at this discussion. I bet a Veyron, Reventon, F430, R8 et al are all a handful in this weather, doesn't mean that anyone wouldn't swap their Fiesta for them any other week of the year (decade? Century? Millennium?)

Anti BMW feeling has always confused me, I can only boil it down to jealousy in the end I think.

Certainly not jealousy. It's very much down to the fact that a large percentage (I don't mean everyone, Keith) of BMW drivers are a pain in the !Removed! on the roads. Granted, over the past two years or so a lot of these seem to have jumped ship to Audi, but there's still a high percentage who drive like four letter words. In my opinion I think it's down to ego. They're executive cars and half of the people that drive them don't even own them (I'm thinking back to one of my old regional managers - drove an Audi A4 and thought he was the most important guy in the world).

I can appreciate that some BM's are nice cars, but I can honestly say that I'd never want to own one. Same goes to Audi and, to a lesser extent, Merc. There are a lot of connotations that are associated with the stereotypical German saloon driver which, unfortunately, seem to ring true.

Well, I was watching the footy the other week and saw some Newcastle supporters with big fat bellies and no shirt on, so just presumed everyone from newcastle was like that, you know stereotypes an' all that. ;)

Can't really argue with that.

Chris that pictures awesome :P

A55 services?? haha

Certainly not jealousy. It's very much down to the fact that a large percentage (I don't mean everyone, Keith) of BMW drivers are a pain in the !Removed! on the roads. Granted, over the past two years or so a lot of these seem to have jumped ship to Audi, but there's still a high percentage who drive like four letter words. In my opinion I think it's down to ego. They're executive cars and half of the people that drive them don't even own them (I'm thinking back to one of my old regional managers - drove an Audi A4 and thought he was the most important guy in the world).

I can appreciate that some BM's are nice cars, but I can honestly say that I'd never want to own one. Same goes to Audi and, to a lesser extent, Merc. There are a lot of connotations that are associated with the stereotypical German saloon driver which, unfortunately, seem to ring true.

Listen, most of my replies were tongue in cheek, hence the ;)

You're reading forums or listening to Top gear too much. I drive on motorways every working day of my life and there are terrible drivers whether it be BMW, Audi's or Ford's, men, women, young, old, driving instructors ;) .

When I'm on the motorway, it tends to be the repmobiles who do the tailgating etc etc, not all, but a lot. Now these, in the main tend to be the TDi's of the various makes, VW's, BMW's, Audi, Ford etc etc, the ones who spend a lot of their time on the motorways and believe they own it. I'm not daft enough to think or even say that all reps are like this, in fact I'd go to say that the majority aren't, it's just you remember the tossers so to speak.

As for not wanting to own a BMW, Audi or Merc is quite unbelievable to be honest, especially if it's because what some delusional people on Top Gear or forums think. Those companies make some of the best quality cars on the road. I also guess you're not telling the truth. I own a Fiesta and a BMW, both great cars in their own right, but there's a reason why the Ford isn't in the same category as the BMW.

I mean, are you a chav because you drive a Fiesta? That's what people on other forums would say, just like some say on here about Corsa owners, didn't stop you buying a Fiesta though, did it?

to be honest, I'm a little too old to label people due to the car they own, I prefer to jusge them on how they drive, not what badge they have the bonnet. maybe it comes with age, maybe it doesn't.

Listen, most of my replies were tongue in cheek, hence the ;)

You're reading forums or listening to Top gear too much. I drive on motorways every working day of my life and there are terrible drivers whether it be BMW, Audi's or Ford's, men, women, young, old, driving instructors ;) .

When I'm on the motorway, it tends to be the repmobiles who do the tailgating etc etc, not all, but a lot. Now these, in the main tend to be the TDi's of the various makes, VW's, BMW's, Audi, Ford etc etc, the ones who spend a lot of their time on the motorways and believe they own it. I'm not daft enough to think or even say that all reps are like this, in fact I'd go to say that the majority aren't, it's just you remember the tossers so to speak.

As for not wanting to own a BMW, Audi or Merc is quite unbelievable to be honest, especially if it's because what some delusional people on Top Gear or forums think. Those companies make some of the best quality cars on the road. I also guess you're not telling the truth. I own a Fiesta and a BMW, both great cars in their own right, but there's a reason why the Ford isn't in the same category as the BMW.

I mean, are you a chav because you drive a Fiesta? That's what people on other forums would say, just like some say on here about Corsa owners, didn't stop you buying a Fiesta though, did it?

to be honest, I'm a little too old to label people due to the car they own, I prefer to jusge them on how they drive, not what badge they have the bonnet. maybe it comes with age, maybe it doesn't.

Wow, that was kind of patronising.

