3 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

... Managed to get a leg over ...

Always nice to get a leg over at the weekend... 

Thanks for confirming the handle situation, I still hadn't got round to testing mine.

Hadn't considered the problem of the battery charger thinking your battery was only 6 volt. Thinking about it now I suspect that will be the case with all "Smart" chargers. So really not that smart !!

Does your jump pack give a 12 volt output (without pressing override) when connected to the battery ? If so you could leave that connected at the same time as the Maypole which then might detect 12 volt.

This is beginning to look like battery replacement time 🙁

8 minutes ago, unofix said:

Thanks for confirming the handle situation, I still hadn't got round to testing mine.

Hadn't considered the problem of the battery charger thinking your battery was only 6 volt. Thinking about it now I suspect that will be the case with all "Smart" chargers. So really not that smart !!

Does your jump pack give a 12 volt output (without pressing override) when connected to the battery ? If so you could leave that connected at the same time as the Maypole which then might detect 12 volt.

This is beginning to look like battery replacement time 🙁

The jump pack doesn't provide any output without pressing the manual override unfortunately.  I may still try and jump the Mk2 later though.  If it jumps without anything breaking then I might risk it on the Mk4...  

To make things more interesting, it is now raining, so probably best not to try the jump pack right now.  

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

**Saturday Update**

Not in a state to lay across the seats this morning, so had to find an alternative method.  Managed to get a leg over the centre console and slide across into the passenger seat.  Slightly better for my digestive system...less so for my undercarriage.  

But more importantly, I can confirm there is absolutely no need to dismantle the bonnet lever.  The handle isn't bending at all.  There's more than enough space between the pillar and the door to open it.  As far as I can tell, this is just Fords idea of a joke!   

 

Maypole is a intuitive as ever though.   Stuck on 6v mode, regardless of how many times or for how long I press the button.  Doesn't appear to be charging either.  Will go and have a look after 30 mins to see if it's doing anything.

IIRC, the Maypole will stay in 6v mode until it detects that the battery is a 12v ( not sure how it determines that tbh) but I think it's in the instructions part 1 at the bottom of the page. 

59 minutes ago, Wino said:

IIRC, the Maypole will stay in 6v mode until it detects that the battery is a 12v ( not sure how it determines that tbh) but I think it's in the instructions part 1 at the bottom of the page. 

Yeah that's what the instructions say but Stephen said his has charged very low batteries before.

Also checked the instructions with mine and they are different to the PDF.  Does say it checks every 15-20 minutes before increasing ampage.

Anyway, I am, once again, in awe of the Noco GB40!  Fantastic piece of kit!

As suspected, the Maypole wasn't charging at all.  Just flashing a 'battery fault' symbol time I got back out there.

So removed that and tried the GB40 instead.  Pressed the manual override and heard solenoids whining and relays clicking.  Went to the passenger door and opened that keylessly, the mirrors unfolded at the same time.  Went round to the drives side, dash lit up etc, so thought I might as well try starting it.  Started first press of the button!!  Genuinely amazed how much power this little thing can push!

Gingerly switched off the GB40, expecting the engine to cut out, but it didn't.  Left it running for 30 mins.  (Did any of you know the engine shuts off after 30 mins of inactivity?).  Alternator was charging at 15v for the first 20 mins, then dropped to 14.5v.

10 mins after shutoff, the battery was still reading 12.4v.  Don't quite understand how I could have charged that much in 30 mins so presumably just residual that will drop further. 

Any bets on voltage reading in a couple of hours time?

 

On a slightly different note, I was surprised to see the oil life still at 100%.  (17 months old, 125 miles).  And the key battery warning came up!  Didn't think sleepy keys would drain the batteries that quickly.

 

2 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Anyway, I am, once again, in awe of the Noco GB40!  Fantastic piece of kit!

As suspected, the Maypole wasn't charging at all.  Just flashing a 'battery fault' symbol time I got back out there.

So removed that and tried the GB40 instead.  Pressed the manual override and heard solenoids whining and relays clicking.  Went to the passenger door and opened that keylessly, the mirrors unfolded at the same time.  Went round to the drives side, dash lit up etc, so thought I might as well try starting it.  Started first press of the button!!  Genuinely amazed how much power this little thing can push!

Gingerly switched off the GB40, expecting the engine to cut out, but it didn't.  Left it running for 30 mins.  (Did any of you know the engine shuts off after 30 mins of inactivity?).  

 

Yes, it's a tick box in the IPC 👍

2 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Yeah that's what the instructions say but Stephen said his has charged very low batteries before.

I fear I may have mislead you in that. I had a very low battery a while back, I charged it for a bit on a charger I bought in 1979, once at around 6v, I swapped to the MayPole. My old charger is dumb, it charges whatever it is connected to!

