2.0 Ecoblue 8-speed auto, low revs vibrations

[MarkoSI]

I am new to the forum, I live in Slovenia. I have a 2019 S-Max Vignale, 190hp Ecoblue diesel with 8-speed autobox, AWD.

I've bought the Vignale spec because Ford advertises extreme cabin silence and overall peaceful driving experience. I got my car 2 months ago, imported it from Germany with 41.000km, because there is no way I could get a new one (global chip shortage). 

Immediately, car is a total disappointment. The amount of vibrations through steering wheel, and cabin resonance at low revs (1000-1300) is just ridiculous. Car hangs there ALL THE TIME because of the long gear ratios. Only when you reach 95km/h you are finally out of the vibration zone. When the engine is cold is even worse. S-mode doesn't help because then you are over 2k revs all the time, engine becomes to noisy at low speed. Manual options doesn't exist. Another thing, when temperature is under 4-5C you get massive slip from gearbox who is trying to warm up the oil as fast as possible. Idiotic software allows engine to rev up to 3000 revs when going slightly uphill but when going downhill it's not even in the gear and engine has around 900rpm. This ends (for me) after 2-4km, depends how cold it is and then it lock gears as expected.

I had it checked by the Ford dealer but in the end, what I have as an official diagnose is, all Ecoblue 8speed-autobox vibrates/resonates and the tolerance how bad is it is subjective. I've tested one with 120k km on the clock (titanium), even worse then mine. Before I've purchased mine I've tested ST-Line with the same engine/gearbox combination, 7000km on the clock. I do remember some speed areas with vibrations caused by revs to low but not as much as I have it now in mine. Worst part is when you are coming to a roundabout and you don't brake. Gearbox won't downshift until it reaches 900rpm. It feels like the engine is just on the edge of cutingout. 

Even when the car is stationary I feel vibrations through the whole car, rearview mirror doesn't have clear picture because of vibrations. All of that makes it (for me) untorelable for city and B-roads driving.

As I said this problem was diagnosed as my subjective observation and there is nothing wrong with the car. I've asked 3 friends to have a test drive, everyone recognized the vibrations.

I can't find other Vignale or even Ecoblue owners in Slovenija, we are very small market. 90% of the current S-Max's on the road are not ecoblue ones and with Powershifts (2015-2018).

My question to all Ecoblue owners is: Do you feel the same as I do? Especially those who have Vignale spec.

If this is the best Vignale division can do... I would fire every single person involved in design of the car. I've measured cabin noise and it's just a bit better than my old S-Max Titanium. Active Noise Canceling, special sound proof glass... pointless if the whole car rattles!

[unofix]

I have a Focus MK4 2.0 diesel automatic. When it is cold and just at idle (about 680RPM) there is a slight vibration. As soon as the RPM goes above 720 the vibration is gone and the car is very quiet.

[colonelwai]

Maybe the car was damaged in a collusion. I live in The Netherlands and I have seen some imported cars from Germany were actually not accidental free... They fix the cars and export them. 

[MarkoSI]

@colonelwai: I was thinking in the same directon. Car was not first exported and then sold, it was for sale in Germany (official Ford dealer) for DE market. Previous owner was one of the employees of that Ford dealership. At least that is what they told me.

No more ecoblue s-max owners on this forum? I hoped there will be at least 5-10 owners of that engine available.

 

[DaveT70]

Hi, Try asking the same question on the Kuga, Mondeo and Galaxy forums as it's the same engine transmission set up.

Slip on warm up is quite normal as the transmission is protecting itself from damage until the fluid is warm, it should last no more than 5 miles (8KM). It's the torque convertor slipping, not the clutches.

Is the quality of Diesel fuel in your country any good? Poor quality Diesel can affect running conditions and NVH performance, especially at idle.

I would be tempted to get the fluid level and condition checked in the transmission and change if necessary.

I would be tempted to check the engine oil is of the correct grade and change if necessary.

I would try different Diesel fuel brands and grades to see if that helps.

