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E10 is cleared for use in all petrol driven Ford models sold in Europe since 1992 excluding:

  • Ford Mondeo 1.8 SCI from 2003 to 2007.

Personal imports not approved by Ford of Europe are not included in the above statement.

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Just a bit unfortunate that E10 is likely to “have less energy” and so we’ll be buying more of it.

Its also hygroscopic so not ideal if you need to store your vehicle at any point or have a car that hibernates over winter.

Fortunately E5 will still be available in 98RON for the next five years.

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1 hour ago, Aldridge Andy said:

Its also hygroscopic so not ideal if you need to store your vehicle at any point or have a car that hibernates over winter.

Lol or if we have another lockdown. I haven't put any fuel in mine since early December so the half tank that's still in there must be pretty stale by now!😀 

Bit more about it here:

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/advice/emissions/what-is-e10-fuel-and-how-could-it-affect-you/

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"It’s estimated that the greener fuel could reduce CO2 emissions by 750,000 tonnes per year, the equivalent of taking up to 350,000 cars off the road."

That's an awful lot of CO2.   I remember when we all had to get used to unleaded fuel.   That was a very good thing.   At the time I ran a pistol club and we were debating whether of not to install a fan to bring fresh air into the range.   We all loaded our own ammo and all used lead bullets so there was a lot of lead on the range due to ablation of the bases of the bullets.   We ran a check and it showed that there was more lead on the main road from leaded petrol than on the range.

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1 hour ago, Bobr said:

It’s estimated that the greener fuel could reduce CO2 emissions by 750,000 tonnes per year, the equivalent of taking up to 350,000 cars off the road."

It is a lot of CO2, but, as I understand it, the saving is based on the plants that are grown to produce ethanol absorbing CO2 as they grow, to offset the CO2 produced when the fuel is used. It's a similar argument to importing wood chip all the way from North America to burn in Drax power station (the trains pass through where I live) rather than use coal from Kellingley Colliery which was virtually next door. I'm very much in favour of reducing pollution but must admit I am not fully convinced on this one.

Now leaded petrol was a different thing - that stuff was poisonous!💀

 

 

 

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E0 unleaded is more calorific than E10 but the only E0 near me is Esso supreme 99 but costs 18ppl more than the supermarket standard how likely would efficiency gains outweigh the increased cost?

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46 minutes ago, cjay1 said:

E0 unleaded is more calorific than E10 but the only E0 near me is Esso supreme 99 but costs 18ppl more than the supermarket standard how likely would efficiency gains outweigh the increased cost?

 Very doubtful if there would be much gain.

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1 hour ago, Bobr said:

 Very doubtful if there would be much gain.

It could be more than you think. 

"E10 test results
In our tests, the 89bhp Dacia Sandero struggled most, returning an 11.5% drop in mpg. That’s an extra cost of around £202 every 12,000 miles. The 99bhp Hyundai i30 was nearly as bad, managing 9.8% fewer miles on E10 than E0, an extra £16 a month"

hopefully the ecoboost won't be this bad

https://www.whatcar.com/news/what-car-e10-fuel-tests/n11430

 

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Not sure why What Car were comparing E10 to petrol with no ethanol, rather than E5 as we are using now?

When the time comes I'll give it a go and see how the car likes it.

Hopefully it won't be as noticeable as the switchover to unleaded. The early unleaded was equivalent to 3* if  I remember it right and the car I had then didn't like it at all. So I stuck to leaded 4* until I went diesel for about 20 years.

By the time I returned to petrol unleaded was available in higher octane ratings and cars were designed to use it anyway, so no problems then.

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2 hours ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Hopefully it won't be as noticeable as the switchover to unleaded. The early unleaded was equivalent to 3* if  I remember it right and the car I had then didn't like it at all. So I stuck to leaded 4* until I went diesel for about 20 years.

By the time I returned to petrol unleaded was available in higher octane ratings and cars were designed to use it anyway, so no problems then.

From what I've read: one star was the lowest grade, 2 star was 92 octane, 3 star 95 octane, 4 star 98 octane and 5 star 101 octane. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3AOctane_rating#Star_system  I don't remember 3* but do remember pumps with 2*,4* and 5*. I'm sure there were complaints of loss of power back then, switching from 4* leaded to normal unleaded.

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2 hours ago, Tiexen said:

I had a Citron AX GT back when we went unleaded I had to take it back to the dealer to get it adjusted  - manual choke  - remember them!

I not only remember the manual choke, I remember the advance / re tard lever.😂

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12 hours ago, Jim H said:

From what I've read: one star was the lowest grade, 2 star was 92 octane, 3 star 95 octane, 4 star 98 octane and 5 star 101 octane. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3AOctane_rating#Star_system  I don't remember 3* but do remember pumps with 2*,4* and 5*. I'm sure there were complaints of loss of power back then, switching from 4* leaded to normal unleaded.

Yes, I think that's right. I had an Astra SRi at the time, which was intended to use 4*, so didn't like the 3* unleaded at all. Vauxhall's at the time had a reversible plug under the bonnet to enable you to switch between ratings, but really that just altered the ignition timing to avoid damage. So I stuck to 4* leaded at the time. If today's "super" unleaded had been available then I'm sure it would have been fine with that.