Well, I have no idea how, but the battery did charge from 2.2v to over 12v by idling for 30 minutes.  Was still at 12.2v after 3 hours left unlocked.  

Obviously the next test is to see if it holds that charge overnight.

 

In other news, the Mk2 1.6 TDCi did jump using the manual override, but it took 3 attempts.  Alternator charging at approx 15v.  Today's event have taken their toll so I couldn't leave that running for 30 mins.  Shut it off after about 15mins, but the battery didn't even have enough charge for the central locking.  So I suspect that battery is toast!

While the powerbank was outside I used that to top up the Golf battery.  One thing I don't understand though...when I plug the powerbank into the mains to recharge, its own display shows it taking 56 watts...but my electricity monitor shows it taking around 100 watts.  Any idea why?  Is it something to do with the AC to DC conversion?

Mine charged just off the alternator after going down to 3V. 

22 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

Mine charged just off the alternator after going down to 3V. 

In just 30 mins?  That must take more than the 3 amps shown on others Mk4s surely?  I never did get the Forscan app so couldn't watch charging amps unfortunately.

2 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

I'm just 30 mins?  That must take more than the 3amps shown on others Mk4s surely?  I never did get the Forscan app so couldn't watch charging amps unfortunately.

Probably about that. It can dump much more current in a flat battery than a partially charged one. I let mine run for a few mins then drove 15 and probably let it run about half an hour in total. It was high 11s low 12s iirc. Enough to start the engine again to get it to the garage next time. Don’t forget the last 10% of charge was probably enough to drop it from 10 to 2V very quickly.  It’s not linear below 11V. 

54 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

, its own display shows it taking 56 watts...but my electricity monitor shows it taking around 100 watts.  Any idea why?  Is it something to do with the AC to DC conversion?

Partly to do with the AC/DC rectification and also the considerable difference in the two voltages.

Power (W) = Volts X Amps  So if we assume the following values:

House voltage ~ 240V ac and the current been drawn by the GB40 unit is approx. 0.42A

240 x 0.42 = 100.8 Watts

If we were using old conventional transformer technology (Which these days we are not) then a step down transformer with a ratio of 17:1 would approximately give the follow:-

Recharging voltage of the GB40 will be ~ 14V dc and the current taken by the GB40 battery is ~ 4.0A

14 x 4.0 = 56 Watts

This is a simplified explanation and makes no adjustments for the affect caused to the voltage when AC is rectified to DC, but hopefully it gives an explanation as to why your two power meters show different values.

 

Thanks Unofix.

This is for the powerbank that I use to run the Maypole outside.  Anker Powerhouse 400 (400 watt hours). 

The extension lead through a first floor window just wasn't practical when I attempted it.

The GB40 only takes about 10w through USB.  No idea how many Wh's that holds though.

I'm still a bit confused...doesn't take much nowadays! . If I'm paying for 100w per hour to charge the power bank.  Am I then losing half of that rather than the full 100w being put into the appliance (Maypole in this case)?

 

**Sunday Update**

Battery voltage had dropped to 11.65v by 9am.   Still unlocked keylessly, but wouldn't lock keylessly. 

I've got to pump up the tyres in a bit (noisy machine so waiting to a more reasonable hour!) so will run the engine while doing that.  Hoping 11.65v will still be 'just' enough for it to start.

Do we reckon there's a battery drain or just normal for the Mk4?

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Battery voltage had dropped to 11.65v by 9am.

That's actually very good considering the small amount of time you were able to charge it.

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

Do we reckon there's a battery drain or just normal for the Mk4?

There will be a drain of around 60mA if normal service has been restored. The battery voltage settling back overnight is to be expected. If you can run the engine for another 30 minutes today it should help lift the SOC to 50% or better.

Gave it 15 mins running this morning.  (Waning stamina lol).  Alternator charging at ~15v for the whole time.  Hopefully it'll keep enough charge over the next week or so to at least start without being jumped again.  

Observations from the last few days -

1.  The Maypole won't even attempt to charge low batteries.

2.  Incremental charging is a waste of time & money due to the large volt drop overnight.

3. Only charge if you can leave the car alone.  Every time a door is opened or the car is locked/unlocked the volt drop confuses the Maypole.

4.  Give up with the charger.  Just jump it and run the engine instead.    Saves a lot of time & hassle.  And I suspect cheaper in petrol than electric for the same level of charge.

 

I did find one use for the Maypole though.  The 'new' battery I bought for the Golf has been sat in storage (outside in the boot, extremes of heat and cold) for 15 months.  Voltage read 12.4v this morning.  Put the Maypole on it, without any interruption as it's not connected to a car, and it completed the charging cycle in a 'brisk' 4 hours.  (Green backlight & 5 solid bars).