I would ask your local Ford dealer to update the software in the PCM and TCM and to reset the adaptive learning strategy in the TCM

[Paulius55]

Interesting, I have a 2018 2.0Tdci 150 Titanium S-Max with 6-speed powershift and it is impressively smooth and quiet compared to other diesels I have owned. 

[MarkoSI]

oil used is 0w20. At least that is marked on the last service label.

I’ve tried different diesel (premium, regular), no effect.

Gearbox module was reset so it should learn my driving style. No effect.

Not sure about oil level in the gearbox. Vibrations are coming from the engine. If you go through the rev range (P, D or N) you can feel it right after 1000 and it ends just below 1500 marker. I think it is poor design of engine mounts, maybe bad quality ruber is used.

Talking from practical experiences of driving 10s of different 4 cylinder diesels, they all vibrate under 1500revs, it get worse with smaller ones (1.6, 1.4).

Only option to eliminate vibrations is to cushion them out with good engine mounts and keep the engine in correct rev range. 
When we add ecology and emission in to the equation we end up with this sort of a products, forcing low revs and pathetic ride experience.

 

[unofix]

5 hours ago, MarkoSI said:

Oil used is 0w20.

Is that correct ?

I thought it was 5W20 for the Focus Mk4 Diesel

[MarkoSI]

I’ve checked with google and for ecoblue it should be 0w20. 
 

[unofix]

Just rechecked myself. There seems to be 3 different oils listed by Ford for the Ecoblue engines. Seems to depend on if it is a 1,5L or a 2.0L and if it was built before or after January 2019.

Listed are: 0W20,  5W20,  5W30. Information seems very unclear. For my 2.0L built after January 2019 it looks like 5W20, but to be honest I'm no longer sure myself.

[MarkRS9]

My 2.0D August 2019 build uses 0w30 oil to WSS-M2C950-A spec.

[Alexis94040]

On 2/3/2022 at 10:39 AM, MarkoSI said:

I’ve checked with google and for ecoblue it should be 0w20. 
 

Mine gets 0W-20 as recommended at the manual and as it is written below my bonnet with a yellow sticker if i remember well (Ford Castrol Magnatec WSS-M2C952-A1).

Mine vibrates also but smoothly at idle when it is warm enough without rising or affecting in general the idling RPM, after a long and hard trip, especially at the greek HOT summers...

I am afraid that the main issue belongs to the EGR Valve..

EGR and DPF are the cancer of the diesels...

[MarkoSI]

Do any of you, autobox owners, experince a very noticeable drop in revs when car is stationary, in Drive and a/c compressor kicks in?

I am again shocked how noticeable this is in a car with list price of 55k€.

My other car (suzuki vitara 1.4T, auto), you can hear a very loud “click” but no impact on revs. No feeling that car just manage to prevent stalling. 

[filo18]

@MarcoSI podarilo sa ti tento problem nejako vyriesit?

[MarkoSI]

On 11/2/2023 at 12:12 AM, filo18 said:

@MarcoSI podarilo sa ti tento problem nejako vyriesit?

Yes, I sold the car to the first willing buyer. 4k loss in 9months.

I've bought 2007 2.5T S-max which costs me less then I would loose just in depreciation alone in last year keeping the 2019 Vignale. And there are no vibrations at any revs! Thumbs up for old(er) cars.

Another interesting fact about "new models". In Vignale (with Active Noise Canceling) I've measured 67-68dB at 140km/h. 16 year old 2.5T titanium (178k km it says on the clock), with no history, old door seals & doors removed for repairs at least once in a lifetime, original engine mounts & exhaust, 68-69dB at same speed. I am pretty sure, when new, this car was quieter than Vignale. If you remove touch screen features, apple/android connectivity & other apps, we are going backwards for the last 10-15years in terms of car development.

[Adam_P]

I have a 2019 S-max with the same parameters, but Titanium. I am the first owner. I haven't noticed any vibration problems.
Just those annoying gearbox warm-ups.