A/C - To delete or not to delete

[dontpannic]

Hi All,

Since I did the clutch on my ST150 the air con has been disconnected in my car. I use it fairly rarely these days and when I do it's generally weekends or track use.

I'm stuck between re-instating the air con and removing it entirely with a idler pulley and different size belt.

The issue is totalling up the cost of recommissioning the air con as it is - currently the condenser is damaged and needs replacing - but when I disconnected it I stupidly didn't plug the lines so the air con lines which connect to the condenser have been cable tied up out of the way but open to the elements.

Am I likely to have damaged or dried out any other part of the system by leaving it like that (discharged and open?)

I'd be replacing the condenser, the condenser pipe o-rings and the dryer - but will the pipework being open have damaged the compressor or the evaporator?

I'm leaning towards just deleting it entirely, but weighing up my options.

Cheers!

Nick

[StephenFord]

50 minutes ago, dontpannic said:

I'm leaning towards just deleting it entirely, but weighing up my options...

Personally, I wouldn't entertain buying a car without A/C, even in the depths of winter, with it running, the windows remain clear as the humidity is taken out of the air. I like the fact it 'conditions' the air. My A/C has not been turned off since I got car, and all cars previous are the same.

Up to you, if you can cope in a car without it, and have little regard for any resale value, well go with your gut...

[dontpannic]

The car is going nowhere so resale doesn’t come into it. 

My main concern is what damage have I caused by leaving the system unsealed. It quickly starts to rack up when even pre this it needed a regas every year without fail due to lack of use, plus the cost of a condenser, dryer, will the pipes still be OK? Will I have buggered up the compressor?

If it comes down to a pulley and a belt or a basically complete air con system then it sort of makes my decision for me. 

[StephenFord]

2 minutes ago, dontpannic said:

... it needed a regas every year without fail due to lack of use...

I'm just curious, why did you never just turn it on?

[unofix]

14 minutes ago, dontpannic said:

it needed a regas every year without fail due to lack of use

Why did you not just leave it turned on as it was designed to be ?

Edit: sorry just seen Stephens reply above.

[TomsFocus]

How I feel after half an hours drive with air conditioning...

 

A regas every year means the system was already leaking.  That's not just from 'low use'.  I only ever used AC in the heights of summer and rarely ever needed a regas on any car.

I hate the drying feeling of AC so for me it is only for cooling.  But then I'm not overly sweaty or carrying wet dogs so condensation was never an issue...

Back to the question, I don't reckon you'll get away with just a new condenser.

[StephenFord]

2 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

A regas every year means the system was already leaking.  That's not just from 'low use'.

From 'low use' would some of the seals just naturally dry out, leading to a leak?

[TomsFocus]

35 minutes ago, StephenFord said:

From 'low use' would some of the seals just naturally dry out, leading to a leak?

Yes, but not that quickly on a full, sealed system.

Mine would generally go 9 or 10 months without any use.  oil clings to surfaces pretty well.

Much bigger issue is leaving the system empty of gas with air & moisture inside instead.

[dontpannic]

3 hours ago, StephenFord said:

I'm just curious, why did you never just turn it on?

 

2 hours ago, unofix said:

Why did you not just leave it turned on as it was designed to be ?

Edit: sorry just seen Stephens reply above.

The car goes with not a lot of use generally, and the compressor sucks a noticeable amount of power so for obvious reasons never used it while on track, and usually prefer to just have the windows down. It doesn't get a lot of use during the winter months - and below 4 degrees the system is disabled anyway.

It's very commonly reported on Fiesta ST150 specific forums that if you don't or forget to use the air con for around 6 months then you risk needing a re-gas.

2 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Back to the question, I don't reckon you'll get away with just a new condenser.

That was my fear.

2 hours ago, StephenFord said:

From 'low use' would some of the seals just naturally dry out, leading to a leak?

This is what I was always led to believe on the older Ford A/C systems - the manual says nothing about leaving it on at all times, just that you have to use it for at least 30 minutes a month to prevent seals drying out. Every time I got it re-gassed it goes through a pressure check which always came back fine otherwise the machines don't continue the re-gas procedure.

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Yes, but not that quickly on a full, sealed system.

Mine would generally go 9 or 10 months without any use.  Oil clings to surfaces pretty well.

Much bigger issue is leaving the system empty of gas with air & moisture inside instead.

So effectively we're thinking that to reinstate the aircon would require basically a whole new system?

 

EDIT: Just to give a bit more info, in 2021 I removed the front end of the car to fit a new intake manifold, PCV hose and coolant hose kit and had to have the system degassed. I replaced the condenser at that point but the studs weren't tightened as much as they could have been and the system didn't hold pressure when it was attempted to be regassed - I then attempted to remove and refit genuine studs rather than the ones that came with the new condenser however they had seized solid and attempting to remove them kinked the condenser so it was left at that point. It was something I was meaning to get around to but life gets in the way - but as I'm about to replace the radiator it made sense to think about replacing the condenser at the same time, but if I'm talking approaching a grand to replace the entire system I don't think it's worth it considering how little use the car gets.

[dontpannic]

It also just so happens that the AC in my MK3 Focus needs looking at as well, I had it regassed exactly a year ago and it's now not functioning again (despite on that car me leaving it on at all times with the auto function), but at least I haven't been an idiot on that one and left the pipes disconnected and not plugged.

[TomsFocus]

Mk3 Focus's are notorious for minor AC leaks.  Bought mine at 5 years old/40k miles with no gas...  Replaced the condenser and a holed pressure pipe but it still didn't hold the gas for more than a couple of weeks.  Presumably been left open a while.  Gave up and bought a Golf instead...  AC still works on the Golf 6 years later despite minimal use.

If you do want to reinstate on the Fiesta, the pipes should be ok, and the evaporator will hopefully not be rotting from the inside out.  So I would just recommend replacing all of the seals on the pipes you keep (not as big job as it sounds), plus the filler valves and then the condenser, drier/accumulator and probably the compressor if the short pipe has been left open for a couple of years, that's probably crusty inside now.  Shouldn't be anywhere near a grand to DIY.

[dontpannic]

Hmm. So maybe I'll order up a condenser so at least with my upcoming week off work I can get the rad pack assembled with all new parts (rad end tank appears to be leaking) and properly fit my PAS cooler and go from there and seek advice from an air con specialist about best way to proceed. If there's any risk of the evaporator in the heater matrix being gone I really don't fancy taking the dash out, but if it's just seals and a dryer then at least I've already got the condenser in place and I won't have to dismantle the front of the car again.