7 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Gave it 15 mins running this morning.  (Waning stamina lol).  Alternator charging at ~15v for the whole time.  Hopefully it'll keep enough charge over the next week or so to at least start without being jumped again.  

Observations from the last few days -

1.  The Maypole won't even attempt to charge low batteries.

2.  Incremental charging is a waste of time & money due to the large volt drop overnight.

3. Only charge if you can leave the car alone.  Every time a door is opened or the car is locked/unlocked the volt drop confuses the Maypole.

4.  Give up with the charger.  Just jump it and run the engine instead.    Saves a lot of time & hassle.  And I suspect cheaper in petrol than electric for the same level of charge.

 

I did find one use for the Maypole though.  The 'new' battery I bought for the Golf has been sat in storage (outside in the boot, extremes of heat and cold) for 15 months.  Voltage read 12.4v this morning.  Put the Maypole on it, without any interruption as it's not connected to a car, and it completed the charging cycle in a 'brisk' 4 hours.  (Green backlight & 5 solid bars).

I'm glad you have managed to get your car started without spending lots of money and pleased that you were feeling well enough to to do what you did.

I'm a bit late to the party because I've been away for the weekend, but I completely agree with what you said above, these are my thoughts too. To go back to an earlier post here are two side by side screenshots that I posted a while ago that give an Idea of what charging takes place when the Engine is running.

Both were taken when my Battery was fine, 65% SOC, which is where it sits a lot of the time because I don't do much mileage. 

The first one was taken 14 seconds after starting the car and showing a net Current of 21 Amps, it was a bit higher before but the Voltage at the BCM had not peaked yet, and the second one three minutes after starting on the same journey -  net Current 1 Amp although it is often more than that. 

If my Battery had less charge then I'm sure these figures would be a lot more, even after running for a while.

Sorry I missed the rest of this conversation or I would have said at the beginning , just push the override  button and start the car. 🤣🤣. We do it all the time with our GB jump packs . Not fried too many modules. 

11 hours ago, iantt said:

Sorry I missed the rest of this conversation or I would have said at the beginning , just push the override  button and start the car. 🤣🤣. We do it all the time with our GB jump packs . Not fried too many modules. 

Lol, I'm pretty sure you did say to jump it right at the start!   Though you also said it wouldn't charge from such low voltage so what do you know?  

Seriously though, I had remembered you'd said before about jumping new cars before PDI without too many issues.  I have seen a few fry modules on here and FB groups over the years though so would still urge caution for anyone else attempting it.

3 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Lol, I'm pretty sure you did say to jump it right at the start!   Though you also said it wouldn't charge from such low voltage so what do you know?  

Seriously though, I had remembered you'd said before about jumping new cars before PDI without too many issues.  I have seen a few fry modules on here and FB groups over the years though so would still urge caution for anyone else attempting it.

Yeah, what do I know. 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Just got my replacement fob batteries.  At £1.15 for two Panasonic thought I'd risk these!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/293648448433?

They arrived in 3 days and have a much longer date than the picture suggests!

Just tried them through from upstairs and both fobs still unlock & lock fine...which also means there's at least some charge still in the 12v battery as well. 

Old fob batteries both tested as 2.995 volts.  So it would seem sleepy fobs aren't totally asleep when stationary.  Just the actual 'unlock' part must be.

3 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Just got my replacement fob batteries.  At £1.15 for two Panasonic thought I'd risk these!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/293648448433?

They arrived in 3 days and have a much longer date than the picture suggests!

Just tried them through from upstairs and both fobs still unlock & lock fine...which also means there's at least some charge still in the 12v battery as well. 

Old fob batteries both tested as 2.995 volts.  So it would seem sleepy fobs aren't totally asleep when stationary.  Just the actual 'unlock' part must be.

Sleepy fobs still use power when not moving, it's just that they are not broadcasting the keyless signal.

They still need power to monitor the accelerometer for movement. The circuitry is still active, else it wouldn't know when it started moving 😉

10 minutes ago, alexp999 said:

Sleepy fobs still use power when not moving, it's just that they are not broadcasting the keyless signal.

They still need power to monitor the accelerometer for movement. The circuitry is still active, else it wouldn't know when it started moving 😉

Good point!

Still, 2 years doesn't seem long for fob batteries.  Must admit I've never owned a keyless car for more than 6 months before but these are the first fob batteries I've had to change in years.

This is weird.  TPMS has only updated on one side.  Is there any way to 'force' it to update without the suggested drive over 20mph?