it's all about having a small visual deterrent which may cause an opportunist to move on to another vehicle. As others have said, if someone really wants your particular car they're gonna have it.

I've had 2 cars** stolen in the past, which I suppose is not bad for nearly 50 years, but the inconvenience, effect on insurance and that sick feeling when you realise your motor has gone should not be underestimated, so I wouldn't talk anyone out of a bit of extra security (within reason) if it makes them sleep easier. I've been having a look at the various old security devices I have in the garage and none of them will fit the Fiesta without potential damage so I will probably invest in a new steering wheel lock just to add that minutes delay.

(** The first was my Mk 1 Cortina which was nicked from a multi-storey in Leeds in 1972. Ford security in those days was so bad that my keys would open and start my mate's Mk 2 and vice versa, so when I found my car missing I thought at first it was him having a laugh by moving it to another floor in revenge for me doing the same to him the week before😀. The car actually turned up in Doncaster a week later and when I went to collect it from the Police, I found that all that had been taken were my swimming trunks and towel, though the boot was full of tools and 2 spare wheels at the time - weird!)

 

 

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So, having done some homework on this, when my Mk8 arrives, I will store the keys in a Faraday pouch and remove fuse 3 (I think that's the correct fuse which shuts down the OBD port, I will watch the video first to chec).. This, unless anybody tells me different will fend of the keyless entry and the ODB Port cloning. If they still take it, well, I have at least tried to cover of the two main reasons these are being stolen.

There must be hundreds and thousands of these cars with owners that have absolutely no idea about these two theft methods.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, nashdm2 said:

So, having done some homework on this, when my Mk8 arrives, I will store the keys in a Faraday pouch and remove fuse 3 (I think that's the correct fuse which shuts down the OBD port, I will watch the video first to chec).. This, unless anybody tells me different will fend of the keyless entry and the ODB Port cloning. If they still take it, well, I have at least tried to cover of the two main reasons these are being stolen.

There must be hundreds and thousands of these cars with owners that have absolutely no idea about these two theft methods.

 

“Every new Fiesta comes with an immobiliser and four out of five series of new Fiesta include a Thatcham category one alarm as standard.  This means that once set the in-built alarm system sounds if the car is entered by person or object, there is movement in the cabin, any attempt is made to raise the car (to remove a wheel or tow it away) or the ignition is brought live without a correctly coded key being present.

“If criminals reach the OBD port (the diagnostic port within the vehicle used by dealer technicians to access the vehicle’s electrical system), any attempt to plug into the car’s diagnostics automatically initiates a 10-minute software lockdown, while the alarm continues to be emitted.

“Further attempts to access the system during lockdown restarts the 10-minute wait period, eliminating the possibility of rapid illegitimate programming of keys for the car via the OBD. Owners of older Fords have the option of fitting the OBD port with a guard to prevent programming of keys.”

 

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On 2/6/2019 at 12:22 AM, Shepster48 said:

I’m reading reports that if the alarm goes off then the obd2 is disabled for 10 minutes. Can anyone comment if this is true? I’m dubious as these cars are being stolen in seconds.

 

Quote

In a statement, Ford said: “Ford Motor Company takes vehicle security seriously and continuously invests in technology to deter theft of, and from, our vehicles.  Additionally a growing issue is the availability of security tools, which should be confined to dealerships and other specialists, being on uncontrolled public sale.  Fords are sold with competitive levels of standard security equipment.

“Every new Fiesta comes with an immobiliser and four out of five series of new Fiesta include a Thatcham category one alarm as standard.  This means that once set the in-built alarm system sounds if the car is entered by person or object, there is movement in the cabin, any attempt is made to raise the car (to remove a wheel or tow it away) or the ignition is brought live without a correctly coded key being present.

“If criminals reach the OBD port (the diagnostic port within the vehicle used by dealer technicians to access the vehicle’s electrical system), any attempt to plug into the car’s diagnostics automatically initiates a 10-minute software lockdown, while the alarm continues to be emitted.