2 hours ago, Tiexen said:

I had a Citron AX GT back when we went unleaded I had to take it back to the dealer to get it adjusted  - manual choke  - remember them!

Yes, certainly do! And all the jokes about ladies hanging their handbags on them! Some of the early autochokes were so bad I converted a couple of cars to manual choke - quite a common mod at the time. 

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32 minutes ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Yes, certainly do! And all the jokes about ladies hanging their handbags on them! 

Wait...that was a common joke?  Remember our college tutor saying it as if one of his customers had been doing it! :laugh: 

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2 hours ago, Bobr said:

I not only remember the manual choke, I remember the advance / re tard lever.😂

Never drove a car with one, but remember having to use one on old motor bikes that I occasionally had a spin on. If you didn't set it right it fired you up in the air when you used the kickstart!😀

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6 minutes ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Never drove a car with one, but remember having to use one on old motor bikes that I occasionally had a spin on. If you didn't set it right it fired you up in the air when you used the kickstart!😀

I had the heel kicked off my shoe once.

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I'm sure my dad has said, his first car, a 2CV had a starting handle. He always goes on about how simple things were. Not sure about advance/re-tart, but ignition system you could draw in a cigarette packet! Very simple dash, one Ammeter and that's it. He did have the optional extra, a speedo. Fuel level was checked with a dip-stick in the tank. Wipers were connected to speedo drive, faster you go, the faster they went, twist a knob to do it manually when stopped.

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8 minutes ago, Jim H said:

I'm sure my dad has said, his first car, a 2CV had a starting handle.

My first Ford (Cortina Mk 1) had one. Very handy for turning over the engine for servicing. Never needed to use it for starting though!

(Isn't it amazing that, whatever the topic, most threads end up wallowing in nostalgia!😀)

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I think we are going too much :offtopic: So getting back to the original subject.

There are fuel additives you can add to your tank to combat the effects of Ethanol. Millers do a few, not sure about other companies. Millersoil EPS  and Classic Sport CVLe plus their lead replacement VSPe. I used VSP in my Metro when 4* and LRP was discontinued.

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23 hours ago, cjay1 said:

It could be more than you think. 

"E10 test results
In our tests, the 89bhp Dacia Sandero struggled most, returning an 11.5% drop in mpg. That’s an extra cost of around £202 every 12,000 miles. The 99bhp Hyundai i30 was nearly as bad, managing 9.8% fewer miles on E10 than E0, an extra £16 a month"

hopefully the ecoboost won't be this bad

https://www.whatcar.com/news/what-car-e10-fuel-tests/n11430

 

Hopefully I’m not the only one thinking there is a typo here. As far as I’m aware all grades of petrol sold in the uk currently are E5 the move in September is for 95RON to move to E10 and 98RON to remain as an E5 alternative for a further 5 years. The move to E5 many years ago was pushed by the government as is the move to E10 currently. So where are these guys obtaining E0 petrol, if this is available is it not compliant with renewable fuels policy?

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4 hours ago, Aldridge Andy said:

Hopefully I’m not the only one thinking there is a typo here. As far as I’m aware all grades of petrol sold in the uk currently are E5 the move in September is for 95RON to move to E10 and 98RON to remain as an E5 alternative for a further 5 years. The move to E5 many years ago was pushed by the government as is the move to E10 currently. So where are these guys obtaining E0 petrol, if this is available is it not compliant with renewable fuels policy?

Yeah, that occurred to me at first but I don't think it is a typo. It is clear when you read the article that they really do mean E0, but why they chose to compare E10 with a product we can't even buy here, as opposed to E5, is beyond me. And as you say, where the heck did they get it? Not the most useful/helpful comparison test I've seen!😀

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Esso sell e0 in there super unleaded products.

I did read an American report on the 1.0 ecoboost that concluded when using E15 to boost the Ron to 98 the mpg penalty was only 1% despite having 5.6% less energy.  What they didn't do however was test a 98 Ron e0 fuel if standard E10 reduces economy by 11.5% and super e0 increases economy. it could be cost effective and environmentally sound to use e0 as net co2 per mile would be less.

The ecoboost is able to change its fuel management strategy based on octane thanks to its OAR (octane adjust ratio) system so the higher octane fuel returning better economy isn't a surprise.

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5 hours ago, cjay1 said:

Esso sell e0 in there super unleaded products.

Interesting, didn't realise that. Though apparently in certain areas (Devon, Cornwall, Teesside, NW England and Scotland according to Esso's website), it does contain ethanol. Confusing! Also confusing that there is officially no "E0" designation apparently: E5 covers 0-5% ethanol.

It would certainly be interesting to see a proper comparison between E10 and one of the "super" fuels (though possibly the What Car test was doing that? They didn't say what E0 fuel they were using.) Most tests up to now have concluded that, for most "normal" (as opposed to high performance cars), there's no real advantage to using "super" as opposed to the standard unleaded. 

I wonder if that will still be the case when E10 comes in.

It would be ironic if this supposedly "green" measure leads to an increase in usage of "super" grades, particularly if some of them contain no ethanol at all!😆

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Came across this article while looking around for more detail on E10. While obviously directed at riders of 2-stroke scooters (takes me back!) it does contain some interesting info:

https://scooterlab.uk/high-ethanol-content-fuel-will-it-kill-my-scooter-opinion/

 

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