No, my views do not derive from anyone elses opinion, Top Gear or forums, they are derived from my own driving experiences.

Not wanting to own a BMW, Merc or Audi is perfectly believeable. If I had £40k+ to spend on a car I could guaranatee it would not be from any of those three manufacturers. Once again, these are opinions that are born from my own experiences and preferences.

Not for a second assuming there isn't bad drivers of small cars out there. I can tell you though if I'm ever being tailgated it's usually by a BM or Audi. No, that's not typecasting and no, that's not what Clarkson said. It's just what I've noticed from about the last five years or so of being on the roads.

Wow, that was kind of patronising.

I thought it was pretty true...

You're not Piggy in disguise are you?

Wow, that was kind of patronising.

No, my views do not derive from anyone elses opinion, Top Gear or forums, they are derived from my own driving experiences.

Not wanting to own a BMW, Merc or Audi is perfectly believeable. If I had £40k+ to spend on a car I could guaranatee it would not be from any of those three manufacturers. Once again, these are opinions that are born from my own experiences and preferences.

Not for a second assuming there isn't bad drivers of small cars out there. I can tell you though if I'm ever being tailgated it's usually by a BM or Audi. No, that's not typecasting and no, that's not what Clarkson said. It's just what I've noticed from about the last five years or so of being on the roads.

The reason I mentioned Top Gear is because you virtually said, word for word what a certain Mr Clarkson said. But hey, they haven't influenced you. :D

So, let me guess this right, you would spend £40k on an inferior product because you believe people of a certain type also drive these guys. :lol:

See to me, they are not the words of a sensible person.

The reason I mentioned Top Gear is because you virtually said, word for word what a certain Mr Clarkson said. But hey, they haven't influenced you. :D

So, let me guess this right, you would spend £40k on an inferior product because you believe people of a certain type also drive these guys. :lol:

See to me, they are not the words of a sensible person.

If I had £40k to spend, and being 16, I don't :P It would be on a Jag XF 3.0 V6 Diesel S.... Can't complain with 5.9 to 60 for a diesel :D Lovely inside aswell....

Listen, most of my replies were tongue in cheek, hence the ;)

You're reading forums or listening to Top gear too much. I drive on motorways every working day of my life and there are terrible drivers whether it be BMW, Audi's or Ford's, men, women, young, old, driving instructors ;) .

When I'm on the motorway, it tends to be the repmobiles who do the tailgating etc etc, not all, but a lot. Now these, in the main tend to be the TDi's of the various makes, VW's, BMW's, Audi, Ford etc etc, the ones who spend a lot of their time on the motorways and believe they own it. I'm not daft enough to think or even say that all reps are like this, in fact I'd go to say that the majority aren't, it's just you remember the tossers so to speak.

As for not wanting to own a BMW, Audi or Merc is quite unbelievable to be honest, especially if it's because what some delusional people on Top Gear or forums think. Those companies make some of the best quality cars on the road. I also guess you're not telling the truth. I own a Fiesta and a BMW, both great cars in their own right, but there's a reason why the Ford isn't in the same category as the BMW.

I mean, are you a chav because you drive a Fiesta? That's what people on other forums would say, just like some say on here about Corsa owners, didn't stop you buying a Fiesta though, did it?

to be honest, I'm a little too old to label people due to the car they own, I prefer to jusge them on how they drive, not what badge they have the bonnet. maybe it comes with age, maybe it doesn't.

The reason I mentioned Top Gear is because you virtually said, word for word what a certain Mr Clarkson said. But hey, they haven't influenced you. :D

So, let me guess this right, you would spend £40k on an inferior product because you believe people of a certain type also drive these guys. :lol:

See to me, they are not the words of a sensible person.

YAY!!! GO KEITH!!! YOU THE MAN KEITH!!! WOOOO!!!

also, in my opinion, we should consider Saab's as well because they seem to be pretty good quality cars too :)

The reason I mentioned Top Gear is because you virtually said, word for word what a certain Mr Clarkson said. But hey, they haven't influenced you. :D

So, let me guess this right, you would spend £40k on an inferior product because you believe people of a certain type also drive these guys. :lol:

See to me, they are not the words of a sensible person.

To be honest, I've only seen a few episodes of Top Gear on Dave, so no, they've not really influenced me. Why is it so hard to believe that I've formed my own opinion of this? Why would I need to rely on a T.V show to tell me what I see day-in, day-out?

You seem to think your opinion overrules all, assuming that for £40k BM's and Audi's are absolutely the best product you can buy. In my opinion this isn't true. If I had £40k I'd be much more inclined to buy something like a Lotus Exige because I like them.