“Further attempts to access the system during lockdown restarts the 10-minute wait period, eliminating the possibility of rapid illegitimate programming of keys for the car via the OBD. Owners of older Fords have the option of fitting the OBD port with a guard to prevent programming of keys.”

https://www.driving.co.uk/news/ford-fiestas-risk-keyless-theft-gangs/

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With keyless start the usual way is to break the window (setting the alarm off) and plug a laptop into the OBD port. That's why I've removed the OBD fuse and put a sticker on the window:

64d476b97cc24fee72401fa93f1e6b84.jpg&key=8ffb575a35f4d7bac2a6e2f704d017371a5b820d61fa955ce08234674f8e4c84

Belt and braces, and a really easy mod.

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Does removing the obd fuse just remove the power supply from the port? (I am guessing it is a 12v supply)

As I am led to understand from other sources and have possibly seen on this thread, the said car thieves device supposedly has its own power supply, negating the fact the obd fuse has been removed.

Not sure if this is correct or not.

 

 

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Those points above are quite interesting, especially the one where it mentions the 10 minute OBD shutdown when the alarm has been sounded.

The thing is, if a crim breaks the window and leans in, will the alarm sound? If not, that feature will be useless. The link above says ithe newspaper article was dated March 2018. so why are so many Fiestas still being stolen after that news article?

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10 minute shut down is on quite a few fords. Quite often I'm having to programme 2new keys after both have been lost, and now programming requires me to wait 10 minutes before I can access the bcm security. 

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I'm pretty safe , focus zetec, who wants to steal that. Lol

I don't even bother locking my car outside my house. Nothing in it to steal, I had 2 cars some years ago broken In to, nothing to take but they bent the doors to get in and have a look. Caused alot of damage. So the next car I had( another one not worth stealing, a Suzuki Liana top gear special) I left doors unlocked.someone opened door, had a look round and in glove box , boot and then left. No damage done. 

I know insurance blah blah but that's my logic. Have a car worth stealing and by all means get it locked up , with trackers, kroklocks , obd moved etc. 

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5 hours ago, nashdm2 said:

Those points above are quite interesting, especially the one where it mentions the 10 minute OBD shutdown when the alarm has been sounded.

The thing is, if a crim breaks the window and leans in, will the alarm sound? If not, that feature will be useless. The link above says ithe newspaper article was dated March 2018. so why are so many Fiestas still being stolen after that news article?

I went to my ford dealer and asked about the perimeter alarm inside the st line. He tested the st line while I was there. He left the windows open and locked the car invoking the perimeter alarm. I tested if I could put my hand in and get to the the obd port. I did it very easily without setting the alarm off. Infact I tested to see how much of my body could get in before the alarm went off and I could get both hands down in the obd port area. I have to say I was not impressed with the sensors at all. The salesman reckons that smashing the window would set the alarm off but I’m not too sure. The video’s I’ve seen on YouTube, smashing the window didn’t seem to set any alarm off. The window cracked but a small hole was made near the wing mirrors. I don’t understand why ford didn’t move the port to the other side of the steering wheel. It would still be accessible and keeping with eu regulations. Or made it so the ignition needed to be on before the port came live. 

 

so the other option would be to move the obd. But from what I’ve seen the port is now attached to a massive chunk of plastic which is then bolted in place at the bottom of the dashboard. This chunk of plastic containing the port is also wired to another wiring loom and it can all be unplugged. So the whole obd port can be unattached but I’m not sure what removing that will do to the rest of the car as there is more than just the obd port in that part. Unfortunately the wire to the wiring loom looks very short so no chance of moving it inside the dashboard I don’t think.

I’ve seen a video where a piece of angled metal is bolted to the front of the obd, thus stopping them getting to the port but I think they would just rag the whole lot off as it’s only held on with two thin bolts so the thief would just grab the lot and yank it. 

