Gearbox Problem?

[Paul Burke]

Hello.

I have a 2000 'W' reg Ford Mondeo 2l automatic.

The strangest thing happened today as I pulled up at a T junction which has a very very slight slope, the road right by where I live, as I stopped at the T junction and about to pull out as I lifted my foot off the brake I felt the car roll backwards and I had to put my foot on the brake pedal (there was a car right behind me) I then put the car into N and then back into D and pulled away.

I have owned the car 3 years and I understand that you can still roll back whilst in D on some slopes, however this is barely a slope and almost flat and I use it daily as it is right by my house, this has never happened before.

The way it rolled back was similar to how a car would roll on a slope if it was in neutral with the hand brake off.

Do you have any idea what happened please?

[pragmatix]

Engine cold, low revs? Not that I ever trust an automatic to not roll back in drive

[Paul Burke]

Is there any way i can do anything to find out if this is the start of something, or are there any common tell tale signs please?

It was most weird to roll back, it was as though it was in reverse for a sec... I don't change gears at all, I pulled up in D... once I am in D it stays there until I need to P or R.

I have probably pulled out of that T junction over a 1000 times in this car and never had this before.

Has anyone ever heard of this before with any automatic car ever? it really is that weird that I am starting to question my own sanity.

[Paul Burke]

This has happened a furhter 3 times since i posted a month ago.

I now believe the gear box is going into neutral (or drive is completely lost) when I pull up to a stop with the car stone cold.

It is not all of the time, as it has happened four times in total, but it is clearly now an issue.

During when it happens I always know cos as I take my foot off the brake with the car on a flat surface instead of creeping forwards it just sits motionless, I then tap the accelerator and I can feel drive engage and off I go...

The most recent time was today, I was at an island near where I live and as I go to pull away from a complete stop nothing happens, so I give it a bit more gas and then the car sort of 'jumps' into gear with a thud...

Any one have any experience of this please or advice?

Thank you.

[ppeter7]

Have you had the cables adjusted or looked at at all what with age they might have stretched a little.Have you changed gearbox oil?

[Paul Burke]

No idea about cables? Never heard of that sorry, im clueless to be honest but i will help how i can.

I did have the gearbox fluid changed about 2 years ago, as the car has a FSH for the first 10 years of its life i tried to maintain it beyond that... i dont know if the 'tray'? was changed too? (sorry for not knowing how to word things better).

I have for the last 3 odd years always had a rough 1st - 2nd gear change but that's been like that for a long time and has never gotten any worse.

Any thing i can do? or test? i really dont know where to start but would desperately love to resolve this.

[ppeter7]

The cables are what link the gear lever to the top of the gearbox.If 1 or both are not aligned or tensioned properly you will have a fault selecting gears

[Paul Burke]

Ok thank you, i will mention this to my garage and see they say.

To be honest with you i have never had a problem with selecting any gear, other than what is currently happening where the gearbox just seems to go from 'D' into 'N' occasionally at complete stops... whilst 'D' is still selected.

I don't think 'N' is being engaged by the car though as when I touch the accelerator the car then kicks back into 'D' and if it was really in 'N' I assume it would just rev.

If that makes sense.

Thats honestly the best way to describe it.

[stef123]

I've always found that when an auto box is playing up selecting gears, changing gears etc that a simple oil and filter change can make a massive difference - perhaps your problem is just as easy.

[Paul Burke]

I will look into that as soon as Jan 2nd comes... thank you.

I will also post back regardless of improvement or not, just in case any of this helps anyone else in future.

[Paul Burke]

I managed to get the car looked at this week and it turned out that I had no transmission fluid in the car, the dipstick was dry... so they topped it up for me and it drove home perfectly, never missed a beat.

But the problem is they told me that I must have had the previous fluid go somewhere, he said whilst the car was on the ramp he didn't see any external leak from the gear box (after he had added new fluid).

He said maybe the transmission had gone into my cooling reservoir as this looked a bit pinkish...

Can you please offer me any advice on what to do next?

He told me to keep an eye on the level on the dipstick but when I looked at it I couldn't see any specific level, it was very difficult to read indeed.

 

 

 

[Ryan_Tango]

Difficult to read how?  

It's either between min and max, you should know how to check your oil surely?

 

[Paul Burke]

Sorry I mean I can see the min and max lines but the fluid is not distinguishable against the dipstick, it just looks damp rather than prominent in colour. (my daughter couldn't tell either).

I only had a new radiator fitted 2 years ago... it seems either odd or unlucky to me if mine had gone faulty to the point where 5 litres of transmission fluid had leaked into the coolant?

Also, what is niggling me is where did this transmission fluid go after that? my coolant has always been sat at 'max' so I don't know where the transmission fluid would have gone?

I have no problem having a new radiator fitted but I would like to know that this would be the solution first, if possible.

 

 

 

[Ryan_Tango]

Ahh okay fresh oil will be hard to see.

Wipe the dipstick completely dry and place it back in.

Take it back out hold it in the light to see if you can see some sort of reflection or light.

If that fails then get some thin kitchen roll or toilet paper (Only a small piece about the size of your thumb)

Place it on the bottom of the dipstick and it should show through the paper. 

[Paul Burke]

Thank you.

Sorry I added a couple more paragraphs in an edit...

I will paste them below and really would love yours/anyone's opinion and advice please...

