PCV valve gone?

[caffeinehigh]

Hi guys, just in need of a little advice. I have a 2007 Focus 1.8 MK2 that is getting through a fair bit of oil (about 1L per month doing a small amount of miles). After some reading I read this could be the PCV valve, I have bought the part but not got around to fitting yet. According to YouTube its a pain in the ***** to get the intake off for access so I've not tackled it yet. Anyway today I was having a nosey in the engine bay and noticed oil in spark plug #2 socket. So presumably the rocker gasket has gone. Just wondering if it is likely to just be the gasket causing the problem or if it and the PCV could be connected? 

Other symptoms which could be of no connection are that when you take the fuel cap off there is a large whoosh of air. 

[wilto]

I got the same issue as you, if you read my post titled "snake oil or Teraclean" that I posted last night.

I have read that the 1.8 Duratec engine suffers from gummed up oil control rings, therefore letting a small amount of oil past them an into the combustion chamber. 

I to was thinking of replacing the PCV valve myself, but then read about the rings, I have been advised by my mate to try an engine flush that I added a link to. 

I think the PCV valve is hidden behind the oil separator at the lower left corner of the engine, behind the inlet manifold

[caffeinehigh]

That's quite interesting I will take a look at your thread. I've also read about the gummed up rings problem but haven't investigated that thought too much yet. I will probably tackle the PCV valve, hose and rocker gasket first since they are all quite cheap parts. If that doesn't cure it I'll look at a flush. 

[wilto]

1 hour ago, caffeinehigh said:

That's quite interesting I will take a look at your thread. I've also read about the gummed up rings problem but haven't investigated that thought too much yet. I will probably tackle the PCV valve, hose and rocker gasket first since they are all quite cheap parts. If that doesn't cure it I'll look at a flush. 

Let me know personally how you get on with those, been as we both have the same issue, and I'll try the engine flush ok, cheers pal 👍

[caffeinehigh]

Yep no worries I'll let you know if I get it sorted. Might be worth having a look in your spark plug sockets see if you have the same sign as me. This is what my #2 spark plug socket looks like. 

[Tdci-Peter]

On 01/05/2017 at 9:37 PM, caffeinehigh said:

noticed oil in spark plug #2 socket. So presumably the rocker gasket has gone. Just wondering if it is likely to just be the gasket causing the problem or if it and the PCV could be connected? 

There is a possible connection. If the engine is positively pressurised, as it could be if the PCV is blocked, then oil will get forced through the cam cover gasket.

On my last car (Vauxhall!), the crankcase ventilation hose got kinked & blocked after a CH gasket change. Most of the oil in the engine got pumped out of the engine via this gasket, all over the road! Yours can not be that bad, but it is possible.

Pressurising the engine may also increase oil loss via the piston rings.

Try putting a sheet of card over the oil filler hole, with the engine idling, or revved up a bit. It should be pulled down to the hole, not blown away. (It needs to be stiff enough not to be sucked into the engine!, but light enough to feel small pressures.)

The PCV is supposed to keep the crankcase pressure just a bit below atmospheric.

[caffeinehigh]

Thanks for the reply Peter. I've just tried out your suggestion and the card gets blown off quite heavily. So I guess something is blocked. I have the new PCV valve just waiting for the PCV hose to turn up as thought I might as well replace them both. Hopefully get it and the rocker gasket all changed next weekend.

[wilto]

 

On 2017-5-3 at 0:20 AM, Tdci-Peter said:

 

Try putting a sheet of card over the oil filler hole, with the engine idling, or revved up a bit. It should be pulled down to the hole, not blown away. (It needs to be stiff enough not to be sucked into the engine!, but light enough to feel small pressures.)

The PCV is supposed to keep the crankcase pressure just a bit below atmospheric.

Haven't tried the cardboard yet but put my hand over the oil filler, and it was puffing quite a bit of pressure, almost like putting your hand over an exhaust pipe, and the palm of my hand was quite oily as well, do you think my PCV is knackered Peter ?

[Tdci-Peter]

2 hours ago, wilto said:

and it was puffing quite a bit of pressure, almost like putting your hand over an exhaust pipe, and the palm of my hand was quite oily as well,

That could be normal. There are pressure fluctuations as the pistons move, and by hand, the outward pressure waves feel bigger than the suctions. That is why you have to use a method that will reasonably well seal the filler cap hole, to allow the pcv to work and build up the suction. Then it should require a small pull to remove the cover from the cap hole.

An oil mist is always present inside the cam cover when running, so again that can be normal.

Gummed up oil control or compression rings on the pistons are likely to lead to smoke, especially just after a period of over-run (eg. throttle closed downhill or slowing down), as the inlet vacuum draws oil up past the pistons.

On an older 1.8CVH (in a Sierra), I had high oil consumption. I suspected valve seals, and had them changed. This was quite easy on the CVH engine, no need to remove the head. This gave a little improvement. But then over about 6 months, oil consumption steadily dropped to hardly any need to top up between changes. I assume that once the oil stopped entering the combustion chamber, the detergents in the petrol slowly freed up the rings.

I think I would have a good look at the oil separator, check the oil can drain back to the sump ok, clean up the hoses from separator & pcv to the inlet manifold, then try to see how much blow-by gas and oil was getting into the inlet manifold.