So I don’t think there’s a cheap fix for this. If we could get hold of an extender for that wiring loom that the port goes to, that may work. We could move the obd port anywhere we choose then. 

the other option is getting the port immobilised. I did find a place online who did this but it cost £150. I may do this. I would rather pay £150 than lose the car.

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Seriously, how are you going to sleep at night once you have this car? My Focus is the same engine as the Fiesta ST, I've had a Mondeo ST, Astra VXR, plus other sports models and I've never added any additional security. If it gets stolen I will claim on my insurance. Life is stressful enough without worrying about a car.

Are you not worried about invalidating your Ford warranty too if you move the port or have third parties adding devices to it?

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I'm sure the obd port can be moved if you so desire, I've got obd extenders that I use when fitting non security trackers . Will have a look on a mk 8 tomorrow if it can be unbolted.

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57 minutes ago, Shepster48 said:

I went to my ford dealer and asked about the perimeter alarm inside the st line. He tested the st line while I was there. He left the windows open and locked the car invoking the perimeter alarm. I tested if I could put my hand in and get to the the obd port. I did it very easily without setting the alarm off. Infact I tested to see how much of my body could get in before the alarm went off and I could get both hands down in the obd port area. I have to say I was not impressed with the sensors at all. The salesman reckons that smashing the window would set the alarm off but I’m not too sure. The video’s I’ve seen on YouTube, smashing the window didn’t seem to set any alarm off. The window cracked but a small hole was made near the wing mirrors. I don’t understand why ford didn’t move the port to the other side of the steering wheel. It would still be accessible and keeping with eu regulations. Or made it so the ignition needed to be on before the port came live. 

 

so the other option would be to move the obd. But from what I’ve seen the port is now attached to a massive chunk of plastic which is then bolted in place at the bottom of the dashboard. This chunk of plastic containing the port is also wired to another wiring loom and it can all be unplugged. So the whole obd port can be unattached but I’m not sure what removing that will do to the rest of the car as there is more than just the obd port in that part. Unfortunately the wire to the wiring loom looks very short so no chance of moving it inside the dashboard I don’t think.

I’ve seen a video where a piece of angled metal is bolted to the front of the obd, thus stopping them getting to the port but I think they would just rag the whole lot off as it’s only held on with two thin bolts so the thief would just grab the lot and yank it. 

So I don’t think there’s a cheap fix for this. If we could get hold of an extender for that wiring loom that the port goes to, that may work. We could move the obd port anywhere we choose then. 

the other option is getting the port immobilised. I did find a place online who did this but it cost £150. I may do this. I would rather pay £150 than lose the car.

How about this (I’ve made an assumption this’ll work). Buy yourself another, genuine, MK8 OBD port for the fiesta, there’s one on eBay, and just like the dummy ports that you can buy disconnect the connector wires that allow the data transfer and install that OBD instead. Unless I have no idea what I’m on about, I know me well so I can’t rule this out, this’ll be the same has having a dummy extension port and also satisfy the cars ecu regarding the needing the OBD to be connected to the large connector it goes in to. If the car needs to go to a garage just swap the original one back. 

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50 minutes ago, WES180 said:

Seriously, how are you going to sleep at night once you have this car? My Focus is the same engine as the Fiesta ST, I've had a Mondeo ST, Astra VXR, plus other sports models and I've never added any additional security. If it gets stolen I will claim on my insurance. Life is stressful enough without worrying about a car.

Are you not worried about invalidating your Ford warranty too if you move the port or have third parties adding devices to it?

Can't believe this guy is so worried, he must be a nervous wreak with all this worry in his life. If your that stressed don't buy or lease the car or anything else of any value. The car covered by insurance, if it gets nicked or broken into or damaged it's covered, you don't lose out, just a bit of hassle to sort it out afterwards. It's just a car, there's more important things in life to worry about. 🤯

P.S. I would also recommend sleeping with the keys under your pillow just in case the car thief sneaks upstairs and nicks your keys off the bedside cabinet. 😂

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Why does the OBD need to stay live after the car is locked anyway?

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