Before I made that purchase I would, of course, have to consult the Top Gear website to make sure Jeremy likes that car. I can't like it unless he does...

@ Keith

Also, are you coming to the meet?

If I had £40k to spend, and being 16, I don't :P It would be on a Jag XF 3.0 V6 Diesel S.... Can't complain with 5.9 to 60 for a diesel :D Lovely inside aswell....

But you're 16 and don't know very much, so your opinion isn't really valid. ;)

To be honest, I've only seen a few episodes of Top Gear on Dave, so no, they've not really influenced me. Why is it so hard to believe that I've formed my own opinion of this? Why would I need to rely on a T.V show to tell me what I see day-in, day-out?

It's hard to believe because your opinion is a tabloidesque opinion and strangely mimics something a tabloidesque person said on a tongue in cheek car program and one which doesn't bear fruit to others who are actually driving out there as well. See, it's one of those urban myths that are perpetrated by people for reason's only they know.

You seem to think your opinion overrules all, assuming that for £40k BM's and Audi's are absolutely the best product you can buy. In my opinion this isn't true.

No I don't but what I would say is that my opinion is more inline with the majority than yours.

If I had £40k I'd be much more inclined to buy something like a Lotus Exige because I like them.

So, what you really mean is that you wouldn't buy a BMW, Merc or Audi because they don't make a track based car that suits your needs, which is totally different to what you implied earlier. Problem with the Exige and the reason why you don't see many on the road (same goes with Elise) is that they aren't very practical and not many people choose to spend £40k on a car that isn't practical and are not very good for everyday driving.

Before I made that purchase I would, of course, have to consult the Top Gear website to make sure Jeremy likes that car. I can't like it unless he does...

I wouldn't if I was you, you see, they (Top Gear) tend to tell porkies to suit their entertainment needs and don't really offer that much good advise on car purchases.

@ Keith

Also, are you coming to the meet?

Watford Gap in the Fiesta? How much time do you think I have on my hands. ;)

Nah mate, I won't be going, just too much on at home and work etc.

YAY!!! GO KEITH!!! :D

YAY!!! GO KEITH!!! YOU THE MAN KEITH!!! WOOOO!!!

Keith, I am going to nominate you for FOC member of the year 2010

Keith, I am going to nominate you for FOC member of the year 2010

I wish you'd have waited another 11 months and a few days, I might have had a chance of winning it.

I think you're just taking the Michael now, or is that Mii.. ah well, whatever it is, I've big shoulders and a baldie head, bring it on. :P

Oh excellent, another arguement!

Oh excellent, another arguement!

Banter Flic! Have you never been up north? :P

Oh excellent, another arguement!

If we all agreed, life would be so boring and every Fiesta on the road would be the same colour as yours and then you would be so unhappy. :P

Banter Flic! Have you never been up north? :P

I know what banter is, yes.

I'm quite serious Keith. In almost a year on the forum you remain unbeaten! You truely are an inspiration to all FOC members. It's true

Also, if "Championship Manager 2010" is in the shops (whatever the hell that is), then I think we can say that you are "FOC member of the year 2010"

FOR SURE

Banter Flic! Have you never been up north? :P

It's what it's all about, especially if you're like me and work in a factory environment where you daren't do owt without the fear of having the poo ripped out of you.

This is how my little Fezzy ended up ha. I dug it out this morning!

I'm quite serious Keith. In almost a year on the forum you remain unbeaten! You truely are an inspiration to all FOC members. It's true

Also, if "Championship Manager 2010" is in the shops (whatever the hell that is), then I think we can say that you are "FOC member of the year 2010"

FOR SURE

Well, what can I say, I'm humbled.

firstly I would like to thank the wife, without her none of this could have happened, oh and me mam and I suppose me dad as well, they had a big part in it as well. It wasn't a threesome mind, my wife never knew me mam and dad until she met me, I'm sure you know what I mean.

Secondly, and more importantly, I would like to thank Jonny for nominating me and accepting the 34 bribes I have sent him over the last 4 months. Brings a tear to my eyes and a lump in my throat, the first one anyway, think the second was one of the wife's dumplings. That's not a metaphor by the way, really, I'm having beef stew and dumplings for tea.

I just hope I can carry the mantle through 2010 and pass it on to a worthy recipient in 2011.

God bless you all.

EXCELLENT NEWS!!!

Keith, you are indeed a worthy recipient of the FOC member of the year award

:):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):)

I think you're just taking the Michael now, or is that Mii.. ah well, whatever it is, I've big shoulders and a baldie head, bring it on. :P

booyeah, a mention!

EXCELLENT NEWS!!!

Keith, you are indeed a worthy recipient of the FOC member of the year award

:):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):)

buttmunch!