 

***I only had a new radiator fitted 2 years ago... it seems either odd or unlucky to me if mine had gone faulty to the point where 5 litres of transmission fluid had leaked into the coolant?

Also, what is niggling me is where did this transmission fluid go after that? my coolant has always been sat at 'max' so I don't know where the transmission fluid would have gone?

I have no problem having a new radiator fitted but I would like to know that this would be the solution first, if possible.***

 

 

 

 

[Ryan_Tango]

One of your transmission tubes could have a leak causing it to mix with the coolant. 

[Paul Burke]

Where are these tubes located?

Would replacing the radiator solve this?

 

[TomsFocus]

I can't see 5 litres of AT fluid topping up your coolant without you noticing tbh. 

It is possible that the heat exchanger in the radiator is leaking AT fluid into the coolant, and a new radiator would be the only cure, but really you need to make sure it's that before splashing out on a new radiator.

I would say it's more likely that the autobox was partially drained 2 years ago when the rad was replaced and not topped up afterwards...

 

[Paul Burke]

So assuming the gearbox has not got a leak (I was told it did not) then is the only place any AT fluid could have gone is into the cooling system?

The mechanic told me my coolant looked pinkish and with an oily kind of texture.

Just trying to do the right thing next.

 

[TomsFocus]

Or not topped up after the previous rad change.

Fords coolant is pink on the later models, I assume it isn't on yours?  It may even be that someone has topped up the coolant with the wrong colour stuff in the past to give it a pink tinge.  When you get a lot of transmission fluid in the coolant it turns into a sort of strawberry milkshake kind of thing and would usually blow out of the cap/overflow and make a right mess. 

The best thing to do is to keep checking the levels of both the coolant and the trans fluid.  I know you said it's difficult to see the level but that's the only way you'll be able to prove where it's going if there is a leak.

[Paul Burke]

Thank you that actually makes a lot of sense especially when you consider the total amount of wasted time and errors with the garage that (eventually) fitted my new radiator 2 years ago.

They ordered in the wrong one 3 times before they got it right... and each time the price went up aswell... my original quote was for around £170 and I ended up paying over £200.

Funnily enough (and I do mean this) I commented at the time that the car never felt the same after the rad change... but stuck with it as my coolant leak issues had now gone away and the car started/stopped...

[Paul Burke]

Further update as it might help someone...

I drove the car as normal for the last 10 day as the garage who topped up my ATF told me to and then I checked my fluid levels yesterdays as instructed...

My expansion tank (which always sat at MAX) in now over flowing through the over flow hose and the colour of the fluid inside the plastic chamber is a distinct watered down pinkish colour, almost oily in texture.

So it would seem I am losing ATF into my cooling system for sure?

I am taking the car back to the garage that fitted my new radiator several years ago, I do not know what they will say, or if I have a leg to stand on?

All I know is that since the radiator was fitted the car has felt 'wrong' and I have had to top up the ATF twice... (10 litres in total)

The first time was 7 months after i had my new radiator fitted cos the gears felt clunky, so I paid for a flush and renew of ATF fluid, cost me £67 in total (the garage who fitted my radiator did this new ATF for me) and the second time recently cos I had no ATF in the system whatsoever, which then leads me to look at this as the cause of all of the rough gear changes I have had in the past 2+ years since I had the new radiator fitted.

After each new ATF the car would drive ok for about 8 months, but then the gears would start to go clunky slowly, getting worse each week, and not at all smooth... topping up the fluid rectified this each time.

Do I have a leg to stand on with the garage? I will not be willing to pay them full price to 'do the job properly this time'.

All advice and opinion is greatly appreciated please.

 

EDIT: I have just dug out my receipts for the radiator that they fitted and it was November 2012 (so just about 3 years).

The ATF oil change I had done was June 2013 (7 months after the new radiator was fitted). I do not throw money at the car for no reason, it must have needed changing/topping up quite badly for me to have had it done.

Like I say I have had rough gear box changes and had to top up with new ATF periodically since then, the problem is not a recent one and all points back to when the radiator was fitted.

 

 

[TomsFocus]

I think you probably only get 12 months 'warranty' in which to do anything about it.  I doubt you'll get anywhere with it now but it can't hurt to try I guess!

[Paul Burke]

They have the car right now, so I expect a phone call this afternoon telling me I need a new radiator.

The one that they fitted was clearly not right from the word go, I had to have 5 litres of ATF added just 7 months after they fitted the radiator, which must back me up a bit.

I just hope they don't come back and expect full price, labour and VAT as last time this was around £230 and to be fair I believe they fitted a faulty unit at that time as only 7 months into this radiators life I had to have 5 litres of ATF topped up (by the same garage).

They knew me by my first name today and remembered fitting the radiator, it was such a chore, as 3 times they ordered the wrong one in before eventually getting it right... they had the car for over a week at that time just to fit the last radiator and they remember me as a result.

[Paul Burke]

I didn't get a phone call back from them as promised so I went down to the garage at 4.30pm, the guy said that he thinks there is a fracture in one of the pipes in the radiator, not sure if he knows this for sure or if he is going off of what I told him might be the cause.

Waiting for a call today where I will be told how much I have to pay, I put up a good struggle claiming that the radiator had not lasted a reasonable amount of time before it started to give me issues...

Not holding my breath on the phone call, I will probably have to go back to them again and see what's happening, last time they fitted a radiator for me they had the car for over a week, and I don't expect to get it back this time until next week, and it's only a radiator I am having done.