That is the trouble, it is all a bit circular, oil in the inlet can be due to faulty pcv, blocked separator, or excess blow-by, this oil in the inlet tends to gum up rings, this increases blow-by ....

If my experience is anything to go by, breaking this circle, and reducing oil entering the combustion chamber, can free up the rings and get back to good, low oil consumption. A cleaner additive might help do this, but not if there is an underlying cause like faulty pcv, or blocked oil separator.

[JONATHAN_11_80]

I have a 2010 ford focus 1.8 zetec s coming up for 70,000 it uses a little oil but nothing to bad so far.  I change my oil every 5000 miles and use good fuels so hopefully this will reduce the chance of the rings gumming up.  Out of interest how much oil do your cars use.

[caffeinehigh]

3 hours ago, JONATHAN_11_80 said:

I have a 2010 ford focus 1.8 zetec s coming up for 70,000 it uses a little oil but nothing to bad so far.  I change my oil every 5000 miles and use good fuels so hopefully this will reduce the chance of the rings gumming up.  Out of interest how much oil do your cars use.

I'm getting through about a litre per month. I live fairly close to work too so I don't do a lot of miles in that time either.

[JONATHAN_11_80]

Sounds like its using quite a bit of oil.  I would change the pcv and check the breather pipes.  Put some forte engine flush in the engine and let it idle for half an hour and then change the oil and filter. I would also recommend forte gas treatment which goes in the fuel tank.    If you have sticky rings this should help or resolve the problem.

[wilto]

1 hour ago, JONATHAN_11_80 said:

Sounds like its using quite a bit of oil.  I would change the pcv and check the breather pipes.  Put some forte engine flush in the engine and let it idle for half an hour and then change the oil and filter. I would also recommend forte gas treatment which goes in the fuel tank.    If you have sticky rings this should help or resolve the problem.

I've been recommended this Forte engine flush, is it as good as the reviews on amazon suggest, I've also been told by another member on here of another similar product called BG 109 from American.

[JONATHAN_11_80]

Yeah its very good stuff its only available to the trade so you might have to visit your local garage.  Wasn't aware it was on eBay.  Its gotta be worth ago to try and sort your oil consumption.

[caffeinehigh]

Bit of an update. Just changed the PCV, hose and rocker cover. The PCV still rattled when shook which I read means it's still good? The hose was a bit cracked and old but it didn't look like any of the cracks had gone through. So I'm leaning towards this might not have been my problem. Any of you guys know where the breather pipes are? 

I'm going to drop in some of the forte flush next week too and see. The flaps on the intake were quite gunked up. As was the metal bit the air filter connects to, forget it's name now.

One other thing I noticed is there seemed to be a bit of oil in the very bottom of the air box.

[wilto]

Was the inlet manifold a pain in ***** to get off, I've looked on YouTube at a video and it doesn't look pleasant at all. Also do you have the part number of the PCV and where you had it from please.

[caffeinehigh]

I watched this video and thought it was going to be harder than it was. To be honest we seemed to have more trouble disconnecting all the sensors and cabling than unbolting the manifold its self. Some of the bolts were a bit fiddly but with a range of socket extensions it was fine. I'd say within about 3 hours we had manifold off, PCV and hose changed, rocker cover gasket changed and manifold back on again and that included a stop for a brew and a bit of faffing about trying to remember where one of the pipes went back on.

I can't remember the part number but I get things from Ford Parts UK. I usually email them with my Reg number and they confirm which one it is on their site.

[caffeinehigh]

Forte engine flush and a new oil filter on the way. Going to give it a flush this weekend. If that doesn't sort it I'm stumped. Saying that oil use seems to be down the last few weeks. No idea why. Still using more than it should though. Only thing different is I started filling up at Shell. Doubt that would make a difference though.

[Tom46201]

I know that the last post was a couple of years ago but did the pcv valve and pipe cure the problem ? How good was the Forte engine flush? I have an 05 C-Max exhibiting the same problem and am looking for solutions.

[FatHead1979]

On 3/29/2019 at 3:17 PM, Tom46201 said:

I know that the last post was a couple of years ago but did the pcv valve and pipe cure the problem ? How good was the Forte engine flush? I have an 05 C-Max exhibiting the same problem and am looking for solutions.

Used BG109 flush on my wife's MK2.5 1.8 Duratec last year because it was drinking oil (about 0.75 litres per month), amazingly the oil level doesn't seem to have budged since then.  I've also heard good things about the Forte flush.  For the sake of £15(ish) and doing an oil/filter change (which never hurts) it got to be worth a punt, especially when you factor in the cost of decent oil to keep topping up.

[Bar72]

I'm using 1 litre per 1000 miles with mine and have an intermittent misfire at 2-2,500rpm in 5th when I press the pedal to overtake.  Checked coil packs and replaced plugs today, while noticing the rocker cover gasket is away so I think I'll try the card on the oil filler trick in the morning and see what's happening there.  If there's suction from oil filler hole / card on top can I assume PCV OK and it's possibly sticking rings? so I'll then proceed with an engine flush before doing the PCV / Seperator / Hose?

No problems idling when cold or hot and computer reading 40+ mpg  thanks in advance.